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Thread: Adjudicator's comments on audience reaction.

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    tMP Friend blasterbates's Avatar
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    Adjudicator's comments on audience reaction.

    Now this is a strange one and I'm sorry I am not going to bring out the usual vague trash we see on this site (e.g. let's spend weeks guessing who he's talking about etc...).

    National Finals 4th Section this weekend - Skelmanthorpe B played a pretty decent show - not the best start but it got much better and it was a good show overall. They deserved a good ovation at the end especially as many of the players are youngsters whom we should be encouraging. I was one of those people who cheered at the end.

    Whilst disappointed with their overall placing (please note this is not the point of this thread), the most bizarre comment on the remarks came from adjudicator Chris Wormald. which was about the audience being very supportive at the end of the performance, however the band's performance did not merit this ovation.

    I am sorry, but are the adjudicatiors not supposed to be judging the music from the stage and nothing else?

    I have played in many contests where "rent-a-crowd" have turned up and cheered performances of a much lower standard than that of Skelmanthorpe B this weekend but I always thought it didn't matter because the adjudicators were much too professional to take notice of the response at the end of 12 or 15 minutes playing - they should already have formed an opinion before the end of the last note.

    I thought it most bizzare and was going to ask the rest of you if you had ever had an adjudicator comment on the (irrelevant) response from the audience at a contest you have played at, however my thunder has been stolen by members of Uppermill Band, who played in the same section this weekend and came in the prizes and also had a pretty similar comment on their remarks.

    Did anyone else get a similar comment - and do you think it is relevant?
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    tMP Prime Friend Hells Bones's Avatar
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    You'd hope the adjudicators don't take audience reaction into account considering I've seen a few where the audience are cheering before the band has even finished playing!
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    This seems bang out of order perhaps the adjudicator should concentrate on the music rather than the audience. At a contest like the Nationals the level of travelling support will vary according to distance and I always think that younger aged bands generally have more support also. Perhaps the comments should be refered back to the Adjudicators association for their opinions as to the professionalism of such comments.

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    dyl's Avatar
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    Not the first time I've heard of the same adjudicator say that..........

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    tMP Senior Friend Blagger's Avatar
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    Agree that that's totally out of order - a comment like that tells you nothing and could only spoil some of the members of that bands' day. Add to that their young age (ok - Wormald didnt know what band he was commenting on) and I think its shameful.
    For the record - Wormald comments for us were noticeably less encouraging than Dick Evans' - and we won. My guess is that he "marked down" most bands - so dont feel too bad
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    tMP Friend in Training marchris6047's Avatar
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    Yes, we had comments on the amount of cheering we got.
    Not quite sure what thats got to do with him. He was adjudicating a band contest not if the level of cheering were appropriate to conclude any of the performances.
    Like Lostock Hall our comments were also less encouraging than Richard's

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    It is a shame when people "paid" to an important job get side tracked by the smoke and mirrors of the audience present. Did anybody receive any comments such as " this one should have enjoyed rapturous applause"................... idiotic beyond belief.
    I sat through most of section 4 and 3 and at times witnessed a very very sparce audience indeed.
    Any audience reaction is purely a recognition of the bands efforts, be it from the impartial like myself, or the dedicated and tireless parents and family who give their time, money and effort to ensure that this great movement of ours continues to thrive, and to celebrate in whatever way they deem appropriate, the efforts of their friends and family.
    Dick Evans, as always, was professional in his summing up at the end, offered good sound advice to everyone present, and by the writings here, gave encouragement and dirction in his adjudication.
    There are not too many like Mr Evans and David Read, who never forget where they started, and frequently revisit the grass roots of brass bands.
    Temper that with the "up and coming" must make a name for myself pretenders and we have a toxic mix to contend with.
    To everybody who competed, well done to you all, it gave me a marvellous days entertainment, i never heard a "dodgy" band all day, and you were all a great credit.

