National Finals 2008 - 3rd Section Test Piece : Suite for Brass

[Di]

National Finals 2008
Third Section Test Piece

Suite for Brass
by John Rutter, arranged by Sandy Smith
Obrasso-Verlag AG

[Mesmerist]

well it sounds quite hummable...

[emziesonic]

Is this a newly composed piece or one that there is recordings of?

[Lyndon Price]

There are some utube bits of the source material for S Smiths arr. Seems like there are 2 mvts with perc tacet( in the string suite). Based on english folk songs ala Holst Tavener and RVW. The String version is high....should be interesting....last orch transcription was Carnival at the area 2nd section....hope this is better. Rutter of course is in a utterly different league than Mr Illes main sqeeze tho....lol

[mikelyons]

I wouldn't offend Sandy Smith for the world, he's a top spot a1 class arranger, but why are the panel not picking more

NEW BRASS COMPOSITIONS?

I love John Rutter's stuff. He writes excellent music which pleases audiences around the world, but why can the panel not pick pieces

written for brass bands?

It really worries me that they can ignore all the talent out there amongst real brass band composers and go for an arrangement (however well done - and I believe that it will be) rather than a proper composition?:rolleyes:

[The-Wee-Timpanist]

We played it last night for the first time at the end of rehearsals.

I like it but some parts may have to grow on me.

Slightly disappointed in lack of percussion but then I did expect it. Timpani is tacet in the 2nd movement and glock is tacet in the 4th movement.

Shall be interesting as we have 4 percussionsts and we only need 3 for it - I volunteered to prop up the bar :lol:

I like the 2nd movement but don't think the rest of the band do. Its got a nice wee glock part to it.

[DMBabe]

Stop showing off Rach! U wanna lend us one???? I have a comfy sofa (and a soon to be done up spare room) and a really stonking chippie less than 100 yds away! ;) Anyhting to shut him indoors up! We haven't even seen it yet and he's stressing. Flaming amateurs!

[centralbankofdad]

I wouldn't offend Sandy Smith for the world, he's a top spot a1 class arranger, but why are the panel not picking more

NEW BRASS COMPOSITIONS?

I love John Rutter's stuff. He writes excellent music which pleases audiences around the world, but why can the panel not pick pieces

written for brass bands?

It really worries me that they can ignore all the talent out there amongst real brass band composers and go for an arrangement (however well done - and I believe that it will be) rather than a proper composition?:rolleyes:

With tongue firmly in cheek.... I seem to remember that you didn't enjoy the last composition!

[The-Wee-Timpanist]

Stop showing off Rach! U wanna lend us one???? I have a comfy sofa (and a soon to be done up spare room) and a really stonking chippie less than 100 yds away! ;) Anyhting to shut him indoors up! We haven't even seen it yet and he's stressing. Flaming amateurs!

Unfortunately I won't be able to lend you one as I'll have to stay and keep an eye on the guys. Someone has to keep them organinsed :lol: How many percussionists do you have likes?

He's stressing?! What ever for?! Its very simple for percussion. Very much like Carnival last year. You've got a bit of snare (not sure what that piece was like), a wee bit of timps, some glock and a few rolls on a bass drum. :tup

[Mesmerist]

We played it last night for the first time. I like it but I think it is one of those pieces that just get harder the more it is rehearsed.

[DMBabe]

He's stressing?! What ever for?! Its very simple for percussion. Very much like Carnival last year. You've got a bit of snare (not sure what that piece was like), a wee bit of timps, some glock and a few rolls on a bass drum. :tup

We have him (the guitar playing oboe dude who only does banding cos it's that or be the brass band widower but is better at percussion than the other stuff:confused: ) and the at times rhythmically perplexed Hezza. He always stresses till he knows what's going on (we've been doing concerts so haven't looked at it yet).

Don't want to be the one to tell him it's like carnival..... had to hide all sharp objects during that so he wouldn't top himself with how pants it was!:eek:

[mikelyons]

With tongue firmly in cheek.... I seem to remember that you didn't enjoy the last composition!
I know, but that was mainly because it was about as interesting as watching paint dry.

We haven't got this yet so I'm not judging it. I just hope Sandy Smith wrote it before he fell out with me over DSOTM. ;)

Don't want to be the one to tell him it's like carnival.....

Oh no! Please, not again! :eek:

[brassbandmaestro]

I totally agree with mikelyons. We have a pleathora of talent in the brass band movement. So why on earth have the panel ignoredthese people. Again, no offence to Sandy Smith, who I also agree is a nop notch arranger. But, why o why, do they continually to give out music thats like an arrangement and not origin al stuff!?!?!?

[The-Wee-Timpanist]

Don't want to be the one to tell him it's like carnival..... had to hide all sharp objects during that so he wouldn't top himself with how pants it was!:eek:

We used to dread going to band when we were rehearsing Carnival. In fact somedays we'd turn up an hour late just because we knew we wouldn't be needed for a great deal.

Ok, maybe its not quite as bad as Carnival because percussion actually could have just turned up on the day for that one! Yet its not quite as exciting as Dark Side of the Moon - I loved it! I think you'll def need 3 players though.

[brianatb]

I totally agree with mikelyons. We have a pleathora of talent in the brass band movement. So why on earth have the panel ignoredthese people. Again, no offence to Sandy Smith, who I also agree is a nop notch arranger. But, why o why, do they continually to give out music thats like an arrangement and not origin al stuff!?!?!?
Hear Hear:clap:

[lynchie]

Any opinions on the trombone parts? From listening to the string version, I'm not holding out too much hope for anything other than occassional shock chords and loads of long notes and rhythmic plodding.

[Lyndon Price]

i think you may be on the money there mate, not played it yet but the string suite is used regulary in school orchestra; i have nightmares of having to rehearse idioms that dont work on brass, viola parts on hrns and baris.......we qualify on plc's music that nearly brings us into the twentieth century....then boom....unoriginal music, not designed to be played by the ensemble......deflated a bit

[mikelyons]

String writing can be so idiomatic as to be next to impossible to transfer successfully to brass band. I know Sandy Smith is a superb arranger and we have a couple of his (including Schindler's List - bit dubious about the Eb bass tremolandos...:-)) out at the moment. I'm breathless with anticipation waiting.

Who's the publisher? I hope it's not another R. Smith & Co masterpiece!

[Nigel Hall]

String writing can be so idiomatic as to be next to impossible to transfer successfully to brass band. I know Sandy Smith is a superb arranger and we have a couple of his (including Schindler's List - bit dubious about the Eb bass tremolandos...:-)) out at the moment. I'm breathless with anticipation waiting.

Who's the publisher? I hope it's not another R. Smith & Co masterpiece!

It's published by Obrasso

[mikelyons]

Thanks Nigel. It might be reasonably accurate then! :rolleyes:

[Mesmerist]

We have been told that if you can`t double tongue soon then you won`t be playing at the Nationals as every part has some to do and we are not taking passengers.

Think he means it too as we are in a very lucky position of having quite a large pool of players.

[WoodenFlugel]

We have been told that if you can`t double tongue soon then you won`t be playing at the Nationals as every part has some to do and we are not taking passengers.

Think he means it too as we are in a very lucky position of having quite a large pool of players.
Which is all very commendable I suppose, but what about some loyalty to the players who actually got you there in the first place?

[The-Wee-Timpanist]

We have been told that if you can`t double tongue soon then you won`t be playing at the Nationals as every part has some to do and we are not taking passengers.

Think he means it too as we are in a very lucky position of having quite a large pool of players.

There is quite a bit of double tonguing in the 1st and last movements.

Percussion were told tonight that it was going to be a boring time for us but if we moaned about it we'd be made to play it perfectly!

[brassbandmaestro]

Thats always a problem, when contesting bands have a certain kind of attitude. The 'loyalty' factor sometimes goes out of the window and the players who've done the donkey work get turned away.

[lynchie]

I'm anticipating this like a kick in the balls at the moment. Any chance someone could say something nice about it?

[super_sop]

I'm anticipating this like a kick in the balls at the moment. Any chance someone could say something nice about it?
it has a nice title

[lynchie]

it has a nice title

Not helping. Mainly because it has a rubbish title. It's like one of those music books for children "My Firstest Suite for Brass" or something.

[Mesmerist]

I'm anticipating this like a kick in the balls at the moment. Any chance someone could say something nice about it?

The flugel part is fairly interesting with some fast technical bits and a couple of little solos to keep adrenaline flowing. Seemed to be quite a few doubled up parts going on - we only ran through to give us a taste - but our trombones didn`t look bored and they are very capable players.

Anyway some people would moan about whatever piece was chosen - its too old/new/boring/hard...

[Mesmerist]

Which is all very commendable I suppose, but what about some loyalty to the players who actually got you there in the first place?

To be fair the players who can double tongue did get us there...
Loyalty does count in our band but not practising is unfair on the 88% of us who do work hard and as we do have more registered players than we need some are going to have to sit this one out.
Who do you choose - the player who has been there for years but is falling behind or a relatively new player who attends regularly, is better and works harder? Not a choice I would like to make.

[grandad]

Unless the music you have written or arranged is better, and or more suitable, please please please refrain from the usual derogatory comments on two peoples very hard work.
I personally believe that most people think that transcribing music from one genre to another is easy and it's all done with the use of "Sibelius".
To say the music is easy or boring to play........ well, we shall see and as John Fletcher said "doing the simple things well is like putting money in the bank"

[m.f.cooper]

So, Lynchie, what did you think after playing it through tonight?

I enjoyed the Bass part. It doesn't seem as hard for us as I expected a finals piece to be. It may actually encourage me to sort my life out so I can join the band in Harrogate!

