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Di
17.02.2008, 22:55
Click on "tMP Predictions" at the top of the page
to be taken to Prediction Central

Welsh Regional Championships
Championship Section
Test Piece : Festival Music, Eric Ball


Sunday 9th March
Venue : Brangwyn Hall, Swansea
Adjudicators : Alan Morrison


Participating Bands :

BTM
Burry Port Town
Cory Band
Cwmaman Institute
Northop Silver
Parc and Dare
Tongwynlais Temperance
Tredegar
Wrexham Brass (NEWI)
************************************
Welsh Regional Championships
First Section
Test Piece : James Cook – Circumnavigator, Gilbert Vinter
Saturday 8th March
Venue : Brangwyn Hall, Swansea
Adjudicators : Alan Morrison

Participating Bands :

Abergavenny
Ammanford Silver
Beaumaris
Deiniolen
Markham and District
Newbridge (Celynen)
Penclawdd Brass
Pontardulais
RAF St. Athan Voluntary
Thomas Coaches Mid Rhondda
************************************

Welsh Regional Championships
Second Section
Test Piece : Three Part Invention, Kenneth Downie
Saturday 8th March
Venue : Brangwyn Hall, Swansea
Adjudicators : David Horsfield

Participating Bands :

Briton Ferry Silver
Lewis Merthyr
Llanrug
Llwydcoed
Newtown Silver
Point of Ayr
Rogerstone
Tylorstown Arriva Trains
************************************

Welsh Regional Championships
Third Section
Test Piece : The Dark Side of the Moon, Paul Lovatt-Cooper
Saturday 8th March
Venue : Brangwyn Hall, Swansea
Adjudicators : Alan Morrison

Participating Bands :

Blaenavon Town Band
City of Cardiff
Goodwick Brass
Gwaun Cae Gurwen
Ogmore Valley
Porthaethwy Menai Bridge
Royal Buckley
Royal Oakley
Ynyshir (Stacks of Tiles)
************************************
Welsh Regional Championships
Fourth Section
Test Piece : Four Cities Symphony, Rodney Newton
Sunday 9th March
Venue : Brangwyn Hall, Swansea
Adjudicators : David Horsfield

Participating Bands :

Crosskeys Silver
Crwbin
Ebbw Vale
Knighton Town Silver
Newport Borough
Oakdale
Severn Tunnel
Upper Rhondda



Date and Venue information courtesy www.4barsrest.com (http://www.4barsrest.com/news/detail.asp?criteria=regional&offset=25&year=2007&Submit=find&id=6403)
Bands added courtesty British Bandsman
and Peter Bale. :)

007ish
18.02.2008, 11:32
Come on guys :rolleyes: someone must know who the adjudicators are :confused:

dyl
18.02.2008, 12:44
Come on guys :rolleyes: someone must know who the adjudicators are :confused:

Just added Alan morrison for the First Sec..............

Number_3
18.02.2008, 13:42
Alan Morrison and David Horsfield are adjudicating the Championship Section!

stopher
18.02.2008, 16:01
Alan Morrison taking the 3rd section for definite. Can't remember which of the other sections he and David Horsfield are taking.

More worrying is I've heard a rumour that only 43 bands are attending Swansea with 8 in section 4!

Deano
18.02.2008, 18:36
according to the schedule we received, Alan Morrison is doing Champ, 1st & 3rd sections, and David Horsfield 2nd & 4th.

Mike Caress
19.02.2008, 21:39
so when are we getting the prediction set up for Wales?

dyl
19.02.2008, 21:49
so when are we getting the prediction set up for Wales?

When we get an official list of competing bands.

Deano
20.02.2008, 17:14
While we're waiting for the official list, can't we start our own list of who we know or heard have entered.

For starters I've heard of the following bands that have entered.

Championship

BTM
Burry Port
Cory
Cwmaman
Parc & Dare
Tredegar
Tongwynlais

1st

Abergavenny
Ammanford
Beaumaris
Markham
Mid Rhondda
Newbridge
Pontardulais
RAF St Athan

2nd

Briton Ferry
Lewis Merthyr
Newtown
Point of Ayr
Tylorstown

3rd

Blaenavon Town
City of Cardiff
Ogmore
Royal Buckley
Ynyshir

4th

Crosskeys
Ebbw Vale
Upper Rhondda

Please add any other bands that you know have entered.

dyl
20.02.2008, 17:46
1st

Abergavenny
Ammanford
Beaumaris
Markham
Mid Rhondda
Newbridge
Pontardulais
RAF St Athan

And Deiniolen.

As far as we're aware, there are 11 bands graded in the 1st Section, but only 10 have entered for Swansea.......

tam-tam2
20.02.2008, 17:54
You can add Wrexham and Northop to the Championship and Rogerstone to the second section too. Is there going to a Beaumaris in the 2nd Section too?

Ffion Flugel
20.02.2008, 18:21
Is the fourth section really on Saturday ... I think we thought it was Sunday.

dyl
20.02.2008, 18:29
Is there going to a Beaumaris in the 2nd Section too?
No Tim - there's only one Beaumaris band now - and they're what used to be the B Band (with a lot of the senior band members thrown in) - and the B Band were promoted to the First Section. They've merely dropped the 'B' from their title (no they're not known as Eaumaris now, before some smartypants mentions it.....).

