From info I've gathered on the web from various respected instrument repairers, the effect of lacquer in olden times was significant because the only lacquers available at that time couldn't be applied in a very thin coat. So it wasn't the lacquer per se which affected the tone, but the thickness of the coating. Nowadays, instrument makers and repairers have lacquers which I believe were developed for use on cars. Car makers use them to lay a hair thin layer of shiny stuff over the base paint colour, because it's a damn sight quicker and cheaper than trying to buff the base paint up to a mirror finish - but the punter . . . sorry, 'valued customer' . . . is attracted by the super-shiny finish like a bass player to a pint of Timothy Taylor's 'Landlord'. These lacquers can be applied so thinly that their effect on the tone of a brass instrument is so insignificant as to be inaudible. So, as long as your flugel is being done by a class repairer, you won't hear any difference at all.As I'm having my flugel re-lacquered would you mind telling me what to avoid please? I am concerned about losing it's beautiful sound.
You've reminded me, Mello, of what I read about the way Jaguars and I believe Mercedes used to treat the cast iron cylinder blocks of their car engines. After casting, they would dump them in a field, and leave them there for six months before machining them, and boring out the cylinders. What they found was that the castings changed in shape, as the internal crystal structure settled down, and the stresses caused by the rapid cooling of the cast iron sorted themselves out. Once thgat process was completed, they could be reasonably sure that when, for example, they bored out the cylinders, and the completed engine went into service, going through repeated cycles of heating up and cooling down, the cylinder bores would stay truly cylindrical, and their axes would all stay parallel to each other and square to the line of the crankshaft. If, in contrast, they machined the cylinder blocks as soon as they came out of the foundry, some of the blocks went slightly out of true in service - not enough to seize the engine, but enough to significantly reduce engine life.A crude description just to explain the brass is subjected to all manners of stress / heat and cold. This stretches and compresses the 'molecular' structure within the metal. It is important to remember the metal is at its best when the 'molecules' have settled and returned (as near as poss) to their original state. This process is what we know as annealing . . . however the best and most natural method I believe is time ... simply time.
I can remember doing this when I was young, but was always told it was good for it-no other explanation, but tbh not just on brand new instruments. Thanks for clearing it up, I always wondered about the thinking behind itOne other old practice was to ill a new instrument with milk , & leave it a few hrs before emptying . Then without washing it out , use it,,,,,the theory being that the residue levels what little rifling or unevenness of the metal inside would be smoothed out !.
As I'm having my flugel re-lacquered would you mind telling me what to avoid please? I am concerned about losing it's beautiful sound.[/QUOTE][QUOTE="Mello, A little PS , Laquering & plating have an effect as do dents and bruising , but thats another story.
To summarise , the softer, warmer sound is mostly achieved by laquer as opposed to Brass. ....Most flugel players today use laquer for that reason.As I'm having my flugel re-lacquered would you mind telling me what to avoid please? I am concerned about losing it's beautiful sound.
Sounds like a Fellow of the University of Life to meJust to clarify my comment re thicker refers to the thickness of the laquer - not the sound "with thicker laquer"
You are correct in that SP is Brighter than laquer ....due to the nodal pattern piercing the standing node as it reaches the bell end . like a bullet as opposed to a tennis ball, regarding the laquer being thinner than it used to be , That may be true now, , but before my retirement I worked for two of the major instrument makers, and know for sure that there are differences in both thickness and the number of layers used .Even today.
Not to mention response values of the various mix in the Brasses used. together with differing bores. tapers, flares, sleeves . stays & nodal locations ....all interesting stuff .
My work in instrument development was in conjunction with the major players of the day- from Brass Bands , Orchestras & Big Bands , lots of trials with different combinations and differing tastes. Liaising daily between specialist craftsmen ,,, and artists such as Rod Franks , John Wallace , , James Shepherd, Alan Morrison , Allen Vizzutti, Bobby Shew , Philip McCann, Mark Walters , Paul Eshelby, Ian Bousfield , Don Lusher James Gourlay , etc etc was a true labour of love.
Working aside of Richard Smith ( of Smith Watkins, & Sovereign Creator ) and being involved in demos at the Royal Society of Acousticians was a real eye opener , then alongside Hiroo Okabe was an honour . However times do change, and I admit not to be as familiar with trends as I used to be, Nor am I aware of the latest technology or even basic material densities
So if anyone gets the opinion that I think of myself an expert , I am the first to admit I am way down on the list. What little knowledge I have (or had ) is now very old hat, perhaps even primitive, never the less , some of what I say may be of passing interest to some.
Sorry Tom, but that’s definitely not the (complete) case here, though I do appreciate that your idea might hold validity in different circumstances. Though not as frequently I’ve still kept playing (so no noticeable break in skill level) and I very recently had a blow on regularly used instrument that’s virtually identical to my own practice instrument, the virtually identical one played as it should and mine (from storage) simply fell well short of the expected. Puzzling.Simpler - different instruments play differently, as you get used to it again you'll be able to get more out of it.