[The-Wee-Timpanist]

I do think its growing on me. I listened to the string version again today, and ok I do have a little hatered towards strings, but I do prefer the brass version. Its much more nicer.

[McChambo]

Fantastic piece!! Well done Sandy.

[obi-wan johnny]

I take it you're enjoying it then Jim?

I don't know if that's because

a) you like the music, :clap:
b) because it gives you a good opportunity to work the band, :hammer
c) because you think the band will eventually play it well,
d) because you think we'll win with it :woo (as everybody will freely admit - of course we will - I don't see the point of the contest - it's a foregone conclusion that any band with me and my pals are going to win everything all the time - that's why you've all heard of us and we're on telly every night entertaining you! :tongue: )

I think it's great too :tup but then again - I really liked "Carnival" and, "A Leadsman, a Lady and a Lord" so what do I know??

[DMBabe]

I take it you're enjoying it then Jim?

I don't know if that's because

a) you like the music,
b) because it gives you a good opportunity to work the band, :hammer
c) because you think the band will eventually play it well,
d) because you think we'll win with it :woo (as everybody will freely admit - of course we will - I don't see the point of the contest - it's a foregone conclusion that any band with me and my pals are going to win everything all the time - that's why you've all heard of us and we're on telly every night entertaining you! :tongue: )

I think it's great too but then again - I really liked "Carnival" and, "A Leadsman, a Lady and a Lord" so what do I know??

And another great kiss of death from the walking hex that is the webster-plumph!!!!!;)

And we all know where your taste regarding other pieces of the past resides......... Carnival indeed!:mad:

But I like this one..... it doesn't totally suck!!

[lynchie]

So, Lynchie, what did you think after playing it through tonight?

I enjoyed the Bass part. It doesn't seem as hard for us as I expected a finals piece to be. It may actually encourage me to sort my life out so I can join the band in Harrogate!

As 3rd section tests go, I quite like it. There's a couple of bits that I need to practice, and there's going to be some fun with the stylistic interpretation, ie. how do you transfer string effects to a brass band.

Pretty annoyed about the first page turn which is stupid. Honestly, with modern typesetting software, how do things like that get through? It's just lazy. Also, there's a high C that has an "optional" lower octave - that's just a cop out, any decent first trombone should get that. I hope anyone that sticks it down an octave gets pulled up on it. (probably means I'll split it all over the wall at Harrogate)

[MRSH]

My band has played through this once so I won’t comment on their reaction to it just yet.

However, looking through the score the first thing that struck me is that this arrangement is probably playable by a ten piece. If you look at all the doubling of parts and strip them out what is left is a pretty dire arrangement of a pretty dire string piece. And there is stuff in the scoring that just does not make sense. And how many times does ‘quasi pizz.’ need to be written!!!!

Lynchie mentioned the typesetting of the parts. Well, the score is no better. The standard is rank. And I wonder when the errata is going to appear??

Earlier in the thread Mike Lyons mentioned about why we can’t have original pieces chosen. I’m with him on this one. If this piece is the best the selection committee can come up with then I feel sorry for all the upcoming composers in our movement. They must be frustrated as hell.

[Lyndon Price]

My band has played through this once so I won’t comment on their reaction to it just yet.

However, looking through the score the first thing that struck me is that this arrangement is probably playable by a ten piece. If you look at all the doubling of parts and strip them out what is left is a pretty dire arrangement of a pretty dire string piece. And there is stuff in the scoring that just does not make sense. And how many times does ‘quasi pizz.’ need to be written!!!!

Lynchie mentioned the typesetting of the parts. Well, the score is no better. The standard is rank. And I wonder when the errata is going to appear??

Earlier in the thread Mike Lyons mentioned about why we can’t have original pieces chosen. I’m with him on this one. If this piece is the best the selection committee can come up with then I feel sorry for all the upcoming composers in our movement. They must be frustrated as hell.
I absolutley agree. Please give us original music written for BRASS BAND!!!!!! A phone bill arrangement

[lynchie]

Lynchie mentioned the typesetting of the parts. Well, the score is no better. The standard is rank. And I wonder when the errata is going to appear??


How does this get through? There were similar problems in Dark Side, and yet both these pieces have been composed/arranged by experienced bandsmen. Surely they understand the annoyance of having a part or score which borders on unusable simply because the typesetter hasn't thought through the layout!

In my part, for example, putting the page turn just one line later, would have allowed it to be in a nice big rest. It takes all of about 5 seconds to sort out that sort of thing in Sibelius (or it did 5 years ago, maybe the software has regressed).

[Nigel Hall]

In my part, for example, putting the page turn just one line later, would have allowed it to be in a nice big rest. It takes all of about 5 seconds to sort out that sort of thing in Sibelius (or it did 5 years ago, maybe the software has regressed).

It is really easy to do (although with some pieces it isn't always easy to find a good place to put in a page break) - which makes you think either a) The Publisher/Typesetter is lazy or b) The Publisher/Typesetter doesn't understand the software they are using or c) They don't care! or a combination of the three.

[Mesmerist]

Started work on my part tonight and it is not as easy as it first looks. Bar 535 is a real stinker. That low octave jump down to g at speed is not nice.

[MRSH]

Bar 535 is a real stinker. That low octave jump down to g at speed is not nice.Make it easy on yourself then and miss out the first quaver of the bar ;)

[lynchie]

It is really easy to do (although with some pieces it isn't always easy to find a good place to put in a page break) - which makes you think either a) The Publisher/Typesetter is lazy or b) The Publisher/Typesetter doesn't understand the software they are using or c) They don't care! or a combination of the three.

But surely the copies are sent back to the composer for approval, and it's there that I don't understand how this happens. 25 parts of what? 8 pages max? 4 page turns? Wouldn't take more than a couple of days to check through.

These are experienced bandsmen who must surely have been frustrated by inumerable poorly planned page turns, so why not take the time to make sure their work is as good as it can be?

[MRSH]

But surely the copies are sent back to the composer for approval, and it's there that I don't understand how this happens. 25 parts of what? 8 pages max? 4 page turns? Wouldn't take more than a couple of days to check through.Days???? :eek: An hour or two at the most.

These are experienced bandsmen who must surely have been frustrated by innumerable poorly planned page turns, so why not take the time to make sure their work is as good as it can be?I'm not convinced composers/arrangers are given any say in the typesetting and appearance of their pieces. Indeed, who proof reads the score - not only for notational discrepancies but layout and logistical issues too? In the case of Suite for Brass - obviously nobody!!!! :mad:

[lynchie]

Days???? :eek: An hour or two at the most.


I was being nice and allowing for not wanting to do the whole lot in one go. Still it's not the end of the world. I find it interesting you say the composers don't have a say in the typesetting. There's no way I'd allow any of my work to be published without me seeing it first, that's just needlessly leaving yourself open to criticism.

Any composers/arrangers want to comment?

[MRSH]

I was being nice and allowing for not wanting to do the whole lot in one go. Still it's not the end of the world. I find it interesting you say the composers don't have a say in the typesetting. There's no way I'd allow any of my work to be published without me seeing it first, that's just needlessly leaving yourself open to criticism.

Any composers/arrangers want to comment?Absolutely. I never ever let any of my stuff get published before I see it first. Although, to be fair, the two publishers I have used did always send the stuff back to me for final sign off. And now I even go as far as to set the layout for the score and parts before I even send it to them for the first time.

I wish all publishers would take that extra bit of care. After all, it's not as though we actually 'want' to buy some of this stuff. ;)

[Brian Bowen]

I was being nice and allowing for not wanting to do the whole lot in one go. Still it's not the end of the world. I find it interesting you say the composers don't have a say in the typesetting. There's no way I'd allow any of my work to be published without me seeing it first, that's just needlessly leaving yourself open to criticism.

Any composers/arrangers want to comment?

A lot depends on the company publishing the music. Reputable ones would normally have an editor prepare a score before it is typeset, or at least check it afterwards. A skilled, experienced "engraver" will know about adequate page turns. Even so, the publisher and particularly the proofreader should still check to see it is done properly. However, I've no doubt some publishers dispense with editors and proofreaders, not to mention using amateurish "engravers", or simply reproduce the composer/arranger's score (and parts if available) to save money. (Look at the scores Chandos issue of Gordon Langford's music.) Unfortunately, not all composers are good at proofreading either.

[mikelyons]

We're still waiting for this to arrive. But in general terms, there is absolutely no excuse for sloppy typesetting these days and absolutely no excuse for there to be mistakes in the score or parts, although the practice of sending a proof to the composer (and/or a complimentary copy) seems to be slipping. It can be relatively expensive for small publishers to send out complimentary copies (though an electronic one doesn't cost anything) so I can understand whay they don't often do it.

As for composers proofing their own works. It can sometimes be a good thing, but I often find I suffer from 'note-blindness' when trying to proof a piece I've been working on for a long time. Even listening to it - you hear what you think you wrote not what you writ! :roll:

[Nigel Hall]

Now we're getting into a whole different subject. As a Publisher I expect the composers to have checked the notes before they send a score to me but I will query anything that sounds "odd", I only send a score back for checking if the score has come in in manuscript and I've had to put it into Sibelius myself.

I have a "House style" for layout so that the music I sell has a uniform look about it but I do try very hard, on our major works, to have page turns either at the start or end of some bars rest but as I said it isn't always easy to do. I have a couple of pieces that my printers hate because they have three different layouts for parts to accomodate page turns. For those interested I have attached a check sheet that I send to the printers to show them how the parts need to be printed.

[mikelyons]

I'm not having a go at any of my publishers who are doing a sterling job! It's the so-called big boys who churn out photocopies of test pieces 40 years old with exactly the same mistakes they had 40 years ago.