At least that's how I think it is..................... ;)

tam-tam2
20.02.2008, 18:41
No Tim - there's only one Beaumaris band now - and they're what used to be the B Band (with a lot of the senior band members thrown in) - and the B Band were promoted to the First Section. They've merely dropped the 'B' from their title (no they're not known as Eaumaris now, before some smartypants mentions it.....).

At least that's how I think it is..................... ;)

Thanks for that Dyl.

Di
20.02.2008, 19:29
Is the fourth section really on Saturday ... I think we thought it was Sunday.

Apologies and thanks Fi. I've made a correction to the information given. I will make any further updates as and when the official announcement is made along with the band entries. :tup

tomlewis
20.02.2008, 19:57
Porthaethwy Menai Bridge[/B]



:D

Welsheuphoniummanjamie
20.02.2008, 20:08
While we're waiting for the official list, can't we start our own list of who we know or heard have entered.

For starters I've heard of the following bands that have entered.

Championship

BTM
Burry Port
Cory
Cwmaman
Parc & Dare
Tredegar
Tongwynlais

1st

Abergavenny
Ammanford
Beaumaris
Markham
Mid Rhondda
Newbridge
Pontardulais
RAF St Athan

2nd

Briton Ferry
Lewis Merthyr
Newtown
Point of Ayr
Tylorstown

3rd

Blaenavon Town
City of Cardiff
Ogmore
Royal Buckley
Ynyshir

4th

Crosskeys
Ebbw Vale
Upper Rhondda

Please add any other bands that you know have entered.

Rogerstone are also going.

jenks
20.02.2008, 20:55
are Northop and Wrexham entering the championship section?

Anno Draconis
20.02.2008, 21:12
are Northop and Wrexham entering the championship section?
Northop definitely are

Deano
20.02.2008, 22:14
Updated List

Championship

BTM
Burry Port
Cory
Cwmaman
Northop
Parc & Dare
Tredegar
Tongwynlais
Wrexham

1st

Abergavenny
Ammanford
Beaumaris
Deiniolen
Markham
Mid Rhondda
Newbridge
Pontardulais
RAF St Athan

2nd

Briton Ferry
Lewis Merthyr
Newtown
Point of Ayr
Rogerstone
Tylorstown

3rd

Blaenavon Town
City of Cardiff
Ogmore
Porthaethwy Menai Bridge
Royal Buckley
Ynyshir

4th

Crosskeys
Ebbw Vale
Upper Rhondda

Please add any other bands that you know have entered.

Deano
20.02.2008, 22:17
Alan Morrison and David Horsfield are adjudicating the Championship Section!

I think you'll find that Alan Morrison is adjudicating on his own according to the contest schedule sent out to all competing bands.

Timpking
21.02.2008, 07:35
Penclawdd 1st section?

Llywdcoed and Holywell 2nd section (I think)?

Must be more 4th section bands Newport? Cwmbran? There are normally loads and always delays the start of the championship section!!

stopher
21.02.2008, 09:53
Penclawdd 1st section?

Llywdcoed and Holywell 2nd section (I think)?

Must be more 4th section bands Newport? Cwmbran? There are normally loads and always delays the start of the championship section!!

Don't think Holywell are going from what I've heard. Also have been told that there are only 8 bands in Section 4, with none from North Wales - what has happened as there 15 last year and 20 the year before?

Number_3
21.02.2008, 10:03
It means an early Championship section and more time at the bar!

jonmoss
21.02.2008, 10:43
I'm fairly sure there are 9 bands competing in Section 3.

I don't know who is missing though.

007ish
21.02.2008, 12:03
Updated List

Championship

BTM
Burry Port
Cory
Cwmaman
Northop
Parc & Dare
Tredegar
Tongwynlais
Wrexham

1st

Abergavenny
Ammanford
Beaumaris
Deiniolen
Markham
Mid Rhondda
Newbridge
Pontardulais
RAF St Athan

2nd

Briton Ferry
Lewis Merthyr
Newtown
Point of Ayr
Rogerstone
Tylorstown

3rd

Blaenavon Town
City of Cardiff
Ogmore
Porthaethwy Menai Bridge
Royal Buckley
Ynyshir

4th

Crosskeys
Ebbw Vale
Newport
Oakdale
Upper Rhondda

Please add any other bands that you know have entered

Dave_the_Flugel
21.02.2008, 13:40
Penclawdd 1st section?

Llywdcoed and Holywell 2nd section (I think)?

Must be more 4th section bands Newport? Cwmbran? There are normally loads and always delays the start of the championship section!!

Not sure but would doubt Llwydcoed are going I think there are havin a bit of a rough patch - but I might be wrong.

Don't think there are that many going to Swansea in the 4th Section this year, around about 8 bands is the figure I've heard which is naturally disappointing.

