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Thread: Salvation Army Music and Secular Bandis

  1. #16
    tMP Master Friend P_S_Price's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by James Yelland View Post
    Absolutely. But how can they, when the composers themselves are not able to approach their pieces purely as pieces of music, but as conduits for the promotion of their faith?...
    Very true James. As you say thats it purpose, But a lot of stuff produced nowadays is based not upon 'traditional Hymns' but upon SA Choral pieces; most of which would have no association to the words because the melodies are almost unknown outside of SA circles.

    The subtleties of Faith in the SA music for me are in the ability of the listener to associate it with the words. otherwise surely it just becomes a tune (Resurgam for example is secluar, not SA Hymnal based, but its style of melody is in my view recognisable with Eric Ball SA specific compositions).

    Your points are however very interesting, and thank you for contributing
    Pete:
    Rochdale Salvation Army Band - Solo Horn,
    SA CN Divisional Band - 1st Horn
    Available for Depping (I'm Cheap me - I play for free) .

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by P_S_Price View Post
    The posters so far havent said why they play it, only that they dont play it because of its underlying ethos. A very Fair point.
    In my mind I thought that I had written why we play it - I notice that it didn't get as far as the screen though - doh!

    For me / us it's quite simple, aside from the 'cheesy' song chorus marches, the arrangements are generally great. Use of tasteful and unusual harmonies in the slower pieces is unrivalled by most mainstream brass band conductors. The contemporary faster pieces are exciting to play and listen to.

    The catalyst was, as metioned earlier, the introduction of SA players to our band who brought with them the knowledge of this music. Maybe listing some good numbers in this thread will help guide 'virgin' bands towards the repertoire?

  3. #18
    tMP Prime Friend James Yelland's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by P_S_Price View Post
    If as the positives in James' comments state that some SA music is quality from a pure musical perspective then why is it not more prevalent?
    Because it's up against a lot of very strong competition.
    Jim Yelland
    Hinckley

  4. #19
    tMP Master Friend P_S_Price's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DRW View Post
    ...The catalyst was, as metioned earlier, the introduction of SA players to our band who brought with them the knowledge of this music. Maybe listing some good numbers in this thread will help guide 'virgin' bands towards the repertoire?
    A great point awareness is probably important.
    Pete:
    Rochdale Salvation Army Band - Solo Horn,
    SA CN Divisional Band - 1st Horn
    Available for Depping (I'm Cheap me - I play for free) .

  5. #20
    tMP Senior Friend Bob Sherunkle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by P_S_Price View Post
    Interesting. This would seem to indicate that Bands do approach SA music initially from an intirinsic awareness of its Christian implications.

    But your comments would seem to confirm my underlying feelings that bands are, in the main, not able to approach SA music purely as a piece of music.


    This may of course have something to do with the piece of music being titled "Sing Hallelujah to Praise His Glorious Magnificence" if a serious work, or "Pull 'em up and follow me!" for a more jaunty number.

    Captain Bob
    The voice of reason

  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by P_S_Price View Post
    The officer is responsible for enforcement I believe, but the following is taken from O&R's:

    "... All brass band music must have been published by The Salvation Army or have received the approval of the Territorial Music Council prior to its performance. Each member of the band should play from a legitimately published copy (when the music is not manuscript) or a photocopy reproduced through a licensing procedure in order that copyright law is upheld..."


    Yes, that appears in the 2000 edition Regulations and Guidelines for Musicians but I am fairly certain that, since 2000, this was relaxed in the way that I mentioned earlier.

  7. #22
    tMP Prime Friend WorldofBrass.com's Avatar
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    Some conductors and bands not necessarily connected with The Salvation Army have chosen to record pieces from Salvation Army repertoire.

    Recently, we took delivery of Tredegar in Concert Volume 1 which has Lorne Barry's Credo as the final track and Cory Band recorded Steven Ponsford's Turris Fortissima on Enter the Galaxies a few years ago.