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    tMP Senior Friend Aurora771's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by euphalogy View Post
    Dick Evans, as always, was professional in his summing up at the end, offered good sound advice to everyone present, and by the writings here, gave encouragement and dirction in his adjudication.
    Thank goodness he said it in his speech because he certainly wasn't constructive or encouraging in our bands adjudication. Mainly, that was wrong, that was wrong. It would be interesting to see how he changed his comments with a band who played later in the day.

    Anyway, back on point. Adjudicators shouldn't be influenced by the audience, and the fact that he mentioned it in the crit is a little worrying.

    Also, the audience clapping before the band is finished.. I find it so annoying. It also distracts from the finally note which may be going in or out a tune.. which I feel the adjudicators should hear.

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    tMP Senior Friend Mr Guinness's Avatar
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    I vote for replacing the adjudicators with a clapometer! And maybe a Hughie Green lookalike.
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    tMP Senior Friend agentorange's Avatar
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    Mr Wormald strikes again.

    I seem to remember complaints about his remarks at this years senior cup. (Ok, i definately remember - I was one of the complainants!).

    Just to sidetrack slightly, I remember an adjudicator (not Mr Wormald this time though) commenting that I looked like I needed to relax more. Absolutely no mention of what he actually heard. Insane.
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    tMP Prime Friend Hells Bones's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by agentorange View Post
    Mr Wormald strikes again.

    I seem to remember complaints about his remarks at this years senior cup. (Ok, i definately remember - I was one of the complainants!).

    Just to sidetrack slightly, I remember an adjudicator (not Mr Wormald this time though) commenting that I looked like I needed to relax more. Absolutely no mention of what he actually heard. Insane.
    This was, I trust, an open adjudication, yes?
    *Insert Insult Here*

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    Super Moderator brasscrest's Avatar
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    Coming from a completely neutral perspective, I'm not sure that this comment is all that bad. It seems to me that adjudicator is trying to say that he did NOT take notice of the ovation in scoring the band - that he heard the ovation and thought that it was excessive for the performance that he heard. This could just be an attempt to explain a low mark on what seemed like a popular performance to the audience.
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    tMP Friend robcav's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brasscrest View Post
    Coming from a completely neutral perspective, I'm not sure that this comment is all that bad. It seems to me that adjudicator is trying to say that he did NOT take notice of the ovation in scoring the band - that he heard the ovation and thought that it was excessive for the performance that he heard. This could just be an attempt to explain a low mark on what seemed like a popular performance to the audience.
    I have to ask why any adjudicator worth his salt, credibility or integrity would care two hoots about the audience's reaction or, more to the point why on Earth he would feel the need to justify his comments on the performance in relation to an audience's reaction in his adjudication remarks.

    As I am apt to comment to some of my students 'if you have nothing valuable or constuctive to say, say nothing. It's the empty bottles that make the most noise'.

    I know that the issue of the style and content of adjudicators' remarks has been debated before but I trust that the body which oversees the 'quality control' of adjudications will adjudicate against the practice of commenting on anything other than the musical performance before them in a constructively critical way especially, but of course not exclusively, in the 4th section. What possible benefit can be gained by making such a critical appraisal of the people who have paid good money to support their band and the movement (and believe me they were annoyed). Kill the support and you kill the movement.

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    tMP Friend in Training obi-wan johnny's Avatar
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    Whatever the reason for enthusiastic applause, it shouldn't be complained about. How many times have we sat and played - in contests! - to three men and a dog, only to be applauded by the conductor and the dog at the end of the piece? We complain about that - let's not complain about too much encouragement from the audience.

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    tMP Friend YorkshireBloke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by robcav View Post
    What possible benefit can be gained by making such a critical appraisal of the people who have paid good money to support their band and the movement (and believe me they were annoyed). Kill the support and you kill the movement.
    Well said rob.

    I also read what was written, and to say that the players didn't deserve it is an insult to everyone concerned. Next time Mr Adjudicator, just stick to commenting on the playing please. We will decide how much we want to cheer and encourage, thank you very much.
    Paul
    Skelmanthorpe Band

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