Deano
21.02.2008, 16:51
Updated List

Championship

BTM
Burry Port
Cory
Cwmaman
Northop
Parc & Dare
Tredegar
Tongwynlais
Wrexham

1st

Abergavenny
Ammanford
Beaumaris
Deiniolen
Markham
Mid Rhondda
Newbridge
Penclawdd
Pontardulais
RAF St Athan

2nd

Briton Ferry
Lewis Merthyr
Llywdcoed ?????
Newtown
Point of Ayr
Rogerstone
Tylorstown

3rd

Blaenavon Town
City of Cardiff
Ogmore
Porthaethwy Menai Bridge
Royal Buckley
Ynyshir

4th

Crosskeys
Ebbw Vale
Newport
Oakdale
Upper Rhondda

Please add any other bands that you know have entered

Deano
21.02.2008, 17:08
Details from the contest schedule sent out by Phil Morris

Saturday 8th March 2008

3rd Section

Adjudicator Alan Morrison

Draw 10:30
Start 11:30

2nd Section

Adjudicator David Horsfield

Draw 12:45
Start after results of 3rd section

1st Section

Adjudicator Alan Morrison

Draw 3:15
Start after results of 2nd section

Sunday 9th March

4th Section

Adjudicator David Horsfield

Draw 10:00
Start 11:00

Championship section

Adjudicator Alan Morrison
Draw 12:00
Start after results of 4th section


Looks like it will all be over by 5pm on the Sunday

PeterBale
21.02.2008, 22:07
Updated List

Championship

BTM
Burry Port
Cory
Cwmaman
Northop
Parc & Dare
Tredegar
Tongwynlais
Wrexham

1st

Abergavenny
Ammanford
Beaumaris
Deiniolen
Markham
Mid Rhondda
Newbridge
Penclawdd
Pontardulais
RAF St Athan

2nd

Briton Ferry
Lewis Merthyr
Llanrug
Llywdcoed
Newtown
Point of Ayr
Rogerstone
Tylorstown

3rd

Blaenavon Town
Goodwick Brass
City of Cardiff
Gwaun-Cae-Gurwen
Ogmore
Porthaethwy Menai Bridge
Royal Buckley
Royal Oakleley
Ynyshir

4th

Crosskeys
Ebbw Vale
Knighton Town Silver
Newport
Oakdale
Upper Rhondda
Crwbin
Severn Tunnel

(updated as per British Bandsman listing)

stopher
21.02.2008, 22:38
Well, I think the low turn out represents the fairly sorry state of Welsh banding to be honest. 44 bands - and that is with Point of Ayr reforming this year and no NW Wales bands in the 4th section which only has 8 bands in!!!!!! What happened to the double figures of the last couple of years? It's the grass roots of welsh banding and without these bands attending, what will happen in a few years - will the Welsh area be under 40 bands next year?

CardiffTromb
21.02.2008, 23:32
Well, I think the low turn out represents the fairly sorry state of Welsh banding to be honest. 44 bands - and that is with Point of Ayr reforming this year and no NW Wales bands in the 4th section which only has 8 bands in!!!!!! What happened to the double figures of the last couple of years? It's the grass roots of welsh banding and without these bands attending, what will happen in a few years - will the Welsh area be under 40 bands next year?

Totally agree it really is sad. Have any North Walian bands folded or any reason why they dont compete anymore? Remember the time when North Walian bands dominated the prizes. Looking forward to a good weekend of banding!

Dave_the_Flugel
22.02.2008, 09:50
The low number of entries is very disappointing, espeicially in the 4th Section which has been so well attended for the last few years.

One positive to take from the low number in the 4th Section is the appearence of a new name - Knighton Town Silver, not sure where they have come from but it's always pleasing to see a new band on the scene, hope they enjoy their day in Swansea.

hughess
22.02.2008, 09:54
Totally agree it really is sad. Have any North Walian bands folded or any reason why they dont compete anymore? Remember the time when North Walian bands dominated the prizes. Looking forward to a good weekend of banding!


Hate to say it again, but its the distance,
Nobody ever seems to listen.

CardiffTromb
22.02.2008, 11:07
Hate to say it again, but its the distance,
Nobody ever seems to listen.

I think you have a good point there. I personally wouldnt mind travelling up to somewhere central like Aberystwyth. I think it would be much fairer on all bands. Maybe we could even do a two year circle where we alternate between Llandudno / Rhyl and Swansea?

stopher
22.02.2008, 12:24
Totally agree it really is sad. Have any North Walian bands folded or any reason why they dont compete anymore? Remember the time when North Walian bands dominated the prizes. Looking forward to a good weekend of banding!

Don't think any more bands have folded although one or two are having problems. Think its down to the fact that in order to compete, NW bands are looking at £2000 each year to compete and has been in Swansea a decade. A large proportion of that money could have gone into new instruments for Junior bands, uniforms or any other project that the bands have. The Brangwyn is within an hour of most SW bands so its just the cost of a bus or even a car journey to get there.

With banding in the state it is in, give it another 5 years and there will be under 30 let alone 40 bands attending Swansea!

Di
22.02.2008, 18:27
Updated List

(updated as per British Bandsman listing)

Thanks for that Peter.

