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Di B
03.03.2003, 14:58
I play on a bog standard silver mouthpiece.

A few people I know however, now swear by having the edges of the mouthpiece coated in gold as it conducts better and therefore provides a better sound.

I'm also aware that you can now get decent gold mouthpieces - not like the horrible old gold plated ones that gave me a rash on my lip for six months! :evil: :evil:

So.... do people think that the gold thing is better and does in fact help your playing or is it all a load of codswallup and just a story to make us go and buy new mouthpieces?

Keppler
03.03.2003, 15:04
I had my silver plate mp replated in gold, and then over plated in silver.
A bit confusing, but the inside surface is gold, and the outside below the rim is silver (for wear)

Possibly doesn't make a massive difference, but I think it does make a wee one.. at least to my ear. And that's what counts.

And it looks flashy! ;)

BTW, have just ordered a new Sparx cornet mp - anyone got any comments on them?

satchmo shaz
03.03.2003, 17:58
careful Di when the gold rubs off ................ rash city here we come !!
ooh matron!! :lol:

Di B
03.03.2003, 18:21
careful Di when the gold rubs off ................ rash city here we come !!
ooh matron!! :lol:

Does that still happen? I thought that the newer mouthpieces were gold rather than just being gold plated or something so that the nasty rash (a similar one to that which allegedly also occurs at Pontins/Blackpool/National Finals!!!) shouldn't appear.

That's wot I woz told anyway... but the bloke was trying to sell me a mouthpiece! lol!

PS. I got it sussed! I updated my pic! :lol: :lol: :lol:

HBB
03.03.2003, 18:44
careful Di when the gold rubs off ................ rash city here we come !!
ooh matron!! :lol:

Does that still happen? I thought that the newer mouthpieces were gold rather than just being gold plated or something so that the nasty rash (a similar one to that which allegedly also occurs at Pontins/Blackpool/National Finals!!!) shouldn't appear.

That's wot I woz told anyway... but the bloke was trying to sell me a mouthpiece! lol!

PS. I got it sussed! I updated my pic! :lol: :lol: :lol:



Like the Snoopy :P:P:P (I play on a bog standard mp too sad innit!:))

asteria
04.03.2003, 14:35
A few people I know however, now swear by having the edges of the mouthpiece coated in gold as it conducts better and therefore provides a better sound.


I can't think of any reason why gold conducting better would make a better mouthpiece.

Does anyone know the reasoning behind why a gold mouthpiece/instrument is supposed to give a warmer sound? Perhaps it's a psychological thing?

I've never tried a gold mouthpiece - does everyone notice a difference?

Helen

Boneman
04.03.2003, 22:19
I am led to believe that it does make a difference - I think that it might be to do with deadening vibrations - but I might be wrong ( I might be thinking of a mouthpiece booster)

When I bought my last trombone I was presented with an overwleming set of options (Red Brass Bell, Solid Silver bell!, Yellow Brass Bell - it goes on! You can even get them with interchangable bells now), I guess the best thing is to try one and see if you like it! I play on a silver coloured mouthpiece.

Matthew
04.03.2003, 23:27
I must admit I've seen more of these recently.....they do look the business anyway!

Are they available for Tuba anyone? Does anyone use one on a Bass and does it make any difference for you?

I've got a couple of mouthpieces that need re-plating, perhaps I could get them double plated with both silver and the gold.

You wanna blow my what?
05.03.2003, 04:47
I've never tried a gold mouthpiece - does everyone notice a difference?

Helen

According to Phillip Farkas, it gives the right amount of lubrication for the lips or something. How the gold knows what amount of lubrication is thr right amount is beyond me.

Di B
06.03.2003, 10:31
I must admit I've seen more of these recently.....they do look the business anyway!

Are they available for Tuba anyone? Does anyone use one on a Bass and does it make any difference for you?

I've got a couple of mouthpieces that need re-plating, perhaps I could get them double plated with both silver and the gold.

I know that you can get just gold mouthpieces which apparantly is no longer the nasty rashy stuff (but check that out!) and I know someone who had his mouthpiece replated all in silver apart from the very edge that goes against the mouth which was done in gold.

If anyone gets and professional advice on this one I would love to know what it is! :)

BoozyBTrom
06.03.2003, 13:14
The Bass players in our band have Black mouthpieces. they could get them done to what ever colour they wanted. one of the lads works in a plant where they make car parts and he addonised them ( think that is the word!!)

They dont seem to have any problems with them as the colouring is only a few microns thick

Mrs Fruity
06.03.2003, 17:56
anodised???

BoozyBTrom
06.03.2003, 17:58
anodised???

Spot the teacher.

Ooooo Will i get a telling off in Darlington then eh!!!

Keppler
06.03.2003, 17:59
trying to think what you'd electroplate a mp with to make it black.. well something that wouldn't come off, anyway..

failing...