It's the people who publish new pieces and then a fortnight later send out an erratum that is longer than the piece. It's the ring of 5 who work together and rip-off the banding community by producing poor quality improperly proofed music to the detriment of the banding world.

BTW, any sign of Scherzo? :-)

[Mesmerist]

Make it easy on yourself then and miss out the first quaver of the bar ;)

Now that is why you are an MD and I am not. WHY didn`t I think of that.:oops: Never mind - solo horn covers it all anyway!

[brassbandmaestro]

Why is it at these major contests, the standard of publication is so rank. Every year, practically, there are always complaints about the way the typset is. Why cant the panel of the Nationals get their act together.

[MRSH]

Why is it at these major contests, the standard of publication is so rank. Every year, practically, there are always complaints about the way the typeset is. Why cant the panel of the Nationals get their act together.I don't think you can blame the panel of the Nationals for badly typeset and non-proof-read music. If Suite for Brass hadn't been chosen for the Nationals the score and parts would still be on sale in the state that it is now. It just so happens the Nationals panel chose a piece in this state.

I think what most people (recently) are saying on here is that the (rank) standard of published music is prevalent throughout the majority of 'top' publishers (Anglo Music excepted as I have never found an error in the music of PS!!) and is only highlighted because one of those pieces has been chosen for the Nationals.

Music I have bought recently from Obrasso, Wright and Round and Studio have been so badly typeset I would, quite frankly, be highly embarrassed letting them out to the public. (And when I DID by from Bernaerts, which is not for many years now, they were equally as bad, if not the worst.)

As many have already said - there is just absolutely no excuse for bad workmanship. In any other trade some of the publishers on the market would have been struck off.

[mikelyons]

I think the panel ought to consider this when selecting a piece as it is much more important that there be no mistakes in the printed copies than with a concert piece. A band's placing could depend on it!

[PeterBale]

I think the panel ought to consider this when selecting a piece as it is much more important that there be no mistakes in the printed copies than with a concert piece. A band's placing could depend on it!

I agree with Mike here, and I don't see any reason why the selection of a piece shouldn't be conditional on a good quality set of parts and score being made available before the announcement is made. Selection for the Areas in particular will guarantee a large number of sales, and such a stipulation may at make them get their act together.

[mikelyons]

The only problem with that idea is - what would the panel do if the company failed to stick to the agreement? At the end of the day, they need a piece for the contest. Maybe they could boycott the company the following year?

[brassbandmaestro]

I think the panel ought to consider this when selecting a piece as it is much more important that there be no mistakes in the printed copies than with a concert piece. A band's placing could depend on it!

Maybe that was what I was actually trying to say mikelyons. Surely, when the panel does peruse through music, they realise that there are errors, etc on the score.

If their criteria was that of the errors, then I suspect, we would be having hardly any test pieces whatsoever!

[Anglo Music Press]

I agree with Mike here, and I don't see any reason why the selection of a piece shouldn't be conditional on a good quality set of parts and score being made available before the announcement is made. Selection for the Areas in particular will guarantee a large number of sales, and such a stipulation may at make them get their act together.

Not all composers use computers yet, and it's not unknown for a publisher to only to take a (large) piece once it has been selected for a contest - so that sensible suggestion can't work all the time.

It's also unreasonable to expect the Music Panel to proof pieces before they are selected. The only solution is for the Panel only to use publishers with a proven record and to make the point to others that, if a piece causes problems, then their cataloge won't be considered in the future.

Proofing properly is an art which can take years to learn - unfortunately too many publishers apparently rely on cheap alternatives!

[mikelyons]

I think that kind of policy would bode well for AMP, eh Philip?

I assume the music panel listen to the music before they make a decision, with a score, hopefully? Shouldn't they be able to spot bad typesetting/mistooks during their appraisal? I could!

[KMJ Recordings]

I assume the music panel listen to the music before they make a decision, with a score, hopefully?

Not necessarily - it depends on the piece and whether or not there's a recording available.

I've heard anecdotal evidence that sometimes works are even presented in sketch form rather than in full score which follows later. How true this is I wouldn't like to say.

I'll nail my colours to the mast - there's no excuse with new pieces for them to be issued with errors. I appreciate fully Philip's point about some people still using quills, but at some point the dots have to be typeset.

And they should be checked.

Errors being discovered, for instance, two days before a major contest shouldn't be acceptable.

The use of 'old' pieces that are potentially strewn with misprints from generations ago is an interesting one. Should the publishers re-set everything electronically and then check them for consistency? Who pays the costs involved? Are test pieces expensive enough already without passing on the costs of re-setting to the end user? Is it fairer on the Bands to use the set they've had since 1946 but issue a set of known issues along with the contest entry form?

Interesting conundrum (and before anyone says anything, I know what I'd like as a player - but what about the bigger picture? OK some places should never be used again after an almighty stuff up ....).

Answers on a postcard.

Anyway, is this piece any good? I've not heard it yet :eek:

[KMJ Recordings]

Proofing properly is an art which can take years to learn - unfortunately too many publishers apparently rely on cheap alternatives!

Like beta testing on the artistes :rolleyes:

[MRSH]

Should the publishers re-set everything electronically and then check them for consistency?Yes.
Who pays the costs involved?The publishers. By re-setting them and checking for errors then correcting those errors and then selling them, error free (at huge cost ;)) to all the bands in the contest - 20ish for the finals or many, many, many more for the Areas - would enhance the reputation of that particular publisher beyond recognition.
Are test pieces expensive enough already without passing on the costs of re-setting to the end user? Yes they are expensive enough already and bands feel really let down (I'm being polite) if they are 'forced' to buy a piece they then find out is riddled with errors.
Is it fairer on the Bands to use the set they've had since 1946 but issue a set of known issues along with the contest entry form?No. It isn't fair at all. It is 1) a bad judgement on the part of the selection committee and 2) lazy on the part of the publishers.
Anyway, is this piece any good? I've not heard it yet :eek:It's wonderful if you want to play it on a wet Sunday afternoon in the park to one man and is dog ;)

[KMJ Recordings]

So it's not on the plan for the CD then? :D

FWIW I agree with what you're saying (although the market forces would dictate that any incurred costs would be passed on to the end user unless it's an extreme case....hasn't there been one of those recently?)....I was just posing the questions ;)

[KMJ Recordings]

But what would there be to discuss if pieces were error free?

Oh, hang on, the miscarriages of justice that are the results ;)

[MRSH]

So it's not on the plan for the CD then?It might be if we win ;)
FWIW I agree with what you're saying (although the market forces would dictate that any incurred costs would be passed on to the end user unless it's an extreme case....hasn't there been one of those recently?)....I was just posing the questions ;)Hmm - yes Aardvark and I have just been arguing about this for the last half hour :eek:

[KMJ Recordings]

Domestic! :hammer

[brassbandmaestro]

Aferiston, I think is the word for use here.

One idea, perhaps, is that the panel goes through each score with a toothpick(which I am sure they do anyway), and if there are any erratae, they should approach the publishing company concerned, ask them to correct them and issue the new edition at the same price as before. Dream land perhaps!!

[Anglo Music Press]

Aferiston, I think is the word for use here.

One idea, perhaps, is that the panel goes through each score with a toothpick(which I am sure they do anyway), and if there are any erratae, they should approach the publishing company concerned, ask them to correct them and issue the new edition at the same price as before. Dream land perhaps!!

Yes, dreamland is right! :)

Firstly, I don't see why the Panel members should do the publisher's job for them and, secondly, it would take me between 3 and 5 days to proof a 15-minute piece (score and parts) properly. I don't know how many pieces they have submitted but even if it's only a few this is too much to expect. They get a lot of stick as it is - what would happen if they missed an error??

Brass band music has always been too cheap. Most concert band pieces (bigger sets, I grant you) are around the £100 - 150 and this is in part a reflection of extra editorial care that concert band publishers (who in general are, dare I say, more professional) feel they can 'factor in'.

[KMJ Recordings]

Firstly, I don't see why the Panel members should do the publisher's job for them and, secondly, it would take me between 3 and 5 days to proof a 15-minute piece (score and parts) properly. I don't know how many pieces they have submitted but even if it's only a few this is too much to expect. They get a lot of stick as it is - what would happen if they missed an error??

Brass band music has always been too cheap. Most concert band pieces (bigger sets, I grant you) are around the £100 - 150 and this is in part a reflection of extra editorial care that concert band publishers (who in general are, dare I say, more professional) feel they can 'factor in'.

Agreed.

It's the "we want something for nothing" syndrome to an extent....and you (sometimes) get what you pay for.

I do think, though, that professional pride and reputation should play a part in making sure the pieces are sold with as few errors as possible. Of course, it's terrifically easy to miss something and one or two may creep in.

It's errata lists the size of War and Peace that I object to.

[Nigel Hall]

I do think, though, that professional pride and reputation should play a part in making sure the pieces are sold with as few errors as possible. Of course, it's terrifically easy to miss something and one or two may creep in.

It's errata lists the size of War and Peace that I object to.

I agree, Keith. I do everything I can to ensure anything I publish is correct in score and parts but occasionally (and I do mean occasionally) I have missed an incorrect note or two and when that has happened I will always replace the score (if needed) and the offending part(s) free of charge.

[brassbandmaestro]

Actually, Philip, I dont think I really meant the Panel should do the publisher's job, per se, but once they have checked the score, and have seen the various erattae, then perhaps they should approach the publishing company concerned, and put forward the errors they have observed, and suggest about publishing a new edition of the music in question.

[mikelyons]

Some scores that were published years ago and which have had errata reported to the publisher are still sent out with the same errors. I appreciate that most older scores were not electronically published originally, but it is easy enough to correct that now in most cases.