Predictions now added folks

Click on "tMP Predictions" at the top of the page to be taken to Prediction Central

Anno Draconis
22.02.2008, 21:56
Don't think Holywell are going from what I've heard.

Holywell had a lot of ex Point of Ayr players in their ranks who have now gone back to their old band leaving too many vacancies to put a band out at the area, from what I understand.

I also suspect that this year a lot of North Wales bands are not going because of the expense - an overnight stay is pretty much required unless you fancy a 20 hour day. Unless the Welsh area finally starts to alternate venues between North, South and Mid Wales (so an overnight is only required every 3 years), you're looking at the future of Welsh banding.

John Wynne
24.02.2008, 13:26
Well, I think the low turn out represents the fairly sorry state of Welsh banding to be honest. 44 bands - and that is with Point of Ayr reforming this year and no NW Wales bands in the 4th section which only has 8 bands in!!!!!! What happened to the double figures of the last couple of years? It's the grass roots of welsh banding and without these bands attending, what will happen in a few years - will the Welsh area be under 40 bands next year?

The Problem in North of Wales is not one of bands folding. None have folded as far as I know. It is purely down to the cost and the travelling 4 - 5hrs (more in fact for the more Northerly bands). Having held the contest in Swansea for nearly the last 10 years it is taking its toll. I know from our bands point of view that we found it hard this year to get the same motivation to raise a band to come down to the Areas. I know Swansea council provide the Brangwyn Hall at a relativley low cost if indeed any but we need to seriously consider having it in alternate venues alternating between the North & South of the country. There are some good venues in the North so that should not be an issue. If we don,t do something quick we will indeed ind up with less than 40 bands competing and only one or two from the North which makes a mockery of the whole process.

JessopSmythe
24.02.2008, 14:18
I think you have a good point there. I personally wouldnt mind travelling up to somewhere central like Aberystwyth. I think it would be much fairer on all bands. Maybe we could even do a two year circle where we alternate between Llandudno / Rhyl and Swansea?

This gets debated every year. Alternating between North / South is an OK idea but going to mid wales with it's appalling road links just makes it hard work for every body! Besides, as long a the use of the Brangwyn Hall comes for free, they've got very little incentive to move out.

matthetimp
24.02.2008, 16:55
How many north wales bands are there? Would the answer be to have a north wales contest and a south wales contest (i.e. regions) and have 2 bands from each section in each region go to the finals? This seems fair as no band will have to incur the ever crippling financial burdon.

Mr Chairman
24.02.2008, 17:23
contrary to what has been said on here (dave_the_flugel - crosskeys) llwydcoed band ARE competing in the 2nd section at swansea. We have recently signed a number of players from championship bands and we also have a new MD in Mr Rhodri Griffiths. The Band are looking ahead to a good year and a great day in swansea!!!!!!

Anno Draconis
24.02.2008, 17:52
How many north wales bands are there? Would the answer be to have a north wales contest and a south wales contest (i.e. regions) and have 2 bands from each section in each region go to the finals? This seems fair as no band will have to incur the ever crippling financial burdon.

Benn there, done that, in the shape of the useless North Wales Area Championships of a decade and a bit ago. There aren't enough bands to justify it. Up to the 90s, North Wales bands used to go to Blackpool to compete in the North West.

There's no problem in having a Welsh Area, especially as it provides a single contest to find the Champion Band of Wales. It just needs to be in a more accessible location at least one year in 3.

QAD
24.02.2008, 19:15
I think you have a good point there. I personally wouldnt mind travelling up to somewhere central like Aberystwyth. I think it would be much fairer on all bands. Maybe we could even do a two year circle where we alternate between Llandudno / Rhyl and Swansea?
I remember those days of hours on hours down windy roads from Aberystwyth - not good on the way back with a hangover on the bus back to Blaina.
I've often thought that it would be better off having the Welsh areas in somewhere like Birmingham, which is probably easier for most bands in Wales due to the road infrastructure- but that's crazy isn't it - having the Welsh area outside of Wales???

matthetimp
24.02.2008, 21:30
Huw, your as nuts now as you was in Blaina!

jenks
24.02.2008, 22:21
Welsh area outside Wales? Good idea but can’t see it ever happening, even though the road infrastructure would support it! I also remember the days of going to Aberystwyth, a foul journey from both north and south. I may be tinted in my view of travelling there as I had my five week old son with me the first time (1995), and it is certainty not a venue which was family friendly…. Just my opinion from experience. Other area’s also have this problem where there is a vast area involved and at least an overnight stay just look at the South West area Bream to Torquay… not really a day’s travel, also London and Southern Counties they travel from as far as Jersey definitely not a day!

Why is there a problem with bands not competing? It comes down to the fact that bands are all competing for the same players and there is a lack of talent coming through the youth bands, which means that one band may thieve but another will suffer because of this.

Anno Draconis
24.02.2008, 22:24
which means that one band may thieve but another will suffer because of this.

lol - Freudian Slip? :D

jenks
24.02.2008, 22:33
of course not... to suggest that bands would take anothers bands players would never happen!! lol

QAD
24.02.2008, 23:25
Huw, your as nuts now as you was in Blaina!
Ah, you know me too well.