Rach, you're a science teacher! ;)

BoozyBTrom
06.03.2003, 18:03
The guy put it in the same machine that all of car parts go through. A conveyer belt type thing. Went in with all the wheel rims and the like. come out the other end hey presto its black

Aidan
06.03.2003, 19:35
mines silver with gold on the inside and on the rim, gives a much better feel on my lips for me

blondie
06.03.2003, 23:17
I first tried a Gold MP due to an allergic reaction to the silver when i was a youngster (Bach 5G). This was one of the best mp I have played on for all round trombone work. It stopped the rash in its tracks and as some of you have said it appears partly responsible for creating a warmer fuller sound. Recently I have been playing bass trom on a bands instrument and it was again time to purchase a bass trom gold plated mp (Wick 2 AL). There is a stark contrast to the previous silver mp again and i firmly believe that the mp is partly responsible for creating this noticeable characteristic.

Adam Roberson
Bass Trom
Wem Jubilee

Di B
07.03.2003, 10:02
The guy put it in the same machine that all of car parts go through. A conveyer belt type thing. Went in with all the wheel rims and the like. come out the other end hey presto its black

Wouldn't the colour come off eventually though? Just thinking of the number of 'tashes that your bass section would support! :lol:

Well, it used to happen with the old gold plated mouthpieces so you never know..... but if it does please let me have a photo! :D :D

BoozyBTrom
07.03.2003, 12:05
no it doesnt come off. Not sure how the process works. But it is permanant

Bones
07.03.2003, 15:36
In response to Di B comments.

The Denis Wick Gold mouthpieces are Gold plate on the bare brass, which is the reason the gold comes off. Apparently something to do with the gold plate not liking brass that much. Whether this has been addressed in recent dvelopments I'm not sure

Whether it is codswallop or not I actually prefer to play on a Gold mouthpiece. But I use Vincent Bach M/ps, the cost of which was nearly double for a gold plated one. What I did was to get my M/p silver plated all over, then have the rim and the inner cup plated. This was done by a really nice bloke and an excellent craftsman in Yorkshire, called Alaric Knight. The cost was 18, and I got what I wanted, plus also, got to keep my original mouthpiece.

The theory behind playing on a gold mouthpiece is that it is a warmer metal on your face, so I believe. If anyone wants Alaric's details I would be more that willing to pass them on.

Cheers

Rich Walker
Carlton Main Frickley

satchmo shaz
07.03.2003, 16:30
ey up mate!........... nice piccie !! :wink: enjoy the rest of your show!

what a baton she's got !!

Baldeagle
08.03.2003, 00:27
In response to Di B comments.

The Denis Wick Gold mouthpieces are Gold plate on the bare brass, which is the reason the gold comes off. Apparently something to do with the gold plate not liking brass that much. Whether this has been addressed in recent dvelopments I'm not sure

Whether it is codswallop or not I actually prefer to play on a Gold mouthpiece. But I use Vincent Bach M/ps, the cost of which was nearly double for a gold plated one. What I did was to get my M/p silver plated all over, then have the rim and the inner cup plated. This was done by a really nice bloke and an excellent craftsman in Yorkshire, called Alaric Knight. The cost was 18, and I got what I wanted, plus also, got to keep my original mouthpiece.

The theory behind playing on a gold mouthpiece is that it is a warmer metal on your face, so I believe. If anyone wants Alaric's details I would be more that willing to pass them on.

Cheers

Rich Walker
Carlton Main Frickley


Hi Richard nice to see you on here,love your web site :P


www.carltonbrass.org.uk

Mrs Fruity
09.03.2003, 15:51
anodised???

Spot the teacher.

Ooooo Will i get a telling off in Darlington then eh!!! :shock:

[/quote]................smacked legs, too!!!!!!!!!

Mrs Fruity
11.03.2003, 00:03
That stopped that conversation, didn't it. I must apologise for that - it's just the primary school teacher in me taking over.

Hilary Mateer
11.03.2003, 01:27
I have just had my DW2L bass mouthpiece replated as the old plating had worn and it was irritating my lips. I had it done by Alaric Knight in silver then gold on top, This leaves the outside silver and the rim and inside gold. I find it very comfortable and I think it makes a good sound too

Mrs Fruity
11.03.2003, 13:10
I can't speak highly enough of Alaric Knight. He has re-profiled and plated my husband's bass mouthpiece to custom specifications, and his workmanship is excellent - and he's an absolute gentleman.

BoozyBTrom
11.03.2003, 13:47
I can't speak highly enough of Alaric Knight. He has re-profiled and plated my husband's bass mouthpiece to custom specifications, and his workmanship is excellent - and he's an absolute gentleman.

do you smack his legs????