There is the possibility that bands/MDs have not reported every erratum to the publisher/composer, but some should have made it through!:roll:

[mikelyons]

Well, OK. First impressions:

Take English Folk Song Suite, the Holst suites and a few of Rutters blander touches and you've more-or-less got it. It's a bit cheesy, but it's interesting, at least. There's a couple of nice bits, a few bars of technique for the basses, some 'nice' harmonies as you would expect from Rutter. Sandy Smiths orchestration is superb as you might expect.

Definitely better than DSOTM, certainly more interesting than DSOTM. But definitely cheesy.

[judgement withheld]More later[/judgement withheld]

[DMBabe]

I agree Mr Lyons. My first impression was it's the illegitimate lovechild of all of those "folk songy" suites, but I like it ( for somewhat selfish reasons cos the flugel part ain't dull).

Nice tunes and stuff to do for most people. Yes it's cheesy but at least people might want to listen to it more than twice?:clap::clap::clap:

[mikelyons]

It's just a pity it wasn't an original piece written originally for band - like the Holst suites were.

I think Rutter was trying to follow in the footsteps of all the early 20th century composers who had collected and composed suites of folk songs, but I don't think his heart was in it.

I think I'm probably the only member of Eagley who likes it. Our BBb basses definitely don't.

[brassneck]

I've just discovered that I have a recording of John Rutter conducting this suite from the 2004 album Distant Land (http://www.amazon.co.uk/Distant-Land/dp/B0002847KY/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&s=music&qid=1216857755&sr=1-2). I think it has other touches as well as Holst. Copland & Arnold I can hear in the first two movements. As with all string orchestra arrangements, it will be interesting how conductors will approach the idea of articulation.

[mikelyons]

Beware the conductor who doesn't allow the basses to take the quasi pizz seriously. It's going to be a bit tricky to handle the different articulations. The poor BBbs seem to be just pizzing about all through the first movement. It'll need a delicate touch to not sound like a brick falling down a well. Our BB is complaining about his part already.

How closely to the orchestral articulation can 3rd section bands get? Is that what the arranger wants? What exactly do you mean by both the quasi pizz and dot dash articulations, Mr Smith? Can you tell us? Is the second just a reinforcement of the first to avoid nasty hard staccatissimo sounds?

Tips, anyone?
Is there a band recording of it?

[lynchie]

So we don't just pluck the tuning slide??? Hmm a rethink is needed.

[mikelyons]

Actually, Lynchie, the bones have to flick the main slide, while playing :D

[brassneck]

dot dash articulations

Although Sandy is best equipped to answer what he wants here, I wonder if it emulates bowed staccato, which is a longer note value than brass players would naturally interpret?

[mikelyons]

agreed, but why, then, mark the same part quasi pizz?

[brassneck]

agreed, but why, then, mark the same part quasi pizz?

quasi=resembling
pizz=plucked (as opposed to bowed)

(both together would determine length of note being longer creating a more resonant effect)

[steve butler]

How closely to the orchestral articulation can 3rd section bands get? Is that what the arranger wants? What exactly do you mean by both the quasi pizz and dot dash articulations, Mr Smith? Can you tell us? Is the second just a reinforcement of the first to avoid nasty hard staccatissimo sounds?

Tips, anyone?
Is there a band recording of it?
I think the dot dash is as you say just to help explain to the less experienced (no patronishment intended :wink:) the desired effect. It just needs to be a nice "pinged" attack with a nice tail off to the note, just try and reproduce the sound of a string plucked etc etc.
I tend to feel more of an electric bass type of sound. Great effect when you get it right.
Please ignore me if I'm being obvious and boring :D

[Mesmerist]

You are never boring Mr B. Our Conductor plays cello and has threatened to bring it in and demonstrate exactly what he wants. Sectionals start next week. Oh joy. Though selfishly i don`t mind as the flugel probably has the most interesting part compared to the basses.

[PeterBale]

Although Sandy is best equipped to answer what he wants here, I wonder if it emulates bowed staccato, which is a longer note value than brass players would naturally interpret?

Most brass players habitually play anything supposed to be pizzicato far too short, without giving the note time to die away properly. This applies all the more so with the larger instruments. It is certainly a difficult effect to bring off, tricky enough as a solo player, but all the more so when playing as a section.

[Mesmerist]

Although Sandy is best equipped to answer what he wants here, I wonder if it emulates bowed staccato, which is a longer note value than brass players would naturally interpret?

Never mind Sandy (no offence!) - but its all about what Stan and Ken want that we have to try and guess is it not?

[brassneck]

The CD recording I have tends to emphasise the bass fiddles and the pizzicato notes (1st mvt.) due to the reverb and without a score I cannot compare the upper fiddle note values. The bass notes come over as much longer than them.

[Mesmerist]

brassneck - who are you playing for if you do not mind me asking? I look forward to putting faces to all these names in September though I do not suppose any of us are what we expect! DMBabe will be a cracker though I just know,

[brassneck]

brassneck - who are you playing for if you do not mind me asking? I look forward to putting faces to all these names in September though I do not suppose any of us are what we expect! DMBabe will be a cracker though I just know,

- at the moment, bandless! Work (and recent dental problems, now fixed) have been hampering any committment I can offer, but I did help out a band I was a regular member of years ago (Broxburn) for the 1st section at the Areas this year. I spend my spare time now trying to hone my technique doodling (http://www.sibeliusmusic.com/cgi-bin/user_page.pl?url=tomsongsuk) for band!

[McChambo]

its all about what Stan and Ken want that we have to try and guess is it not?

I thought it was Stan and Kevin?? Maybe it's Deidre and Ken??

Couldn't agree more though. I could spend absolutely ages with my band searching for the correct length of pizzicato notes with this piece, just to end up with an overall performance that sounds ridiculous to the men in the box! I'm certainly not spending too much of my rehearsal time trying to emulate a string orchestra to the Nth degree. I'm trying to get the basics right first. "Artistry begins where perfection ends".

[lynchie]

Whatever happens, whoever wins, the thing you'll hear in the bar more than anything else...

"That wasn't ****** quasi pizz! We played ****** quasi pizz ****** brilliantly, my mate said so!"

[Mesmerist]

[quote=McChambo;614172]I thought it was Stan and Kevin?? Maybe it's Deidre and Ken??

More apologies. Yes it is Kevin and Stanley. Sorry.Slip of the fingers due to small glass of red wine and a late night...:oops:

[mikelyons]

Are you sure it's not Stan and Ollie? No doubt opinions will vary after the match :-)

[stopher]

I think the panel ought to consider this when selecting a piece as it is much more important that there be no mistakes in the printed copies than with a concert piece. A band's placing could depend on it!

It does - a few years back in Pontins, I found out the night before I was using the old unedited version which I had bought from the publishers for the contest. The errata didn't match at all so thought I had a new version until the SOp player we borrowed at last minute turned up with a different part - had an extra 3 pages!

No bones about coming last but would have been nice to have been on a level playing field from the start!

[Sopfonix]

We have been told that if you can`t double tongue soon then you won`t be playing at the Nationals as every part has some to do and we are not taking passengers.

Blinkin' flip that's me out of the equation then :clap:

[mikelyons]

Although I think it's a good incentive for you all to practice, I think it is quite unacceptable to prevent you from going to the Nationals that you earned a place in by winning/getting a prize in your area if it proves beyond you in the time left. I sincerely hope your band is not going to be bringing in ringers.

[steve butler]

I'm sure its just a ploy to make people who think they can't, actually have a go at learning the skill.
You as an occasional wagger must have used similar tactics in the past Mike?

[Mesmerist]

Although I think it's a good incentive for you all to practice, I think it is quite unacceptable to prevent you from going to the Nationals that you earned a place in by winning/getting a prize in your area if it proves beyond you in the time left. I sincerely hope your band is not going to be bringing in ringers.


Alls fair in war and contests? Ringers? What us? No its a threat he means as we are lucky enough to have more players than we need so the team will be selected on ability not sentiment. But its an incentive to practice and its working. We played Prisms tonight and Force of Destiny on Monday and both pieces are within our capabilities now. There are probably only 2 players not keeping up at the moment but I am sure that they will, and there are 3 players who have made enormous progress.:)

[mikelyons]

I remember a big debate last year about bands who bring in outsiders just for the contest. I may have used threats sometimes steve, but I would probably never consider replacing people who have worked hard and loyally with outsiders/fly-by-nights. I'm not that unprincipled. I want to win, but I want to win fairly. Winning by cheating rather defeats the object.

But let's not open that can of worms here.

Mezzy, I'm glad you are getting better. That's what the whole thing is about. If it didn't improve people there would be absolutely no point in contesting.

[brassbandmaestro]

Here we go again. Ringers! If a band has qualified for 'The Nationals' on their own merit without 'ringers', then surely, simple logic would tell them that their own members are fully capable of doing the job themsevles. Years ago I was depped but back in those days, I was'nt experienced enough for contests. Also, a different scenario, someone else played a small section of the piece that we were doing, but playing top E at pp, was rather difficult then. But as I was saying earlier, there is no need to put in ringers when a band has sufficient talent within its own ranks.

[Mesmerist]

How many "Ringers" constitutes cheating? one? two? Ten?
In answer to your question about Verwood playing ringers - we won`t be bringing in outsiders who didn`t help us get to the Nationals but we do have 3 new players since the Area Contest in March who have become regular members. All 3 are experienced at Championship level. Does this mean we are somehow cheating if we use them just because they were not with us in March?

[mikelyons]

As I said, it's a can of worms. I would trust your honesty that these new members are here for the duration, but I'm not sure they should be used to push people out who played in the areas. If those people have left or moved to a different position or for some other reason aren't in those seats, then I suppose it's not cheating. However, if they are being used to replace people who played for you in the areas... we're on dodgy ground again.