Dave_the_Flugel
25.02.2008, 08:59
contrary to what has been said on here (dave_the_flugel - crosskeys) llwydcoed band ARE competing in the 2nd section at swansea. We have recently signed a number of players from championship bands and we also have a new MD in Mr Rhodri Griffiths. The Band are looking ahead to a good year and a great day in swansea!!!!!!

Good to know good luck then, only saying what I had heard on the grapevine.

the shed builder
25.02.2008, 10:37
isnt it insane when north wales bands are closer to the the north west, yorkshire, maybe even the north east areas than they are to there own area contest. it is a bit frustrating knowing that you are going to have a four hour drive home the day after with a stinking hangover and empty pockets after paying for hotels! cant see anything ever being done about it sadly.

Euph1888
25.02.2008, 12:43
Just to give you some idea, this debate of North v South happend this time last year http://www.themouthpiece.com/vb/showthread.php?p=526208#post526208n and once again nothing happend, quite the opposite in fact, the Brangwyn Hall Swansea has been booked until 2012, why we ask ourselves, its simple, the North Wales committee object to the Championships being held in Swansea however they are simply out numbered in the voting as they represent less bands. This is going to be a vicious circle as the North Wales representatives are going to represent less bands in the future, it will get to the point were they only have one vote if nothing is done.

I think the reasoning behind signing to Brangwyn hall for another 4 years is down to cost as the Welsh committee hire the Brangwyn for free. Has the Welsh committe asked whether a suitable venue is available in either Mid or North Wales, have they asked North Wales Bands for possible Venue information or the possibllity of sponsorship for the event!!! I think we all know the answer the that

On a seperate but related point why is it that each individual section is on the same day each year in Wales the 4th and Chapionship is always on a Sunday. Why can't the section be on the Saturday one Year and on the Sunday the next, then every band can enjoy the social side of banding without having to do a 320 mile trip on one day in a coach. We all enjoy the social side of banding - all we are asking for is fairness!!! ARE WE ASKING TOO MUCH!!!!!

Mr_Euniverse
25.02.2008, 15:27
Off the topic now but.....

I notice on the L & SE area thread there's a huge debate about how much tickets are and which section you are allowed to watch with your bandspersons ticket.

Does anyone know how much tickets to listen are? and is it a day ticket or weekend? And can you watch say the 2nd section contest with a 3rd section bandsmans ticket?

I have to watch the 3rd section as my wife is playing. But then she will watch the championship section as I'm playing!! Can I use the same one?

Deano
26.02.2008, 06:19
Normally, the bandspersons tickets are valid for one day, if you're competing on Saturday then you can gain entry to the 3rd, 2nd and 1st sections, with a Sunday ticket 4th and Championship.

Cochyn
26.02.2008, 19:09
Good luck Beaumaris, Llanrug and the new Point ;)

DCWOODS
04.03.2008, 11:58
Hey everyone - does anyone have the list of percussion that is available on stage for Swansea?

My letter has grown legs and walked off I believe!!!

matthetimp
04.03.2008, 12:06
Give Ev-Entz a ring. You will find a number on their website. www.ev-entz.co.uk (http://www.ev-entz.co.uk)

I am not playing with anybody this year, but every other year Adrian has provided,

Bass Drum, 4 Timps, Tam-Tam, Vibes, Xylo, Bells, Trap Trays. There may also be a glock and snare drum. If Marimba's and the such are written in the test piece, you will also be provided with these.

DCWOODS
05.03.2008, 10:46
Thanks Matthew - have since found my list :-)

How come you ain't playing this year?

Bass Trumpet
05.03.2008, 11:18
Heartiest best wishes to Knighton Town Silver Band on their first ever trip down to Swansea :clap:

While is it sad to see that some bands aren't going this year, it's very encouraging to see a band make it's debut. They also have the best 2nd trombone in the world - my Mum!

matthetimp
05.03.2008, 13:03
Thanks Matthew - have since found my list :-)

How come you ain't playing this year?

Not really interested in playing anymore. Left Newbridge, signed for Markham, but as a sub. They just call me when they are short. I would like to start conducting though and I am looking for a 3/2 section band who would be willing and/or looking in South Wales to take them for a few weeks (or longer) in the summer to see how things go.

LeDragon
07.03.2008, 12:35
All the best to Royal Buckley and to all the other North Walian bands making the long journey to the contest.

the shed builder
07.03.2008, 18:04
All the best to Royal Buckley and to all the other North Walian bands making the long journey to the contest.
cheers gaz, long time no see mate, matty (point of ayr)

LeDragon
07.03.2008, 19:29
cheers gaz, long time no see mate, matty (point of ayr)

Hi mate, hope you're well. Can't make it to Swansea I'm afraid but I'll be keeping an eye out for the results!