Mrs Fruity
11.03.2003, 13:49
I can see that you're troubled by this, G me dear - I hope I haven't scarred you (mentally) for life. Soz

BoozyBTrom
11.03.2003, 13:52
I can see that you're troubled by this, G me dear - I hope I haven't scarred you (mentally) for life. Soz

I am a troubled soul. You've seen me so you should not be surprised,

timold
09.07.2003, 23:16
Gold or Silver

Having dealt with mouthpieces for some fifteen years I now can give some
little advice.

Gold is a softer metal than silver and is more comfortable on the lip, but you will find that there is more movement (when wet), so if you can't play with a wet lip then try and opt for silverplate.

Silverplate is better for people who can't play on a wet lip, I find now more and more people coming to me and asking....when I am playing and the lips get warm the mouthpiece starts sliding around....9 times out of 10 the person is playing a gold mouthpiece, and trying a silver one has helped.

If anyone requires anymore information, please feel free to contact me.

E-Mail: timothyoldroyd@hotmail.com

Despot
09.07.2003, 23:59
I can't speak highly enough of Alaric Knight. He has re-profiled and plated my husband's bass mouthpiece to custom specifications, and his workmanship is excellent - and he's an absolute gentleman.


Ditto, and he's fast.

Have had about a dozen band mouthpieces redone, mostly DW's that the gold wore off!

Aidan
10.07.2003, 15:20
A few people I know however, now swear by having the edges of the mouthpiece coated in gold as it conducts better and therefore provides a better sound.


I can't think of any reason why gold conducting better would make a better mouthpiece.

Does anyone know the reasoning behind why a gold mouthpiece/instrument is supposed to give a warmer sound? Perhaps it's a psychological thing?

I've never tried a gold mouthpiece - does everyone notice a difference?

Helen

its to do with the density of the metal i think

floral_dance
12.07.2003, 00:30
I am playing on a silverDW mouthpiece size 4, but wonder if I should change for the higher note range. My tutor is now playing on a plastic or something mp does anyone else play on one of these and what is the advantage.?

Maestro
12.07.2003, 09:11
I use a Giardielli mouthpiece, and it is silver. Over here I was quoted anything between 60 and 90. I went online and got it shipped over from the states, it only cost me 38.
Many years ago, I did have a Giardinelli screw on rim that was nylon. It was a godsend when marching in the cold winter months. Unfortunately I was stupide enough to lend it to someone.....I never saw it again. I was well gutted, especially as they don't do the screw rims for euph any longer. :cry:

But for me, the Giardinelli is the best thing I have ever played on.

Jo Elson
13.07.2003, 16:57
I have just had a gold mouthpiece bought me and it's great, but I have had it confascated off me until my birthday.
Someone I know loves gold mouthpieces and I have to say after hearing him play with a silver mouthpiece and then the gold there is definately an improvement and the overall standard of his playing is loads better.
They also feel really nice on the lips and are a lot smoother for some reason.

markyboy
13.07.2003, 18:50
In a couple of weeks when our Band finishes for the summer I am planning to have my old kosicup soprano mouthpiece replated by Mr Knight. I'm sure he must be as good as people say, our conductor Ian Porthouse swears by him. I have also left another posting elsewhere trying to get my hands on another kosicup 1 1/2 sop mouthpiece if any one happens to have one knocking about.
Mark Wears Pennine Brass.

rutribal
17.08.2003, 17:48
I am not positive about this, but I think it is due, in part, to gold being a better conductor than silver. Gold will therefore 'warm up' quicker and being a more malleable metal, it may seem to be more cushioned. This may have the effect of a warmer sound.

I used to play with gold mouthpieces on trumpet and cornet, for a warmer sound as I tended to find silver mouthpieces quite bright.

At the end of the day though there's probably a valid scientific reason for it but it comes down to personal preference.

Simon Morgan

neiltwist
18.08.2003, 00:10
I am not positive about this, but I think it is due, in part, to gold being a better conductor than silver.

other way round sorry!

lilcornetgirl
18.08.2003, 13:03
Why would it make a differance i mean it isn't the mouthpiece it is the person blowin it in it.

The mouthpiece is just a thing that you blow through the person blowing it makes the sound.

lov lilcornetgirrl

Keppler
18.08.2003, 13:25
by that logic we should dispense with the intruments altogether, or all take up hoseaphones....

lilcornetgirl
18.08.2003, 13:30
WHAT ?????

neiltwist
18.08.2003, 13:39
Why would it make a differance i mean it isn't the mouthpiece it is the person blowin it in it.

