Re:B & R concert - Does this....

Is the banding world too backward looking?


  • Total voters
    26

KLL

New Member
B & R are a very very good band. n the sop player Alan is brill and the best sop player in the world :D
 

Humphrey

Member
cornetchap said:
This could be applied to films, books, plays, whatever. I recently read part of a book by Charlie Higson. I stopped reading it when I got to a point that didn't agree with me and will not read another Higson book as a result. That's an informed choice that I've made myself.

Composers will always find people who like their music and those that don't, same as writers, playwrites and artists. Don't knock people for not liking something that you do and voting with their feet. (Only knock them if they do it inappropriately :) )
There is an argument that says if you had read to the end of the book your choice would be more informed. Are you, on the part you did read prepared to tell us all it was a "load of rubbish" or "if that Charlie Higson thinks he's a wonderful writer, I'll get a job writing"?
I'm sorry to appear flippant but thats what most people are objecting to. Not the "floral dance" brigade. Their walkout was inappropriate but understandable in a way. Those members of other brass bands who choose to review the B&R (or any other) concert in terms similar to those I've parodied here are another matter.
 

cornetchap

Member
Humphrey said:
cornetchap said:
This could be applied to films, books, plays, whatever. I recently read part of a book by Charlie Higson. I stopped reading it when I got to a point that didn't agree with me and will not read another Higson book as a result. That's an informed choice that I've made myself.
There is an argument that says if you had read to the end of the book your choice would be more informed. Are you, on the part you did read prepared to tell us all it was a "load of rubbish" or "if that Charlie Higson thinks he's a wonderful writer, I'll get a job writing"?

No. In fact, up to the point I stopped reading it I'd quite enjoyed it. It may have been better beyond the point I didn't like, but equally it could have got a lot worse so I choose to stop where I did. Similarly, I would imagine, those that decided they hadn't liked what they'd heard and left felt that they weren't going to enjoy the rest of the concert. They may have liked what was to come, they may have felt it was less enjoyable than what they'd already heard. The point is, they chose to leave on the basis of their experience. At the end of the day music is highly subjective and is all about personal choice. What you choose to listen may not be what I would choose to listen to.
 

WoodenFlugel

Moderator
Staff member
cornetchap said:
Humphrey said:
cornetchap said:
This could be applied to films, books, plays, whatever. I recently read part of a book by Charlie Higson. I stopped reading it when I got to a point that didn't agree with me and will not read another Higson book as a result. That's an informed choice that I've made myself.
There is an argument that says if you had read to the end of the book your choice would be more informed. Are you, on the part you did read prepared to tell us all it was a "load of rubbish" or "if that Charlie Higson thinks he's a wonderful writer, I'll get a job writing"?

No. In fact, up to the point I stopped reading it I'd quite enjoyed it. It may have been better beyond the point I didn't like, but equally it could have got a lot worse so I choose to stop where I did. Similarly, I would imagine, those that decided they hadn't liked what they'd heard and left felt that they weren't going to enjoy the rest of the concert. They may have liked what was to come, they may have felt it was less enjoyable than what they'd already heard. The point is, they chose to leave on the basis of their experience. At the end of the day music is highly subjective and is all about personal choice. What you choose to listen may not be what I would choose to listen to.

You make a good point here cornetchap, and one in which I partially agree on, but there is a big difference between stopping reading a book and doing the same in a live or public event. If you stop reading a book because you disagree with it's sentiment, or just get fed up with it, or whatever, then no-one is going to be that put out by that. To walk out in the middle of a piece in a concert, or in the middle of an act in a play shows a complete lack of respect for the performers, and the other members of the audience who might actually be enjoying it. I for one wouldn't like to have to stand up to let someone out of their seat just because they have decided that their time is too important to them to sit for another 10-15 minutes until a reasonable time to leave comes around. And that is regardless of whether I myself was enjoying the performance or not.
 

Humphrey

Member
cornetchap said:
.......up to the point I stopped reading it I'd quite enjoyed it. It may have been better beyond the point I didn't like, but equally it could have got a lot worse so I choose to stop where I did. Similarly, I would imagine, those that decided they hadn't liked what they'd heard and left felt that they weren't going to enjoy the rest of the concert. They may have liked what was to come, they may have felt it was less enjoyable than what they'd already heard. The point is, they chose to leave on the basis of their experience. At the end of the day music is highly subjective and is all about personal choice. What you choose to listen may not be what I would choose to listen to.

I agree with you as I did in my last post. I am not knocking people for disliking music that I like or voting with their feet. I am knocking them for doing so inappropriately. As I tried to explain my problem is with the language of fellow brass band musicians. To criticise is one thing and we are all entitled to our opinion but if we use insulting descriptions we maybe shouldn't be surprised if our target feels insulted. Once again I'm not knocking them for disliking the music I like and saying so but I'm knocking them for doing so inappropriately.
 

johnflugel

Active Member
Okiedokie of Oz said:
I am in complete disagreement on a personal level with the remark that we do not support each other.

