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Thread: Registration, do we need it?

  1. #16
    tMP Senior Friend
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    But isn't the issue that many/most bands are struggling to field even 28 signed players, so which bands are hoarding all these active and available bandsmen that would form this pool of borrowees

  2. #17
    tMP Posting Freak!!! DublinBass's Avatar
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    I like the response trying to get youth involved.

    Here's a twist...what if there were a registry, but everybody under 19 (could be 20 or 21 to encourage uni students as well) or over 60 (with proof of ID in both cases) didn't have to register.

    This would cut down on fees bands had to pay to the registry, offer flexibility, encourage the stretching of demographics, help fill out bands, and (in most cases) not offer a huge competitive advantage.
    Eb Bass
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  3. #18
    tMP Prime Friend jockinafrock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hoppiebari View Post
    Bands are permitted to have upto 40 players registered. If bands were required to confirm 30 players they intend to play for a particular contest a month in advance, those players not involved could be considered by the Registry as pooled players that can then play for another band in the same section or above without the need to transfer, subject to say a limit of 2 pooled players per contest.
    Sounds good to me!
    Fiona Rolfe



  4. #19
    tMP Friend Neillyboy's Avatar
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    Let me chip in my tuppence from north of the border.

    The registry is vital up here for several reasons. Sbba have done an outstanding job on rebuilding the brass band movement in Scotland and as a result bands are fielding 2 bands at the areas.

    Prime example, today Kirkintilloch kelvin were drawn 6th, Kirkintilloch 7th. Same band same piece. If there was no registry then I can guarantee that there would be a few bodies staying sat down during the changeover to play it again.

    Also notable bands such as kingdom brass, Tullis Russell etc have now got a 2nd band in the 4th section as well as kingdom a in the champs and Tullis Russell main band in the second section. If there was no registry, what's stopping seats being filled by the players from the main bands? It would destroy the movement up here as bands within sections would be totally out competed. And then it would end up a championship section full of kingdom, tullis etc.

    The registry must stay!! I don't like it, nor do any other bands but in order to keep the contesting fair it's paramount!!
    Whats the definition of a barline? A bass section down the local.
    BBb Powerhouse at Johnstone Silver band.
    Musical director of Dumfries Town Band.

  5. #20
    tMP Friend in Training EbEwan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neillyboy View Post
    Sbba have done an outstanding job on rebuilding the brass band movement in Scotland and as a result bands are fielding 2 bands at the areas...

    ...Also notable bands such as kingdom brass, Tullis Russell etc have now got a 2nd band in the 4th section as well as kingdom a in the champs and Tullis Russell main band in the second section. If there was no registry, what's stopping seats being filled by the players from the main bands?
    What about thinking about from the other direction and allowing "free" transfers up from the lower band to the higher one from within the same organisation (obviously nothing allowed the other way around). Would this not give vital, higher level experience to some young players that wouldn't otherwise get it? The current situation is that you might as well shop around for a "dep" from a different band rather than temporarily promoting from within, that strikes me as ludicrous when we should be developing the players of the future. The added benefit of course is that there would be an incentive to having a training/development/second (whatever you like to call it) band. Of course, if the 2nd band is currently unregistered this problem doesn't exist, but it does handicap organisations who decide to put their second band into the 4th section.

  6. #21
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    [QUOTE=Pauli Walnuts;807441]No it won't - there is no evidence that anything of the sort will happen. There are plenty of contests that allow day transfers and still, I have yet to see Phil McCann appearing at a Scaba contest with a Fourth section band.

    Forgive me if I have dreamed this, but I have a strong feeling that Mr Ian Porthouse turned up on Sop for the 4th section national finals for Mellingriffith 2. Sorry if this was wrong - but I am fairly sure I am right! (Im propably being pedentic! - but it is Monday morning!).

    On a more serious note, and as a general response to this whole issue, it is important have a fair system of registration to ensure fairness for bands who want to build over time and who should not be prevented from gaining success by a truck load of primadonnas filling spaces in bands who cant even get a band together for their local carnival! Perhaps these bands should spend time training beginners and bringing on the next generation of players. This takes years of hard work but once the system is up and running, players come through year after year. Just look at what happens in cornwall with a stream of young quality players, year after year, coming out of Camborne, Mount Charles, St Dennis and St Austell, and Brunel 2 hours further East - they have done wonders. But this takes dedication, years of time and effort - but the rewards are huge. However, this does rather go against the modern way of expecting instant success with a quick communication via i-phone! Those bands I have mentioned above should be a lesson to the movement. That is how you should build a band and not by quick fixes. After all, Brunel have created a massively successful band fairly much from scratch with mostly youngsters in only a few years. Well done John and Paul for your dedication and for showing the movement how it should be done.