007ish
08.03.2008, 14:37
1. Blaenavon Town, L. Price, 2, 180 :clap: :clap:
2. City of Cardiff (Melingriffith), G. Ritter, 9, 179:clap:
3. Royal Oakeley, J. Jones, 1, 178
4. Gwaun-Cae-Gurwen, G. Davies, 5, 176
5. Goodwick Brass, G. Ritter, 3, 175
6. Ynyshir Clarity DOS, G. Shepherd, 7, 174
7. Royal Buckley Town, D. Beckley, 4, 173
8. Ogmore Valley Silver, I. Barnett, 6, 171
9. Porthaethwy Menai Bridge, C. Williams, 8, 170


Instrumentalist: Cornet - Goodwick

Thanks to 4Bars Rest

Kiz7
08.03.2008, 17:56
Section 2

Saturday 8 March
Adjudicator: David Horsfield
Three Part Invention - Kenneth Downie
Commences: following 3rd Section results

1. Point of Ayr Colliery, P. Christian, 4, 187
2. Tylorstown Arriva Trains, G. Davies, 3, 186
3. Rogerstone, M. Hutcherson, 2, 184
4. Newtown Silver, S. Edwards, 1, 182
5. Lewis Merthyr, G. Pritchard, 8, 181
6. Llwydcoed, R. Griffith, 6, 180
7. Briton Ferry Silver, Dr. C. Jenkins, 7, 179
8. Llanrug, B. Connolly, 5, 178

Top 3 bands qualify
Soloist: Dave Roberts, Point of Ayr

Section 3

Saturday 8 March
Adjudicator: Alan Morrison
The Dark Side of the Moon - Paul Lovatt-Cooper
Commences: 1130

1. Blaenavon Town, L. Price, 2, 180
2. City of Cardiff (Melingriffith), G. Ritter, 9, 179
3. Royal Oakeley, J. Jones, 1, 178
4. Gwaun-Cae-Gurwen, G. Davies, 5, 176
5. Goodwick Brass, G. Ritter, 3, 175
6. Ynyshir Clarity DOS, G. Shepherd, 7, 174
7. Royal Buckley Town, D. Beckley, 4, 173
8. Ogmore Valley Silver, I. Barnett, 6, 171
9. Porthaethwy Menai Bridge, C. Williams, 8, 170

Top 2 bands qualify
Instrumentalist: Cornet - Goodwick

(from 4bars rest)

Can anyone explain to me why 3 bands qualify from the 2nd section when there were only 8 bands in it but 2 bands qualify from the 3rd section when there were 9 bands?

Doesn't seem right to me.

RobBari
08.03.2008, 20:28
Section 1 results.
1st Newbridge
2nd Baumaris
3rd Markham whoo hoo.

matthetimp
08.03.2008, 21:23
Section 2

Can anyone explain to me why 3 bands qualify from the 2nd section when there were only 8 bands in it but 2 bands qualify from the 3rd section when there were 9 bands?

Doesn't seem right to me.

Mis-print. Only top 2 qualify.

Thegroupies
08.03.2008, 22:14
Good to see Abergavenny back on board!!
Good result too, well done!!

no2taz
09.03.2008, 09:34
Section 1 results.
1st Newbridge
2nd Baumaris
3rd Markham whoo hoo.

What a day for welsh folk and anyone assocoated with Newbridge Band. Better get that hotell Booked.

RobBari
09.03.2008, 10:06
Well done Newbridge and Baumaris on qualifying, a good contest made better by that game in Dublin!!

RobBari
09.03.2008, 10:09
Just noticed that Newbridge won by 4 points! as i did not hear them or Baumaris were they really that far ahead of all other bands on the day or is this a slightly flattering score? After their result in Porthcawl i guess they were a lot better.

no2taz
09.03.2008, 10:26
Section 1

Saturday 8 March
Adjudicator: Alan Morrison
James Cook - Circumnavigator ñ Gilbert Vinter
Commences: following 2nd Section results

1. Newbridge (Celynen), P. Holland, 2 189
2. Beaumaris, G. Evans, 6, 185
3. Markham & District, A. Morton, 4, 184
4. Abergavenny Borough, G. Ritter, 7, 183
5. Penclawdd Brass, A. Small, 8, 182
6. Thomas Coaches Mid-Rhondda, A. Gibbs, 10, 181
7. Pontardulais Town, P. Jenkins, 5, 180
8. RAF St. Athan Voluntary, A. Bourne, 3, 179
9. Deiniolen, G. Saynor, 9, 178
10. Ammanford Town, C. John, 1, 177

Top 2 bands qualify
Soloist: Andrew Smith, Cornet, Newbridge


From 4br news page

matthetimp
09.03.2008, 11:58
Just noticed that Newbridge won by 4 points! as i did not hear them or Baumaris were they really that far ahead of all other bands on the day or is this a slightly flattering score? After their result in Porthcawl i guess they were a lot better.


After hearing both bands Rob, Yes Newbridge deserved the points difference, Beaumaris seemed slightly under the weather. I also chuckled at the fact that one band from near the Swansea area thought that they could top Newbridges' performance. Ummmmm ................... no they couldn't and didn't even get close.