BBM, it's a sad state of affairs, but the perception is that there are unscrupulous MDs out there who seem to want to win at any cost. They are quite happy to replace as many members of their qualifying band with outsiders from higher sections or of a better standard than their current players just because they are so desperate to win. I'm not sure anyone has named these people, but a few of them have shown their faces on tMP and more-or-less admitted that they think it's OK to do that - ergo, if they had the opportunity to do so they would. There have been disgruntled players commenting in various threads over the years complaining of having come out on the rough side of such activities. I appreciate that some of these remarks may have simply been sour grapes, but where there's smoke...

[steve butler]

Ringers? Worms? dodgy ground?
They are members, end of story. Sounds like Verwood are on pretty solid ground to me.

Trumpetmaest (via tubamaest) described brass bands as akin to a train journey :- people get on for a while then maybe step off down the line, whereupon new passengers join for the ride.
(apologies Richards if words not too accurately assembled).
Go Verwood and make the most of the strong position you find yourselves in.

[brassbandmaestro]

Yeah I know Mike. If some bands are prepared to do that, fair enough. It's just not right in my book. If an MD replaces say 3/4s of the band with ringers, then I feel the band in question is not that band and with the vast majority of that said band not performing, then they should be disqualified on the spot.

I have always felt that bands should qualify on their own merits and not from other sources. Fair enough, if they have to fill in for players for those unexpected situations that come up, ok. But I still feel that if MDs are going to do this, then I hope they have a sensible discussion with the band beforehand.

[mikelyons]

Trumpetmaest (via tubamaest) described brass bands as akin to a train journey :- people get on for a while then maybe step off down the line, whereupon new passengers join for the ride.
(apologies Richards if words not too accurately assembled).
Go Verwood and make the most of the strong position you find yourselves in.

I'm not saying or implying that Verwood would cheat in this way, but it's grossly unfair on other bands who are trying to win fairly with the personnel they already have if other bands are playing people who have only joined up to play in the contest and it's even more unfair on those people who worked their arses off to get the band to qualify in the areas.

Maybe it's just me, but my sense of fair play tells me that if you have to cheat to win it's not worth winning.

[steve butler]

My sense of fair play also tells me the same. But if you aint breaking the rules then you aint cheating.
And if you keep arguing with me I shall have to challenge you to a duel at dawn!
Pistols or bare knuckles? :wink: :D

Or bows and arrows?

[brassbandmaestro]

My sense of fair play also tells me the same. But if you aint breaking the rules then you aint cheating.
And if you keep arguing with me I shall have to challenge you to a duel at dawn!
Pistols or bare knuckles? :wink: :D

Or bows and arrows?

Or with dead ringers!!!:)

[mikelyons]

My sense of fair play also tells me the same. But if you aint breaking the rules then you aint cheating.
And if you keep arguing with me I shall have to challenge you to a duel at dawn!
Pistols or bare knuckles? :wink: :D

Or bows and arrows?

For a moment there I thought you were going to threaten to spank me!

[steve butler]

Ok, slippers at dawn it is then :D

[Mesmerist]

Ok, slippers at dawn it is then :D

Would that be your special soft pink fluffy ones?

Mikelyons all 3 new players are sound true bandies. Mark who joined us after Whit friday has moved into the area from oop north and has been given the Sop seat by the person who was in it who felt that he was stronger. She is a quality cornet player and now on the front row. Mark is quietly and voluntarily coming to band early to help 2 other cornet players improve their double -tonguing - thats how good a bandsman he is. (And he is a lovely bloke as well, always smiling and joking).
This is off- topic but the reason we got Mark was because when he moved here he sent e-mails to 13 local bands and we were the first to reply and only one other band bothered a few weeks later. Lesson there chaps - you lost a fine player through laziness.
The other 2 have been friends for years and are happy to sit anywhere though because of their musicianship will probably take solo positions. Don`t tell me that Eagley band wouldn`t be happy to do the same in our position. Haven`t Oldham-Lees just signed up a YBS horn player? They are in our section too. Its not cheating - its being the best that you can be with what you have got.:)

[steve butler]

Would that be your special soft pink fluffy ones?

Mikelyons all 3 new players are sound true bandies. Mark who joined us after Whit friday has moved into the area from oop north and has been given the Sop seat by the person who was in it who felt that he was stronger. She is a quality cornet player and now on the front row. Mark is quietly and voluntarily coming to band early to help 2 other cornet players improve their double -tonguing - thats how good a bandsman he is. (And he is a lovely bloke as well, always smiling and joking).
This is off- topic but the reason we got Mark was because when he moved here he sent e-mails to 13 local bands and we were the first to reply and only one other band bothered a few weeks later. Lesson there chaps - you lost a fine player through laziness.
The other 2 have been friends for years and are happy to sit anywhere though because of their musicianship will probably take solo positions. Don`t tell me that Eagley band wouldn`t be happy to do the same in our position. Haven`t Oldham-Lees just signed up a YBS horn player? They are in our section too. Its not cheating - its being the best that you can be with what you have got.:)
:clap:
Mega post Messy!

I think this is where the power of the pm can come in, where people can find the full facts if they so wish, before launching into any "bandwagon"y type posting.

PS I have some nice pink patent leather jobees ready for Mr Lyons ;)

[Mesmerist]

Sorry Mr B was I going off on one?

Sorry everyone I should have pm`d that one.

[mikelyons]

I think you need to read my post again sweetie. I said I would trust your probity in this matter.

However, I would not be happy about fielding ringers if that meant that the peeps who played at Blackpool and won through coudn't play at Harrogate.

I don't know if they have. I don't really follow them that closely. However, I would be a bit annoyed if this player is signing with them just for the contest and it is putting their original horn player in a different position or off the stage.

Actually, it is cheating. Morally, if not within the contest written rules.
You are also cheating your players of their earned place at the Nationals after getting you the place in the Areas.

Let's agree to differ on this. If you want to read over the old arguments, look 'em up on here.

[steve butler]

Not in the least, knowing Mike though he'll be chewing away on a bone or one of my slippers and come back with another reposte :wink:

ha ha ha ha ha - see what I mean, he even beat me to my reply :D

[Mesmerist]

Mr B. should YOU wish to become a ringer please can we nab you first as your expertise and other qualities would add greatly to my own personal enjoyment of band nights.

[steve butler]

Hey, I'll gladly ring your bell any day :D

I feel like an unofficial Verwoodian already
Goooooooooooooooooooo Verwood (thats a long go - not just something goooooey)

[brassbandmaestro]

I'm in the wrong part of the country, I think.

[Mesmerist]

I'm in the wrong part of the country, I think.

Not at all. You are very welcome too :biggrin:

[DMBabe]

brassneck - who are you playing for if you do not mind me asking? I look forward to putting faces to all these names in September though I do not suppose any of us are what we expect! DMBabe will be a cracker though I just know,

You have no idea how right you are! I'm actually a dark haired irish male pensioner with thick glasses........ It's a cracker!!!!;)

[mikelyons]

Well, I'm still enjoying Suite for Brass. There's enough in it to keep me happy that it could almost have been written or arranged with me in mind. When I'm not playing there's nice bits to listen to and when I am playing I have a good share of the cello part with lots of loverly high stuff.

I just wonder how close the the orchestral version the adjudicators will expect it to be? Is anyone doing masterclasses on it, like they did for the areas?

[The-Wee-Timpanist]

Don't want to be the one to tell him it's like carnival..... had to hide all sharp objects during that so he wouldn't top himself with how pants it was!:eek:

Well, how is he finding it? We spent a lot of time on the first movement on Monday and well, I think i was snoozing on top of the bass drum for quite a while until David turned round and asked if I was still awake. Needless to say we've been told to bring something to do :lol:
A lot of work for the brass peeps mind...

And, just to rub it in, we now have 6 percussionists - but I'm still the only female.

[Mesmerist]

We played it out at our local Rustic Fayre yesterday. Not all in one go as that old favourite "Floral Dance" was requested twice. Luckily when his wife asked for it (FD) later on (all day job this) a fine and discerning gentleman paid us £10 NOT to play it.
I completely missed the counter melody part out in the 3rd Mvt. Admittedly not feeling very well and spaced out on Beechams but how bad is that? Never done that before. Everyone else played well except for a horn getting adrift at DD but then he was a dep and sight-reading so good effort to him. The piece had a good reaction from the audience though it has to be said.

[DMBabe]

Well, how is he finding it? We spent a lot of time on the first movement on Monday and well, I think i was snoozing on top of the bass drum for quite a while until David turned round and asked if I was still awake. Needless to say we've been told to bring something to do :lol:
A lot of work for the brass peeps mind...

And, just to rub it in, we now have 6 percussionists - but I'm still the only female.
6 Rach! That's just greedy! Surely they'll not all be on stage cos that'll look mental!:eek:
Him indoors is infintiely happier now that we have our requisite 3 (one of whom is a proper tuned playing type). Although he did text me to whinge about how some bit in the 1st movt is "tricky". No pleasing him.:roll: Also he is the only bloke but that doesn't seem to bother him?

We played it out at our local Rustic Fayre yesterday. Not all in one go as that old favourite "Floral Dance" was requested twice. Luckily when his wife asked for it (FD) later on (all day job this) a fine and discerning gentleman paid us £10 NOT to play it.
I completely missed the counter melody part out in the 3rd Mvt. Admittedly not feeling very well and spaced out on Beechams but how bad is that? Never done that before. Everyone else played well except for a horn getting adrift at DD but then he was a dep and sight-reading so good effort to him. The piece had a good reaction from the audience though it has to be said.
We did movts 3+4 at a concert a couple of weeks ago and it went down really well. Normally I would hate doing a test piece in a concert but this one is full of punter friendly tunes which makes a nice change.