The mouthpiece is just a thing that you blow through the person blowing it makes the sound.

lov lilcornetgirrl

but if the different material affects the person, then it does make a difference, even if it is just mental.

lilcornetgirl
18.08.2003, 13:43
O yeah i didn't think of it like that Sorry

markyboy
28.08.2003, 00:24
I've just got back home having been to Alaric Knight's house to pick up my mouthpiece (which I've used for 27 years) and it is now beautifully gold plated!
Haven't had chance yet to see if there is any difference in sound, but to give the man a total blatent plug- I'm sure many of us have got scratched and worn mouthpieces that could do with a 'make over'. This is the man to see!!
Very reasonable prices and very fast service! He will do a fantastic job for you.
If anyone is interested his phone number is 01226 765858.
ps I am not on any commission from him!

markyboy
03.09.2003, 00:06
Having now been playing on my newly gold plated mouthpiece for a week, I would have to say that there is quite a difference in sound! The gold plate seems to have given a 'darker' sound, more like a Bb cornet. Just wondered if anyone had the same experience going from silver to gold with the same mouthpiece?

Jo Elson
03.09.2003, 12:23
Just wondered if anyone had the same experience going from silver to gold with the same mouthpiece?

I definately noticed a difference in the sound too. Although I wouldn't say it it sounded like a Bb cornet, but that might just be if we play different instruments. Also it is a lot easier on my lips and I don't find it as hard to reach high notes but that may be just me.
:?

beard_4b
11.09.2003, 15:12
Gold is smoother than silver, so therefore feels more comfortable on ur lips, however with silver there is more friction!

Cantonian
11.09.2003, 15:27
Gold is smoother than silver, so therefore feels more comfortable on ur lips, however with silver there is more friction!

At a molecular level you are correct but I would challenge anybody to measure this manually.

I think that there is a lot of Psychological effect as to whether Gold or silver plate on brass is better.

beard_4b
11.09.2003, 18:53
Personally i dont like gold mouthpieces because after a while the gold fades and ur left with this horrible coloured mouthpiece - the fact that u may get a darker sound is immaterial!

I use an RW4B which is great, its not so deep as u get a huge mellow sound but no range out of it, but its not so shallow that u get a thin piercing sound out of it.

As long as u practice with ur mouthpiece whatever colour and not keep changing it all the time then u'll be fine! There are certain things u can practice to develop sound. The arban rules!!!

leisa
11.09.2003, 19:47
[quote="beard_4b"]

I use an RW4B which is great, its not so deep as u get a huge mellow sound but no range out of it, but its not so shallow that u get a thin piercing sound out of it.
[quote]

i use a RW4 have been told it's especially popular for front row cornet players. find it handy on back row at sSBB too!
really like the RW one's!! mine is also silver but think i'm just used tyo that

Ray Woods
16.09.2003, 23:01
Reading through the many messages on this subject I would come to the conclusion that the Gold rimmed mouthpiece produces a darker sound because it has less friction than say a silver mouthpiece.

Imagine the mouthpiece pushed against your lip, and zoom in on the area between the lip meeting the inside rim of the mouthpiece. With the silver mouthpiece, as the lip vibrates, this portion of the lip may be locked in position due to the friction of silver. This may lead to a bright sound. Swapping the silver for 'slippery' gold, the contact area between the lip and gold inner rim will be able to move a little more than the silver. This extra area of vibration may lead to a richer tone.

And the gold is prettier so makes you feel better.

Moy
18.09.2003, 14:05
Just to complicate things even further...I have just had an old mouthpiece replated as it was scratched and really mankie as we say up here in Scotalnd.
It is silver but the inner and outer cup is gold.
Very pleased with it.

rdouglas1976
19.09.2003, 10:36
Sorry for my ignorance I know DW would be Dennis Wickes but an RW mouthpiece?

Moy
19.09.2003, 10:52
Sorry for my ignorance I know DW would be Dennis Wickes but an RW mouthpiece?
Roger Webster mouthpices.

rdouglas1976
19.09.2003, 18:04
Cheers, I use a warbuton screw top so I can use it on cornet and trumpet. Here's what they say on their site about gold plating:

What effect does gold plating have?

Advantages:

Warms up to skin temperature quickly
Allows lips to "roll" in and out of mouthpiece with ease-- often preferred by players with a wet-lip set
More agreeable to those with allergy problems or sensitive skin
Caution:

Gold does not have as strong of a "friction grab" as silver. If you depend on the mouthpiece "sticking" to your lips, you may not be pleased with the results. When asking fellow trumpet players their opinion of gold, it is unlikely that you will get a middle-of-the-road answer; opinions run strong. If you are unsure, ask some players about their experiences with gold and try to relate them to your playing.

How much extra time does gold plating take?

No extra time! The Warburton factory is now equipped with an in-house, 24-Karat gold plating system. We use a silver base coat, so any unit which is in stock and ready for shipping can be gold plated the same day.

Must say I've never sen a gold plated one though.

rdouglas1976
19.09.2003, 18:05
or seen ! :lol: