Hmmm that is presuming the audjudicator doesn't know who the bands are when he is in the box anyway :shock: :shock:McEuphie said:The box should make it a more level playing field - you will still get bands who only ever play 1 test piece so could be recognised!
Thank God for your last paragraph. I lost the will to live halfway through!!!!Keppler said:I actually did my college thesis on something like what BH is saying.. a music database which queried via musical input rather than metadata such as composer, genre etc..
First point. It's hairy stuff...
Second.. It's going to be a lot easier to analyse a relatively simple common or garden mp3 track than a full 18+ part brass band score. Loads of reasons for this. Sheer complexity. Size, time.. An average test piece is 15 mins say. That's 900 secs. Based on my experience, given a sampling rate of 8Khz (very low) that generates an on the fly wave analysis file with almost 8million samples. In order to process this, an expensive computational transform must be performed on each set of samples, and then further computations performed on the resulting sample sets. All this drops the quality of an already existing sample. And this is only to try and identify a spectographic representation of the music.
Any analysis must then be performed on a sample which has probably lost much of the bass line (lies too low in the frequency scale) and is going to be quite complex.
Also, our ears are used to hearing certain sounds. We probably "tune out" the normal overtones which contribute to timbre, and hear a rich fundamental. A computer is going to pick up everything it can. Now, add 25 other sounds, each with their own overtones on top of a given sound, and you start to imagine the chaos that mathematically exists.
CD quality music has at least 8 times the sample rate above.. that's at least a 64 times increase in the time required, and the space required for initial analysis.
Techno-speak aside, isn't music all about creating emotion, not playing pitch perfect. To my knowledge, we're a way from music-appreciating computers just yet..
Oh dear Sparkling quavers....In National Contests " It is against the Rules " some years ago one Area Committee checked every Bands set of parts, as they came off stage, and several bands had altered their parts...Thankfully they were disqualified..If you want to CHEAT, you should pay the price...What about the Bands that don't alter parts....All Bands have the same "Test Piece" and it should be a level playing field, if you can't play a part then you should expect to lose points..If you did it in a written exam and were seen you would be disqualified, so whats the difference...And yes I know it goes on, and by top bands as well..Try looking at Corys parts when they won the National Finals last time, maybe hence no recording....But it will still occur..Briansparkling_quavers said:Hmmm that is presuming the audjudicator doesn't know who the bands are when he is in the box anyway :shock: :shock:McEuphie said:The box should make it a more level playing field - you will still get bands who only ever play 1 test piece so could be recognised!
RE: Part swopping...I agree there is a place for this but there has to be a limit. Younger players should be encouraged to take part in contesting and if they can't cope with a few bars I think it is fine if this is given to someone else. But I have played in bands where certain positions are not even given a chance. Back-row cornets etc have parts taken off them during the 2nd/3rd rehearsal on a piece. That doesn't exactly give them a change does it?? It's all about making the best of what you have got but I don't see the point of having token players in the band. If you are not going to let them play anything then why have them sitting there?
also, it is not against the rules so why would it matter if the adjudicator saw it? We all know it goes on anyway!
If a composer wrote his music in the way that he did, and the Test Piece Selection Panel in their wisdom chose it..they both did that because thats what they wanted.If the front row players ( lets say ) can't manage their part, who do you give that to..et al around the Band...Because Black Dyke do it does not make it right, or any other Band..More Power to those brave enough to perform all their own parts.Roger Thorne said:Swapping Parts!
If it's good enough for Black Dyke (and I've seen that first hand at the National Finals) and all the other top bands, it good enough for everyone!
If Bands didn't enter contests because certain players within the band couldn't play the odd bar, I bet there wouldn't be many bands on the contesting circuit.
That's just a case of swapping the player!More importantly, if the basses can't manage their part who're you going to give it to?