[brassbandmaestro]

If some people dont have much to do and have been asked to bring some occupational therapy along, they should bring their lap top with them and come on tmp!!

[mikelyons]

I'm a little bug eyed at the selection committee failing to do something for the percussionists again. The very fact that it was originally a string piece doesn't give much hope of there being some percussion parts. Even a top arranger like Sandy Smith couldn't very well insert a part of marimba or full-on kit, though that slow movement might benefit from a tad more percussion. Triangle, maybe? ;)

[The-Wee-Timpanist]

6 Rach! That's just greedy! Surely they'll not all be on stage cos that'll look mental!:eek:
Him indoors is infintiely happier now that we have our requisite 3 (one of whom is a proper tuned playing type). Although he did text me to whinge about how some bit in the 1st movt is "tricky". No pleasing him.:roll: Also he is the only bloke but that doesn't seem to bother him?

No, fortunately all 6 of us won't be there. Not sure who is playing what yet.
I've been focussing my attention on the glock part as I rather like it. Which part did he find tricky in the 1st mvt? I'm intrigued!

I don't mind being the only female - just sometimes feel that I'm left to do all the tidying up and sorting the music out. In saying that I was the only percussionist there tonight and I cleaned our section so if any of them dare mess it up they're for it! (I hope they see this and take hint ;))

I'm a little bug eyed at the selection committee failing to do something for the percussionists again. The very fact that it was originally a string piece doesn't give much hope of there being some percussion parts. Even a top arranger like Sandy Smith couldn't very well insert a part of marimba or full-on kit, though that slow movement might benefit from a tad more percussion. Triangle, maybe? ;)

Vibraphone woulld be nice in parts I think. Triangle may be pushing it a tad though!!! :lol:

[lynchie]

I'm beginning to look forward to actually playing this with the band... only a couple of weeks to go till our first rehearsal!

[Mesmerist]

Our team sheet is up so we have a few disappointed players. Contest Band rehearsals start on thursday for the chosen ones but our percussion are being given time off I think as they may get too bored.

[steve butler]

Hope you made the first team Mezz :D

[Mesmerist]

Hope you made the first team Mezz :D


Only just Mr B, only just...

ps we still can make room for you if you fancy being a "ringer"? Go on, you know how much it will annoy Mike Lyons.:biggrin:

[DMBabe]

No, fortunately all 6 of us won't be there. Not sure who is playing what yet.
I've been focussing my attention on the glock part as I rather like it. Which part did he find tricky in the 1st mvt? I'm intrigued!
:lol:

Dunno but he seems generally to be a snare whacker! it's probably not hard at all he just likes to make people think he's having to work hard....first time for everything!;)

[The-Wee-Timpanist]

Dunno but he seems generally to be a snare whacker! it's probably not hard at all he just likes to make people think he's having to work hard....first time for everything!;)

I'm not sure how the snare part really goes in the 1st mvt as I avoid snare/drum kit at all costs! :lol: I do vaguely remember some off beats near the beginning of it but its following the same as the bases(?)... shall have a wee look tonight.

Not long to go now... tis all getting a wee bit exciting!

[DMBabe]

Not long to go now... tis all getting a wee bit exciting!

i know! Just wish I was able to go to band more! Nightshifts mean i get to do some serious damage on here but am lucky to get to band once a week! Getting better soon cos am using holidays! :D

[The-Wee-Timpanist]

i know! Just wish I was able to go to band more! Nightshifts mean i get to do some serious damage on here but am lucky to get to band once a week! Getting better soon cos am using holidays! :D

You should swap with some percussionists and tell them to go do your night shift - its not like they have that much to do! Would be interesting to see them swap band for a nurses uniform! :lol:

[DMBabe]

You should swap with some percussionists and tell them to go do your night shift - its not like they have that much to do! Would be interesting to see them swap band for a nurses uniform! :lol:

Wouldn't want to see my lot in my uniform..... especially not him indoors!:eek:

[Mesmerist]

Have you all seen the tmp predictions? Oldham lees are racing ahead.
We had a good rehearsal tonight after having a short break so feeling quietly confident about putting on a good show. Trouble with this contest is that we don`t know all the bands whereas in the Areas you can be more confident about where you are likely to come.

[DMBabe]

It's true! No-one has heard of my band at all south of the border! Except the folk on here who get regularly bothered by me!:dunno No idea who's good and who's not (except we must all be either very good or very lucky to have made it there in the first place)? Can't compare scores from the regionals cos they're all varied due to different adjudicators.......... so its anyone's race as far as i'm concerned.

Pretty much like any other contest???:roll:;)

[The-Wee-Timpanist]

Well, Diane, last night our conductor (Hi David! :)) read our wee convo on nurses uniforms and suggested it to the rest of our percussion section. Needless to say in did get a few laughs and a few other suggestions... at least it woke us up for a while. I spent quite a bit of time sitting on the floor last night :lol: what a bummer it is being tacet in the last movement!

[Mesmerist]

How come some of the bands on tmp predictions have no votes for winning? Does this mean that they have no members on tmp to take part? I have voted for my band to win - otherwise what is the point of going if you don`t believe you can do it?

[mikelyons]

Well, call me stupid, but I can't find anywhere to vote! :dunno:

[mikelyons]

Hey guys, in the 'tMP Black text there is no prediction link! I had to change to the tMP 2008 version. Naughty, naughty! :hammer

In fact the whole of the top title bar is missing!

[mikelyons]

Was that a tumbleweed I just saw blowing past me?...

[Mesmerist]

No we are all practising.

[PeterBale]

Was that a tumbleweed I just saw blowing past me?...

All the techno bods seem to be tied up at the moment - I'm sure someone will have a look in due course (I checked it myself, and I have no top navigation bar in tMP black either, so at least it's nothing personal!)

[mikelyons]

I hope you are paying for those services, Peter. Is Di wearing her pink leather thigh length boots? ;)

[DMBabe]

Not much you can say to that one! Apart from that would be the weirdest band uniform ever! Although would be worth a look just for the novelty factor, can u imagine the headline in the Bandsman? :eek:

"Brass Band create new uniform, Pink Thigh High boots Compulsory for BOTH sexes"!!!!

Well there's a way to guarantee signing Mr B!!!!:lol:

[katej]

So 2 weeks to go until the big day! Hows everyone finding it?

I'm enjoying it so far.....

[Euphjam]

We've arrived at the piece a bit late but are giving it some stick three nights a week until the big day. We're having lots of fun experimenting with the band layout at the mo. any suggestions/opinions on this from anyone?:)

p.s I'm starting to like it!

[lynchie]

So 2 weeks to go until the big day! Hows everyone finding it?

I'm enjoying it so far.....

Just over a week till the first rehearsal. I'm somewhat nervous.

[Mesmerist]

We have got Mr Steve Sykes coming in to take us tomorrow morning which is probably more scary than the actual contest. The man is a genius and he literally can hear every single player however noisy and messy it is. I remember once at Yeovil we had been given a new arrangement of music and so we sight-read it through just to get a flavour of it top to bottom. Steve had not seen it before that night and when we got to the end he said "bar 15 Bb basses that 3rd crotchet should be an E"... How does he do it?

[steve butler]

Be assured he does'nt hear everything Werndy, he just picks up on the things he does hear :wink:
Great for the band though that you get the benefit of a top musician to come along. Must act as good motivation as well I suspect.

[Mesmerist]

Who is this Werndy?

[mikelyons]

I can't make my mind up about the piece. I sort of like it for the cheesy Rutter-ness of it, and I like some of the arrangeing - especially the interesting bits for basses, but I can't for the life of me understand some of the things Sandy has done with the other bits of the arrangements. Some of the countermelodies seem to be a bit misplaced, range-wise, in the BB version and there are some odd sort of chunky bits. It's a bit like expecting a clear consomme and finding yourself faced with a rustic minestrone, if you see what I mean.

I also think the adding of percussion to this has been a bit haphazard. There are bits of the last movement that cry out for a bit of rumbustiousness but that are ignored and a couple of places in the slower movements that might have benefitted from some glock/marimba/vibe touches. Nothing overdone, just light touches. Ah well, how easy it is to second guess the arranger.

[steve butler]

Who is this Werndy?
Oops "my typos" again :D

[DMBabe]

Just over a week till the first rehearsal. I'm somewhat nervous.
:eek: My God! You're either very confident or very misguided!!! I would be more than nervous! I hope your uniform is brown, if it's not it might be after......

We've arrived at the piece a bit late but are giving it some stick three nights a week until the big day. We're having lots of fun experimenting with the band layout at the mo. any suggestions/opinions on this from anyone?:)

p.s I'm starting to like it!

Jamie, for starters I'd suggest putting the glock in the next village and sending the rest of the percussionists to get the beers/chips in! Try putting the solo horn in between the 2nd and 3rd cornets and the flugel with the b-flat basses! Not for practical reasons, just for a change! ;)

[lynchie]

:eek: My God! You're either very confident or very misguided!!! I would be more than nervous! I hope your uniform is brown, if it's not it might be after......



Well we thought it'd be unfair on the rest of you to rehearse too much ;)

In all honesty, the end of September isn't exactly perfect timing for a University band, but we're still confident of putting in a good performance with the players and conductor we've got.

[DMBabe]

Well we thought it'd be unfair on the rest of you to rehearse too much ;)

In all honesty, the end of September isn't exactly perfect timing for a University band, but we're still confident of putting in a good performance with the players and conductor we've got.

Well good luck to you! Poor commitment though if people aren't prepared to rehearse outside of term..... I remember the days when people used to walk 200 miles over hill and dale 6 nights a week to get to band!;) Just can't get the staff!!!

Don't underestimate the complexities of the piece, look at this thread, started all " too easy" and now........strangely gone all quiet???