    I await the quick fix brigade to tell me I am wrong!

  7. #22
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    Given that many bands only do the regionals/nationals then why not make it the rule you need your passport to go on stage at the regionals. Bands need to send a list on a defined spreadsheet of all their players names and passport numbers a week or so before, but they can turn up with a new player if they so like at the desk, provided hes got his passport. Spmeone simply writes down his passport number, then all the players names, numbers and bands are centrally collated to ensure that no one played for two bands. Admin cut in half, everyones life easier.

  8. #23
    tMP Friend Neillyboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by berkshire_baritone View Post
    Given that many bands only do the regionals/nationals then why not make it the rule you need your passport to go on stage at the regionals. Bands need to send a list on a defined spreadsheet of all their players names and passport numbers a week or so before, but they can turn up with a new player if they so like at the desk, provided hes got his passport. Spmeone simply writes down his passport number, then all the players names, numbers and bands are centrally collated to ensure that no one played for two bands. Admin cut in half, everyones life easier.
    A lot of people don't have passports, driving licence etc and I certainly wouldn't wish to take my passport to a band contest. So much potential for it to belost in a drunken rammy!
    Whats the definition of a barline? A bass section down the local.
    BBb Powerhouse at Johnstone Silver band.
    Musical director of Dumfries Town Band.

  9. #24
    tMP Friend for Life Accidental's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by berkshire_baritone View Post
    then all the players names, numbers and bands are centrally collated to ensure that no one played for two bands. Admin cut in half, everyones life easier.
    Apologies if I'm missing something, but surely having to check on the day that a player with the same ID hasn't appeared with another band in one of the 40 sections across 8 regions is going to be alot more admin and hassle than the current process?
    Alex
    my posts are my views only, I am not speaking for my band or any other organisation

  10. #25
    tMP Prime Friend StellaJohnson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Accidental View Post
    Apologies if I'm missing something, but surely having to check on the day that a player with the same ID hasn't appeared with another band in one of the 40 sections across 8 regions is going to be alot more admin and hassle than the current process?
    I'm sure anyone could quite easily cheat if they wanted to. My photo looks nothing like me and I could quite easily get another card call myself Doris and no one would be any the wiser!!
    Stella Johnson
    Ex Player

  11. #26
    tMP Friend for Life Accidental's Avatar
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    Of course they could, no system is completely foolproof (short of fitting us all with microchips!)
    My point was really just about not thinking the passport idea is a very good one - I don't see any value in reinventing the wheel if its not going to make life easier for everyone on the contest day.
    Alex
    my posts are my views only, I am not speaking for my band or any other organisation

  12. #27
    tMP Prime Friend StellaJohnson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by berkshire_baritone View Post
    Given that many bands only do the regionals/nationals then why not make it the rule you need your passport to go on stage at the regionals. Bands need to send a list on a defined spreadsheet of all their players names and passport numbers a week or so before, but they can turn up with a new player if they so like at the desk, provided hes got his passport. Spmeone simply writes down his passport number, then all the players names, numbers and bands are centrally collated to ensure that no one played for two bands. Admin cut in half, everyones life easier.
    My passport ran out 3 years ago or I may not even have a passport. Great, I can ask the band to pay the 80 to renew my passport. My problem is solved!!!
    Stella Johnson
    Ex Player

  13. #28
    tMP Prime Friend stevetrom's Avatar
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    I was talking to someone at Bedworth this year and they mentioned that they had had to 'drop' some players to keep to the maximum number of players rule.

    I think it has been mentioned before, but why can't these players be put in a pool and bands with vacancies can ask if they can 'borrow' pool players.
    Bass Trom, Brackley & District Band, http://www.brackleyband.org.uk/

    The last thing I want to do is hurt you. But it's still on my list.

  14. #29
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    It wouldnt be possible to check if someone had played for another band for a few days. However the trest of punishments if a band is caught out should stop it happening. Using proper id like passport or driving license should make it a doddle to collate a list of who really played for who, and sticking together 40 spreadsheets is a doddle too.

  15. #30
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    I just thought having a definitive photo id like passport or driving license could mean you dont need a central register for many players.

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