The European - Pay or not toupee

It’s that time of year again.
It’s the time of year when I approach my employer to ask for time off to attend the European Brass Band Championships. Of course, they say ‘yes’ (thank you Blaenau Gwent!), but it’s always ‘without pay’, which, for a contest that starts on a Friday, means two days off without pay (I can forget the solo events, then!!).
My question every year is whether the event should be classified as ‘representing your country’. I’ve brought it up with our personnel department and if it was sporting honours, the rules are clear; time off with pay. However, banding, as near as dammit to sport as it is, lies in a ‘grey area’ and my LEA don’t pay us for grey areas!
I was wondering if anyone on the forum has had experience of this, or if there’s a precedent elsewhere?
 

brassneck

Active Member
As you said, it is a grey area and the choice is with the employer whether the activity is considered important enough to warrant paid time off. At my work, one of my colleagues represented Scotland in an international Scrabble competition last weekend in London. She had to organise holidays in advance to get the time off, otherwise she wouldn't have made the event.
 

Bayerd

Active Member
It’s that time of year again.
It’s the time of year when I approach my employer to ask for time off to attend the European Brass Band Championships. Of course, they say ‘yes’ (thank you Blaenau Gwent!), but it’s always ‘without pay’, which, for a contest that starts on a Friday, means two days off without pay (I can forget the solo events, then!!).
My question every year is whether the event should be classified as ‘representing your country’. I’ve brought it up with our personnel department and if it was sporting honours, the rules are clear; time off with pay. However, banding, as near as dammit to sport as it is, lies in a ‘grey area’ and my LEA don’t pay us for grey areas!
I was wondering if anyone on the forum has had experience of this, or if there’s a precedent elsewhere?

Simple, stop working for the LEA.

Ooh, on second thoughts, then you'd have to give up your 6 week summer holidays . Now that wouldn't do. BACK TO WORK! (& stop moaning!).
 

Bones

Member
Simple, stop working for the LEA.

Ooh, on second thoughts, then you'd have to give up your 6 week summer holidays . Now that wouldn't do. BACK TO WORK! (& stop moaning!).

Too true.

I'd give a kidney to play at Euros'. Mind you I'd only do it once.

Chris, noone doubts your commitment to banding, and you are a fab player, but the opportunity to do the Euro's is one that is out of the reach of a lot of people on this forum. And yes I think it stinks that the LEA do not accept your involvement in banding as worthy of a day off, but ifyou want to do banding at your level, how much is it worth to you.....


PS pull a sicky...........
 
Simple, stop working for the LEA.

Ooh, on second thoughts, then you'd have to give up your 6 week summer holidays . Now that wouldn't do. BACK TO WORK! (& stop moaning!).

I forgot just how lucky I am. Silly me. Don't forget the other 6 weeks we get sprinkled through the year.

The great ideas are flooding in. Keep 'em coming!
 

Ooh Aah

New Member
Don't know how Cory works but we paid all but £50 of the 3 nights accomodation when we played in Belfast. A small price to pay for the honour of playing at the Europeans. Oh, and the days off were from my annual leave but would have taken unpaid if required.

Come on Chris, be thankfull for what you have!
 
Come on Chris, be thankfull for what you have!

I'm VERY thankful for what I have, believe me!

I was hoping to start a little debate about the relative merits of banding and sport in the eyes of the establishment, not to have a whine about how terribly difficult my little life is.

I can see that I've come to the wrong place.
 

AndyCat

Active Member
I work in a school, and for every European, and Albert Hall National Finals for that matter, they've given me time off with pay, or I could build up time in lieu. We also have a member of the GB shooting tean here, who gets the same.
I did however have to write reports for the governors and do an article for the school newsletter, but very fair as I see it!

Andy
 

brassbandmaestro

Active Member
You've a very good employer AndyCat. I always have to make sure, either build up time in lieu, or take a couple of a/l days, unfortunately!!
 

horn1

Member
Too true.

I'd give a kidney to play at Euros'. Mind you I'd only do it once.

Chris, noone doubts your commitment to banding, and you are a fab player, but the opportunity to do the Euro's is one that is out of the reach of a lot of people on this forum. And yes I think it stinks that the LEA do not accept your involvement in banding as worthy of a day off, but ifyou want to do banding at your level, how much is it worth to you.....


PS pull a sicky...........

you might struggle with that Rich, seeing as you've only got one kidney ;-)
 
Hi!
In Eikanger every player will have to pay around 350 pounds to go to the Euro but we can take time off from work with pay.

What would you choose? ;)

All the best for the Euros.

Frode
Sop
Eikanger
 
Good grief, Frode - I bet this thread smelled really bad when you exhumed it!!

I've just bought your 'Riffs & Interludes' - what a performance!

Chris.
 

brassbandmaestro

Active Member
Ive never seen this thread before! Saying that ooops, 03/03/08, well there we go! EBM always produces good results, fair play to them. Yes and get payed time off work, hmm, I doubt wether that would happen in this country. You would have to get annual leave as part and parcel. £350 expensive for a weekend. unless the band makes a holiday out of it.
 

Phil Green

Supporting Member
Hi Chris,

I can't remember which contest it was(US, Dutch, French Open or our tour of Finland) but the Chaiman of the band wrote to the Headmasters of where we had teachers - explaining the importance of representing the UK in the particular event. I think this worked well for as far as I can remember even schools that had previously refused leave (even unpaid) reacted positively allowing all teachers paid time off.

You could give this a try?
 

HBB

Active Member
Ive never seen this thread before! Saying that ooops, 03/03/08, well there we go! EBM always produces good results, fair play to them. Yes and get payed time off work, hmm, I doubt wether that would happen in this country. You would have to get annual leave as part and parcel. £350 expensive for a weekend. unless the band makes a holiday out of it.

What the hell are you talking about? You make Ian Perks look truly sensible.
 

brassbandmaestro

Active Member
I was saying that I would not think that employers in this country would let their staff have extra time off to play at the europeans! Quite simple really.

Also, I had mentioned the fact that the fare of £350 was rather expensive, for people to travel.

Eikanger nearly always produces good reulsts at this competition.

Maybe if I structured it in paragraphs as opposed to all in one block posting, perhaps that would have made it a lot clearer for people to see what I was trying to say.
 
I've just bought your 'Riffs & Interludes' - what a performance!

Chris.

Thanks. :)

Regarding time off with pay, the norwegian band federation has worked some years to get cultural representatives the same deal as the sports representatives and it was changed in 2008.

Before that the employers could choose if they wanted to pay you or not. Normally (99%) they would give you time off with pay if you told them the deal for sports representatives.

Eikanger travel from thursday to monday the euro-weekend.
And the players pay approx 1/3 of the total cost.

Frode
 

Bones

Member
Good grief, Frode - I bet this thread smelled really bad when you exhumed it!!

I've just bought your 'Riffs & Interludes' - what a performance!

Chris.


Hi Chris,

THis is my fault for resurrecting your excellent thread. As you can see from post number 5, I made a flippant comment back in March stating that I would be willing to give a kidney to play at the Euros.

Only last month I was told I only have one anyway, I felt it was pretty ironic and appealed to my perverse english sense of humour.

Sorry to hijack your thread.....

Cheers

Rich
 
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