[The-Wee-Timpanist]

Jamie, for starters I'd suggest putting the glock in the next village and sending the rest of the percussionists to get the beers/chips in! Try putting the solo horn in between the 2nd and 3rd cornets and the flugel with the b-flat basses! Not for practical reasons, just for a change! ;)

I don't want to be in the next village. I play very quietly as it is! Plus why should all the other percussionists get the excitement of getting beer and chips?! :)

[DMBabe]

I don't want to be in the next village. I play very quietly as it is! Plus why should all the other percussionists get the excitement of getting beer and chips?! :)

I'm glad you play quietly Rachel cos not all of ur species do (not naming names......). Does the next village not have a pub too? cos u could sit there with glock on table, pint in one hand and beater in the other......;) Wouldn't want to exclude you! and I meant the rest could be getting the beer and chips in for everyone else, not just for them!

[The-Wee-Timpanist]

I'm glad you play quietly Rachel cos not all of ur species do (not naming names......). Does the next village not have a pub too? cos u could sit there with glock on table, pint in one hand and beater in the other......;) Wouldn't want to exclude you! and I meant the rest could be getting the beer and chips in for everyone else, not just for them!

Now that sounds blissful... would have to be a pint of vodka and lime :lol:

[leetram]

Hello everyone. I've been a reader of TMP for a while now, but, this is my first post. Personally speaking, I think the test piece is a decent listen. The percussion part isn't that thrilling, especially when you compare it to Dark Side of the Moon, which was fun to play. (I imagine Mr. Lyons will probably disagree about that !) There are two percussionists at Eagley, (whoever said that they had 6 percs is just bragging ), and we're doing a bit of a mix and match to try and keep things interesting for both of us.

[DMBabe]

[quote=leetram;624221](whoever said that they had 6 percs is just bragging ),quote]

Leaping to the defence of Rachel, Annan are a band based in the sticks of nowhere, so not surprised they have so many percussionists..... not like my lot! Damned city folks and all their better stuff to do.....;)

[leetram]

Hello DMBabe, I wasn't having a go at Rachel, I'm just jealous. 6 percs .......... must make a beautiful noise when they are in full flow !!!

ps, how do you do all the smileys ?

[DMBabe]

Hello DMBabe, I wasn't having a go at Rachel, I'm just jealous. 6 percs .......... must make a beautiful noise when they are in full flow !!!

ps, how do you do all the smileys ?

Beautiful noise? U sure? i can say that cos him indoors is a shed-builder!

re smilies.... eyes right when u reply, click on the one u want or open the more section below!!;):clap:

[steve butler]

:biggrin: Hey leetram, welcome to tMP!

I love bangers :tup

Do me a favour, at the next band practice get one of those really big beaters (you know a tam tam basher) and reach over to the bass section and, give Mr Lyons a good old smack on the bonce from me :p

In fact if you have an orange beater better still :cool:

Are'nt the smilies great?

[mikelyons]

Hey, I've heard you've paid good money for that sort of thing Mr B!
:D

Before I get any more accusative emails from people who don't want their unpleasant tone displayed on tMP, I wasn't attacking Sandy Smith in any way in my earlier comments. I admire his work very much and I want to understand why he does the things he does. Maybe I'm not always the most tactful person in the world, but if I'm having a go at you, you'll know about it!

Trouble with Lee is, you have to explain things sloooooowly or he might miss the point. He's not the archetypal 'drummer' (i.e. he would recognise a radiator when he saw it), that honour goes to PaulSpud, but he's a-workin' on it! :p

:D

[The-Wee-Timpanist]

Hello DMBabe, I wasn't having a go at Rachel, I'm just jealous. 6 percs .......... must make a beautiful noise when they are in full flow !!!

ps, how do you do all the smileys ?

Hi Lee, welcome to the wonderful world of tmp.

Indeed we have 6 percussionists including myself but, you shall only see 4 of us in Harrogate. And as DMBabe said we live in the middle of nowhere with not many contesting brass bands at all so, we are rather lucky to have so many.

How are you managing with 2? I imagine it isn't too bad covering it with 2? Bit of a struggle at points but not too hard?

[Euphjam]

;) We actually have seven if you recall correctly Rachael,as one(my good lady:biggrin:!) has picked up a Baritone to help out the real musicians:p:eek:.

[The-Wee-Timpanist]

;) We actually have seven if you recall correctly Rachael,as one(my good lady:biggrin:!) has picked up a Baritone to help out the real musicians:p.

Oh gosh Sam will kill me tomorrow! :oops:

Real musicians - percussionists have it much harder y'know! We have to play numerous different instruments/lumps of metal/block of wood! :lol:

[mikelyons]

Each others' heads and hands?

:p

[DMBabe]

Just wanted to check and see how people (percussionists in particular) feel about the bizarre "immovable percussion rule" and how its affecting rehearsals? Seems that as my lot sit on top of each other and take up half the room of other bands (curse of the worlds smallest bandhall), we're gonna likely have to move way back on the stage to be next to the percussion which could be...... well...... interesting? Unless the percussion is forward which means other bands might have to suddenly bunch up?:dunno

Am assuming they are doing this to save time of moving percussion around but our lot are pretty slick and most bands will have to do some chair shifting to accomodate their layout??? Why oh why oh why?????................ Anyone care to shed (build) some light?

[ashwortdn]

Hi there would just like to say good look to everyone going to harrogate next week sure it will be a good one.
Good look to all.

[The-Wee-Timpanist]

Argh! - This is how I feel about tonights rehearsal. :( Playing was fine it was just everthing else...

[steve butler]

Argh! - This is how I feel about tonights rehearsal. :( Playing was fine it was just everthing else...
Oh dear, was the Bb player breaking wind again?

[The-Wee-Timpanist]

Oh dear, was the Bb player breaking wind again?

Haha! I don't think I'd be alive to post on here if that was the case.

It's just the lack of percussion in this darn piece, its driving me up the wall!

[brassbandmaestro]

Have some occupational thera[y with you at the next rehearsal!!

[Mesmerist]

We had rehearsal with Mr Sykes last night. He was great. Band was ok. I was pooh. Even split note in solo in 2nd movement. If I play like that on the day I shall do everyone a favour and stick the flugel under the bus and pay the coach driver to reverse over it. Then give up forever.

We have open rehearsal tonight with loads of Verwoodians coming and doing a mini concert as well as playing Suite for Brass. Chance to redeem things perhaps. Gloom and depression...hate playing badly...

[Aardvark]

Just wanted to check and see how people (percussionists in particular) feel about the bizarre "immovable percussion rule" and how its affecting rehearsals? Seems that as my lot sit on top of each other and take up half the room of other bands (curse of the worlds smallest bandhall), we're gonna likely have to move way back on the stage to be next to the percussion which could be...... well...... interesting? Unless the percussion is forward which means other bands might have to suddenly bunch up?:dunno

Am assuming they are doing this to save time of moving percussion around but our lot are pretty slick and most bands will have to do some chair shifting to accomodate their layout??? Why oh why oh why?????................ Anyone care to shed (build) some light?

No replies to this yet - would be particularly interested to hear what the bands (like us) who only have 2 percussionists are doing. I contacted Kapitol today but was told that we could have a chat with Ray Payne re possibility of 'a minor movement' of the Glock but nothing else. With the parts our guys are playing - the set up does not work at all.

[brassbandmaestro]

Seem to me that the officialls are making life as complicated as ever, uneccesarily so!

[mikelyons]

Indeed. Even to the point that I'm starting to feel a bit sorry for the persecutionists. (Not much, nor for very long - but it's better than not at all! ;))

Mezzy, if you do that it certainly won't be the only time the flugel has been flat. Also if you do that you would miss tMP so badly you'd have to be locked up. You'll be fine, I'm sure. You were probably just a bit nervous about being in the presence! ;)

[Gareth Westwood]

Interesting read guys.

Can I first start by sending a message to those on here who can't stand it if other folk have an opinion. The people I refer to are largely not involved in the recent conversations but instead choose to vent their anger at posters through offensive and personal emails. GROW UP. If someone doesn't like the piece, or wish it were done differently thats up to them.

I can't recall any recent posters personally insulting Sandy Smith, or insulting anyone as a matter of fact and those who take so much exception to an honest opinion that they send insulting emails are simply immature and vindictive individuals. You disgust me and to the person or people in question, if you wish to contact me I will only be to glad to tell you why your rediculous and misguided in your poor efforts to intimidate your fellow bandsmen just because you disagree.
To those who take opinions as just that... opinions... and don't have the foggiest whatn I'm on about, my sincere apologies for taking up your time with this.

Onto the piece. Well this sort of music is incredibly hard to arrange and pull off. Folk music naturally sounds a little corny to my ears when in the hands of a Brass Band and especially when it is originally for a different ensemble. Saying this, if you want something like this arranging, Sandy Smith is probably the man to do it. Sure, we can all think of ways we could have done it but that doesn't mean to say I'm attacking Sandy Smith. If we all wrote music and arranged the same it would be very boring so yeah, Mike Lyons might have done things different, the same as any other person out there with an opinon on the piece.
But it is a good arrangement of a piece I wouldn't immediately say is appropriate for a brass band.

It is also a good piece to test a band (in my humble and un knowledgable opinion). The outer two movements are full of technical demands which whilst easy to get out of the bell, can be tricky to execute whilst maintaing the musical character of its context. The middle movements are a huge test of tuning and lyricism with ensemble pitfalls everywhere. I also personaly think its bit of a challenge on conductors I guess. The natural hunting ground for brass bands is that of virtuosic pyrotechnics, romantic 19th century-esq melodies, cadenzas etc etc. This has to be approached with a lightness of touch which many will not be used to and bigger sounding bands might be a bit uncomfortable with this. There aren't many points in the piece where you can 'let it rip' (or maybe I have just not found them!). So its a decent arrangement and test with lots of technical and musical pitfalls.