1) We all discuss our issues here and help each other out. Is this not support?
2) We all make efforts to attend many contests whether we're playing or watching. Is this not support?
3) We are all passionate enough about our hobby that we tell anyone who'll listen about how good brass bands are, and if they are a musician from another group, we'll try to bring them around. this adds potential recruits to bands, whether they be our band or elsewhere's. Isthis not support?

I am sorry to disagree Okiedokie but this is just not the case in the UK. I was not implying in anyway that we should all attend every concert, that would not be realistic and I do not do that. I would guess your situation in Australis menas that in order for you to attend a decent concert it involves an awful lot of travelling, cost and sacrifice. In my area if I chose to travel within 50 miles max, I could hear some of the very top bands a couple of times per month. Leeds City Council run a series at various Town Halls in the area with the very best bands and often they are not sell-outs and if they are, they are full of 60+. I speak from personal experience that most of the concerts I have attended within the last year or (probably about 5-10 in total) have seen me being virtually the youngest in the audience, at 24! I went to a local Grimethorpe concert about 3 months ago (£7 to get in and five miles up the road...so not an expensive task) and virtually all the audience was 60 and over. Is this not worrying that the band deemed the most entertaining in concert draws this average age? Without wanting to be like the Grim reaper, it is highly unlikely that those 500+ oAPs will be with us in 25 years time, and if they are they will be probably to old to get out to a concert.

As for contests - when did you last visit a major UK contest? The number of empty seats is worrying to say the least. There were countless empty seats at the Shield, Nationals, Masters etc. The thing I find frustrating is at the Open, virtually every year it is supposedly sold out but when the 'big boys' take the stage, the hall is still nowhere near full. At the Europeans, the Euro bands were itching to get back in the hall to listen, straight after they had played.

I would agree with Okiedokie when he says TMP is helpful in prompting discussion and ideas and that is a start.

This is not to have a pop at anyone, but as someone who loves being involved in bands, I am very concerned for the future of the movement. Unless active players start to take an interest in other bands activities then we are contributing to killing off the movement. This way we can share ideas and ways off making the whole thing more accessible and attractive. The push has to start 'at home' and instead of accepting the fact that we will play tiny and if not, ageing audiences we should look to support one another rather than carry on regardless.
 

joff

Account Suspended
Whilst B&R did the playing they were asked by the concert promoters to provide the specific programme in question. I also understand the programme content was advertised.

Such forward-thinking events are going to cause pain but I think it's something we will have to go through as a movement if we are to change people's thinking. I'm sure the vast majority of "punters" see Brass Band and roll up assuming march, overture, cornet solo, blah, blah, blah, Floral Dance. Unfortunately, many of these people are (and I say this carefully) towards the "older end". We need to try and appeal to a wider audience.

Calling the original thread "Very disappointing B&R concert" was most unfortunate. Far from being disappointing many would view it as a breath of fresh air, certainly the debate it has sparked about where we are heading as a movement is long overdue.

There will always be a place for entertaining (or "easy listening" concerts) but I feel we must show off a serious and forward-looking side as well. We have an unfortunate image that has no doubt contributed to the loss of much of the TV and radio airtime brass bands once enjoyed.

The Floral Dance has been used in this thread several times as an example of the typical "lollipop". That was in the 1970's. Have we done anything as a movement since then that has had such an effect on the public or shown how we've moved on (I deliberately exclude Brassed Off here)?

Congratulations to the promoters of this particular concert and my utmost admiration for B&R seeing the job through professionally amidst what must have been incredible scenes. We have some fantastic bands with great technical brilliance, let's do more to show them off in all their glory.
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cornetchap

Member
WoodenFlugel said:
cornetchap said:
No. In fact, up to the point I stopped reading it I'd quite enjoyed it. It may have been better beyond the point I didn't like, but equally it could have got a lot worse so I choose to stop where I did. Similarly, I would imagine, those that decided they hadn't liked what they'd heard and left felt that they weren't going to enjoy the rest of the concert. They may have liked what was to come, they may have felt it was less enjoyable than what they'd already heard. The point is, they chose to leave on the basis of their experience. At the end of the day music is highly subjective and is all about personal choice. What you choose to listen may not be what I would choose to listen to.

You make a good point here cornetchap, and one in which I partially agree on, but there is a big difference between stopping reading a book and doing the same in a live or public event. If you stop reading a book because you disagree with it's sentiment, or just get fed up with it, or whatever, then no-one is going to be that put out by that. To walk out in the middle of a piece in a concert, or in the middle of an act in a play shows a complete lack of respect for the performers, and the other members of the audience who might actually be enjoying it. I for one wouldn't like to have to stand up to let someone out of their seat just because they have decided that their time is too important to them to sit for another 10-15 minutes until a reasonable time to leave comes around. And that is regardless of whether I myself was enjoying the performance or not.

Indeed. I think we're all in agreement then; people have a right to express their view to a concert or style of music, but should do so appropriately.
 

wideiusgrinnius

New Member
Who wouldn't want to play for Fairies? They are a quality outfit of a band, their Solo Eb bass is amazing! As is their Solo Baritone. Stop slagging faieys off they are my favourite band. I love Faireys.
 

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