:clap: You know who you are. LOL

matthetimp
09.03.2008, 13:37
4th Section

1st Crosskeys
2nd Severn Tunnel
3rd Newport

B/S Newport

Y/P Severn Tunnel (7)

Bass Trumpet
09.03.2008, 14:19
Very nice to see that Knighton came a very creditable 5th in the 4th section on their debut in the Nationals. Hope they can build on that for next time.

LeDragon
09.03.2008, 17:34
Top section:

1. Tredegar
2. BTM
3. Cory

Courtesy of my old man!

RobBari
09.03.2008, 18:02
On a weekend of upsets in the sporting world, this result must be up there. Great result for Tredegar, well done guys not only a return to London but also the europeans. Well done to BTM too, maybe the time has finally come when several welsh bands will again compete at the highest level.

tojo
09.03.2008, 18:03
was that a result or prediction

RobBari
09.03.2008, 18:05
Result !!!

tojo
09.03.2008, 18:07
nice one good to see the pack shuffled

Roger Thorne
09.03.2008, 18:08
1. Tredegar, I. Porthouse, 3, 194
2. BTM, G. O'Connor, 8, 191
3. Cory, Dr. R. Childs, 6, 190
4. Burry Port Town, P. Bailey, 9, 189
5. Northop, T. Wyss, 1, 188
6. Parc and Dare, C. Roberts, 2, 187
7. Tongwynlais Temperance, G. Pritchard, 5, 186
8. Cwmaman Institute, G. Shepherd, 4, 185
9. Wrexham Brass, W. Ruston, 7, 184

;)

Rambo
09.03.2008, 18:20
An interesting result indeed!
Does that mean that Wrexham Brass are relegated?

no2taz
09.03.2008, 19:01
Wel done Tredegar and Special Well done to Dewi on the soloist Prize>>>

Good to see things shaken up a bit...

jamieow
09.03.2008, 19:04
unsure - I make it that they're on same as Tongwynlais - I think at least...
Wxm 6+9= 15
Ton 8(?) + 7 = 15
??

JonP
09.03.2008, 19:21
Great Result, well done Tredegar. Like Cpl Jones used to say:

"They dont like it up em sir"

tcboy
09.03.2008, 19:26
Just got home excellent result for Tredegar & BTM if a little surprising? Brings to the fore the question of a single adjudicator ……. Surely the time has come to embrace more than one person in the box. As Tredegar knows from recent results this year to have a certain man in the box no matter how well and outstanding the playing the result will not be good. Looks like Cory has fallen to the same hurdle …. Lets hope there’s two in the box next year!!

TheMusicMan
09.03.2008, 19:58
Just got home excellent result for Tredegar & BTM if a little surprising? Brings to the fore the question of a single adjudicator ……. Surely the time has come to embrace more than one person in the box. As Tredegar knows from recent results this year to have a certain man in the box no matter how well and outstanding the playing the result will not be good. Looks like Cory has fallen to the same hurdle …. Lets hope there’s two in the box next year!!Why suprising tcboy..?

Accidental
09.03.2008, 19:59
Wow! bit of a shocker, but fantastic to see Tredegar back at the top :clap:

jamieow & clwydman - gradings are done on 3 years results: 2006 + 07 + 08, the bands with the 2 highest aggregate scores go down. L&SC actually issue copies of the gradings with the adjudicators remarks on the day - it always amazes me how many regions lave people to guess for themselves! Maybe its something to ask your regional committee to do next year?

RobBari
09.03.2008, 20:12
Surprising maybe, unexpected even, but Tred and BTM both qualified last year and came 8th and 7th at the finals in London. This result just shows that both bands are now performing consistantly at a high level and is not just a result of luck or due to any anomalies of the adjudication system. lets hope we are heading for a time when 3,4,or 5 bands can compete at this level as in the yorkshire area, raising the standards even higher. This may be end of a 6 year reign for Cory as Welsh champions but they have headed the challenge at national level for several years and have acted as an incentive for the other chamionship section bands to improve, they will be back i'm sure.

tcboy
09.03.2008, 21:49
Well the playing was OK but not sparkling the result means Wales sending a poor second to the European championships ….. think England without Johnny Wilkinson!!

little_miss_marcroft
09.03.2008, 21:59
Well done to Tredegar and Ian Porthouse! Fantastic result!

Hells Bones
09.03.2008, 22:08
Well the playing was OK but not sparkling the result means Wales sending a poor second to the European championships ….. think England without Johnny Wilkinson!!

Does that mean that Dyke should do the Europeans every year?

PeterBale
09.03.2008, 23:18
Well the playing was OK but not sparkling the result means Wales sending a poor second to the European championships ….. think England without Johnny Wilkinson!!


It didn't exactly do YBS any harm, winning the Europeans from 1999 to 2004 with the following Area results:
2004: Winners (D. King)
2003: 6th (D. King)
2002: 4th (D. King)
2001: 2nd (D. King)
2000: Winners (D. King)
1999: 6th

It just means that Cory will have to win in Norway to secure their place for next year ;)

the shed builder
10.03.2008, 01:39
id just like to say well done and a big pat on the back to POINT OF AYR after shaking off seven years of dust and clinching the first prize in the second section. a great start to for the ressurected point! congrats also to ian porthouse and tredegar for a great result.

hamish5322
10.03.2008, 07:23
Heard Point, they were immense. Well done. 2nd section will be interesting this year.