My issue however is with its selection in the first place. Not from an angle of its not an appropriate test because, as I have mentioned just a paragraph before, it is! But is contesting not an arena for serious original repertoire. I love brass band music and I want to see it grow. I'm not saying every contest needs to have a new piece but at least a quality original piece surely (that is equally a test for the section in hand).
I mean this is essentially an orchestral transcription is it not and if 'Corsair' (for example) were picked for the 1st section would we not question that? (I would).

There are so many good composers and original pieces out there old and new. Which is why an arrangement of a little known folk music suite for strings baffles me as a choice for a test piece.

Ill say again for all those nutters out there who like to send abusive emails ( ;) ) I think the arrangement is good. Im not a great fan of the piece simply because that sort of music isn't my cup of tea but sure I appreciate its a good arrangement and to lovers of rutter and folk music, a nice piece to listen to. Im not saying Sandy's rubbish and I totally see why people would enjoy playing and listening to the piece.

But from a repertoire point of view, its selection does nothing for the good of serious brass repertoire. Maybe the panel wanted a break from original brass repertoire I don't know but if that is the case, I am not a lover of that direction.

So there you go. Because my opinon probably has a slightly negative slant to it, in terms of the piece, I fully expect everyone to gang up on me now, so go ahead.

But thats what I think of the piece anyway.

Gaz

[Lyndon Price]

Interesting read guys.


But from a repertoire point of view, its selection does nothing for the good of serious brass repertoire. Maybe the panel wanted a break from original brass repertoire I don't know but if that is the case, I am not a lover of that direction.

So there you go. Because my opinon probably has a slightly negative slant to it, in terms of the piece, I fully expect everyone to gang up on me now, so go ahead.

But thats what I think of the piece anyway.

Gaz


Hear Hear

There are many pitfalls in the music and undoubtable is a stern test, with the amount of doubling of harmonic parts and in some parts the voicing of same being " interesting" to say the least.

However it is like mould......it grows on you

I hope all at Harrogate have the best of days, I look forward to many vocal renditions of "Dashing away....in the many bars around and I cant wait to meet the maid in Amsterdam.

Good luck everyone

[cookie101880]

Well nearly there now, had a cracking rehersal with Nick Childs on Friday. Also like to welcome Paul Applegarth to the band having finally putting pen to paper.

Good luck to all bands competing. Should be a great weekend!

[DobX Dave]

Well nearly there now, had a cracking rehersal with Nick Childs on Friday. Also like to welcome Paul Applegarth to the band having finally putting pen to paper.

Good luck to all bands competing. Should be a great weekend!

Sounds like you are really 'going for it' this year, especially as you have had the benefit of Mr. Childs visiting (that has got to have added 1 point at least) although to be perfectly honest, John Collins has proved over the years to not let anything slip and I feel sure that he will put in his usual good performance/reading of the test piece.
Even the tMP Predications have you way out in front.
Seeing that you have signed Paul Applegarth for the contest does 'one' presume that there is a massive bass trombone part ?
Finally, are you having an open rehearsal so that a few locals can have a sneak preview of the test piece ?

[cookie101880]

Paul is actually playing Bb bass!!!!! Unusual i know!

We ran the piece out last week at haslingdon and everything was fitting together quite well. It's all out rehersals from now till Sat.

The joys of contesting!

[Mesmerist]

Are you all twitchy this week? I am so fidgety and wound up with nervous energy. Can`t wait for it to all be over now and have the results. Hope we don`t get that wretched no 1 spot yet again. I`ve only done one Contest with this band where it wasn`t a no 1 draw.

Like you Cookie we have rehearsals all week (except tuesday). We were to have tonight off but yesterday was not up to standard.

Just like to say a HUGE thank you to Colin Johnson from the registry for sorting us out. Found that 2 players were not on the active list and they were the principal cornet and our super duper Baritone player Maria. Stress!!! Colin fixes it all. Lovely man.

I hope all of us play to our potential (with no disasters) so even if we can`t all win we go home happy with the way we performed. Its a long way back on that bus if the M.D. is not pleased...

[mikelyons]

<===Perfectly relaxed - at least now I have a full section. :)

Looking forward to Friday. We are hoping to be in Harrogate by late afternoon. Hope the weather stays nice.

[The-Wee-Timpanist]

<<<< Excited! Although annoyed at what little time I have to pack. I could probably do it now but tMP seems much more interesting.

We're leaving about half 4ish so we'll prob get to our hotel about 8ish. Then I think we've a rehearsal oh and a 3 course meal.

[DMBabe]

<<<< Excited! Although annoyed at what little time I have to pack..

Rach how long does it take u to pack? :eek: I'm at work, finish at 8am, need to drive home shower, take cat to vet, come home do housework that has fallen by the wayside whilst i've been at work, try and get some sleep, wake up in time (hopefully) to make tea then go to band. Then up at the crack to leave for harrogate in the morning! Am pretty sure half an hour would be more than adequate to pack everything? Cos that's all the time I'm allowing! ;)

Besides that am totally looking forward to it! I'll be the one looking like I've not slept for a week (appropriately) and getting bladdered on 2 wine gums and a water biscuit!!!!:guiness

[katej]

Am jealous of those of you who are stopping over! We took the decision to travel up on the day and back this year as its a lot of expense - especially when its the 4th year on the trot that we have qualified!

We have a rehearsal friday night then we are leaving shropshire at 8am......

[brassbandmaestro]

Good luck to everyone competing this weekend.

[Mesmerist]

Do you think it gives a band a big advantage to book Harrogate Centre for a rehearsal the week of the Contest? What do you think? Slightly cheating or full on determination to win leaving nothing to chance?

[DMBabe]

Am jealous of those of you who are stopping over! We took the decision to travel up on the day and back this year as its a lot of expense - especially when its the 4th year on the trot that we have qualified!

We have a rehearsal friday night then we are leaving shropshire at 8am......

Explain how that works then? 4th year on the trot you've qualified yet you're still in the 3rd section? That's a bit unfair considering to do that here you'd be in the Championship section! Can I again say how much i hate the regional inconsistencies re the regionals/nationals?:confused:

Do you think it gives a band a big advantage to book Harrogate Centre for a rehearsal the week of the Contest? What do you think? Slightly cheating or full on determination to win leaving nothing to chance?

Not slightly cheating.... total cheating!!! :mad: Shouldn't be allowed Mezzy! Unfair playing field then cos not all of us can rehearse there so hence its bad and evil! Different if they offered every band a practive slot! Don't think however it guarantees a win though.... bribing the judges is the only way to do that!

[katej]

Whoops Maybe not very clear in my post- we qualified twice in the 4th section gaining promotion to third and have qualified in 3rd section twice and will be 2nd section as of Jan 09!


But yes I get the point re regionals- ours is one of the largest for 3rd/4th section but seems to only have about 14 in the 2nd section!

[mikelyons]

Do you think it gives a band a big advantage to book Harrogate Centre for a rehearsal the week of the Contest? What do you think? Slightly cheating or full on determination to win leaving nothing to chance?

Probably not according to the rules - like using ringers. I think it would be fairer if either all or nobody was allowed to use the hall. But as DMBabe said, it doesn't guarantee a win.

Good luck to everyone in every section at Harrogate. I'm looking forward to meeting a few of you. You all know what I look like - so you have unfair advantage!

[brassbandmaestro]

Good luck to everyone competing at Harrogate. Lovely place and area. Especially good luck to Brighton & Hove City Brass.

[ste77]

go wellington !!!!! 4th yr at the nationals what a record!

[brianatb]

Top tip, ANNAN TOWN BAND. You saw it here first.

[MRSH]

Good luck to everyone competing at Harrogate. Lovely place and area. Especially good luck to Brighton & Hove City Brass.Thanks very much BBM.

I would also like to add my best wishes and good luck to everyone competing at the weekend - especially our fellow bands from L&SC - Hangleton and Littleport.

For me, it's the first time conducting at the finals (have played twice). My band are thoroughly looking forward to it and can't wait.

Would also be nice to put faces to names of tMP'ers so if I don't see you first feel free to say hello.

And remember, it's not the winning that's important - it's the taking part ;)

[Alisop]

Top tip, ANNAN TOWN BAND. You saw it here first.

:clap::clap::clap:

[steve butler]

I would like to add my best wishes to all competing bands - especially those with ringers and haggis lovers on board :wink:

Oh, and don't forget Esme and dame petulengro when you spot Señor Lyons give him a big sloppy kiss from me :D

[DMBabe]

I would like to add my best wishes to all competing bands - especially those with ringers and haggis lovers on board :wink:

Oh, and don't forget Esme and dame petulengro when you spot Señor Lyons give him a big sloppy kiss from me :D

Anyone looking for Mike Lyons? He'll be the one cowering in the corner in case Mezzy or I pounce on him!!!!;)

[brassbandmaestro]

Wish I were going to Harrogate!!

[mikelyons]

Steve, I thought you were going! I was hoping to get you to spank me with your big fluffy pink size 13 slipper! :eek:

Girls, I don't cower, my bad neck won't let me. In any case, I think you need to anaesthatize me first - convention on human rights and so on....A couple of large Riojas might do the trick - then you could do anything you want to me!

Why, BBM, I didn't think you cared that much! ;) Does your missus know? :p

[brassbandmaestro]

Ha ha Mike!!!

[g55music]

Cant wait for tomorrow!!! good luck to those 'ringers'!!!!! x

[brassbandmaestro]

Can't wait for the ones that will be posting, we should've had the first prize or whatever,