  8. #23
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    In my experience with non-SA banding (which is limited, admittedly) I tend to have found the more Salvationists there are in a band, the more likely it is that SA music will be played. So it could be that the knowledge of the music is there with the bands with more Salvationists in, but it could also be possible that the music is played more because it's more relevant to the people within the band?
    Ross Baxter
    2nd Cornet - Penclawdd Brass

  9. #24
    tMP Prime Friend Cantonian's Avatar
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    Where does one put the 'crossover' music such as PLC's Fire in the Blood and particularly Vitae Eternum, the slow movement tune being an arrangement of Ivor Bosanko's song His Provision. Purcell variations (Downie) and Torchbearer (Graham)? These three composers are considered mainstream brass band composers but all have SA backgrounds and most bands play a lot of these guy's music.
    Mike Saunders
    Solo Horn - Cardiff Canton Band
    http://www.cantonsa.co.uk
    Solo Horn - City of Cardiff(Melingriffith)
    http://melingriffith.co.uk//

  10. #25
    tMP Friend halsasaurus's Avatar
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    At Besses we have been playing some Dean Jones such as Glorifico Aeternum which is SA music I believe. It is very very good

  11. #26
    tMP Friend for Life Thirteen Ball's Avatar
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    Not forgetting that it works both ways. Eric ball produced two versions of Torchbearer, the one under that name for SA bands and the one I prefer 'Torch of Freedom' for secular bands.

    I would agree that works such as 'Truth Aflame' by Kevin Norbury are absolute belters, that particular example being on a par with anything in the secular repertoire. We've had that in the pad at hebden for a while and it's only fixture congestion which has stopped us getting it up because the band love it.

    There are traits within the writing which readily identify the piece as being of Salvationist origin, but only inasmuch as it must be obvious to a salvationist when a secular composer has written a hymn arrangement with his/her mind on the contest platform on saturday afternoon rather than St Somebody's on Sunday morning.

    OK, perhaps you have a point that secular bands are not known for delving into SA repertoire regularly..... however it's not the secular bands that would pass over a Gregson, Sparke, or Wilby piece just because it didn't contain an element of christian worship. I think this rather more likely than a secular band passing over a Ball or Graham piece just because it did....

    A narrow approach helps neither side.
    Last edited by Thirteen Ball; 18.07.2012 at 22:30.
    Andi Cook: BBb Bass - Hebden Bridge
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  12. #27
    tMP Master Friend P_S_Price's Avatar
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    Interesting points all. Thanks
    Pete:
    Rochdale Salvation Army Band - Solo Horn,
    SA CN Divisional Band - 1st Horn
    Available for Depping (I'm Cheap me - I play for free) .

  13. #28
    tMP Master Friend P_S_Price's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by halsasaurus View Post
    At Besses we have been playing some Dean Jones such as Glorifico Aeternum which is SA music I believe. It is very very good
    Yes it is SA. it was on our rep until recently
    Pete:
    Rochdale Salvation Army Band - Solo Horn,
    SA CN Divisional Band - 1st Horn
    Available for Depping (I'm Cheap me - I play for free) .

  14. #29
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    At Tewkesbury Band we are currently playing, March- Stateside, Images of Praise, There is a Redeemer and Cause for Celebration and have recently had in our Praise Concert Programmes: Jubilation, Goldcrest, Marching Onward, Service Our Joy, The Children's Friend amongst others. Haven't checked that these all come from the SA.

    The music we have chosen is so uplifting and can also be a challenge in places for a third section band and so provides audience and player with something special. I am so glad that we can purchase and play this music. The other wonderful thing about this music is that it is original brass band music and not merely transcriptions or arrangements of pop and classic which secular brass bands are famous for. OK I know many are based on hymns and songs but the concept of using those in inspiring what is otherwise original music is very refreshing. However, there is a time and place for many of the pieces to be played but as many bands use our churches and chapels as concert halls then there should be no shortage of opportunities to play this music. (PS The music is so good don't let anybody else know about it otherwise they will all be playing it!)
    Nigel
    MD Tewkesbury Town Band

  15. #30
    tMP Master Friend P_S_Price's Avatar
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    This thread has been most enlightening for me. Some Bands play SA publications and some dont (suprising - not really), in general there appear to be a recognition that some is quality (again I agree some is some isnt). But the primary objection seems to be its ethos, rather than its scoring (which was a bit of a suprise, as in most instances I didnt think that the melodies, which are more usually based on Choir pieces rather than Hymns, would be widely known).


    Particular influence on the playing of the music seems to be those bands that have members with an SA banding connection (Again this isnt so suprising).


    Thanks to everybody for contributing.
    Pete:
    Rochdale Salvation Army Band - Solo Horn,
    SA CN Divisional Band - 1st Horn
    Available for Depping (I'm Cheap me - I play for free) .

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