Pastit
10.03.2008, 09:47
An interesting result indeed!
Does that mean that Wrexham Brass are relegated?

Coo, at least let the corpse get a bit cold!!

If it is over 3 years, then I think (unofficially), Wrexham have 20pts, Cwmaman, 21pts and Tongwynlais 22pts

Mr_Euniverse
10.03.2008, 09:50
Absolutely gutted.
I thought there was a real positive feeling on stage in our performance. MD brought the music out and soloists nailed all.
How can a band that comes so high everywhere else get shafted so much at the area.
The Brangwyn Bogey still remains for us, if the band do go down to the 1st section it surely does make a mockery of all the results in recent areas.

Well done to the eventual winners and qualifiers though.

Simon Preshom
10.03.2008, 10:10
Well the playing was OK but not sparkling the result means Wales sending a poor second to the European championships ….. think England without Johnny Wilkinson!!

I am sure this comment has been made to provoke responses, so I am two minds about responding.

However, if the writer or anyone else believes that Wales is sending a poor second is crazy, I presume they are suggesting that both the English National, Scottish and Welsh areas are cancelled and we just send the 'top' bands to the Euros instead?

Yes, the majority of times, Cory will win the Welsh area, but the judge has to find the best performance, not the best band. On this occasion, the judge felt that it was Tredegar - hearty congratulations to Ian and the band for an amazing result, RAH and European qualification!

Dave_the_Flugel
10.03.2008, 10:33
Well done to all our fellow qualifiers.

Just wanted to say how pleased Cross Keys are at once again taking our place at the National Finals and winning the 4th section on Sunday, not a faultless performance from us but as Mr. Horsfield said it was consistently good and we gave the performance he was looking for. We were down in numbers on stage but thankfully this didn't seem to have mattered

Great day for Gwent banding as a whole as well with wins for Tredegar, Newbridge, Blaenavon Town and Cross Keys (4 out of 5 wins ain't bad but that theory doesn't apply to Wales rugby this coming Saturday afternoon) together with BTM, Rogerstone, Severn Tunnel and Newport also all doing extremely well - well done to all espeicially all the qualifiers, here we go again!

stopher
10.03.2008, 11:28
Well done to all the bands who qualified and also to Dewi Griffiths (Griffis) on best soloist/instrumentalist.

Mixed weekend for me results wise - was pleased with the performance of band I conducted and got last, wasn't as pleased with the band I played for and got 2nd! That's contesting for you! At least Wales won the rugby!

Was totally knackered after the LONG drive there and back from Anglesey

melt em all down
10.03.2008, 11:45
Well done to all the bands who qualified and also to Dewi Griffiths (Griffis) on best soloist/instrumentalist.

Mixed weekend for me results wise - was pleased with the performance of band I conducted and got last, wasn't as pleased with the band I played for and got 2nd! That's contesting for you! At least Wales won the rugby!

Was totally knackered after the LONG drive there and back from Anglesey
you get paid dont you?

stopher
10.03.2008, 11:53
Er, NO!

Proper banding as it was all at my own expense - hotel for 2 nights plus using my car and a round trip of nearly 400 miles

If you are referring to the pittance from the WRC then you would be wrong - each NW band getting less than £40 towards travelling is a joke but we are supposed to be grateful!

Nice to see you trying to stir things up again and hiding once again Melt

Griffis
10.03.2008, 11:55
Well the playing was OK but not sparkling the result means Wales sending a poor second to the European championships ….. think England without Johnny Wilkinson!!

Can I ask what you have against Tredegar Town Band? If I'm not mistaken you have posted 6 times on tmp, and all 6 have been in relation to Tred Band, and all 6 posts are "sla**ing" us off...!

Everyone is entitled to their opinion, but it does seem that you have an issue with the band...and you seem to be hiding your identity!!

Anyway, enough with this already!

Can I just say that we are sooooo happy with the win yesterday, and can't wait to go to Belgium next year!! Also congrats to BTM and all the other qualifiers especially to my mates in Newbridge and Beaumaris!

Dewi

no2taz
10.03.2008, 12:11
Can I ask what you have against Tredegar Town Band? If I'm not mistaken you have posted 6 times on tmp, and all 6 have been in relation to Tred Band, and all 6 posts are "sla**ing" us off...!

Everyone is entitled to their opinion, but it does seem that you have an issue with the band...and you seem to be hiding your identity!!

Anyway, enough with this already!

Can I just say that we are sooooo happy with the win yesterday, and can't wait to go to Belgium next year!! Also congrats to BTM and all the other qualifiers especially to my mates in Newbridge and Beaumaris!

Dewi


Wel said Dewi once again congrats ( little bit Jealous ) but one day...

Heard you deserved the soloist prize too... enjoy it See you soon

melt em all down
10.03.2008, 12:14
Er, NO!

Proper banding as it was all at my own expense - hotel for 2 nights plus using my car and a round trip of nearly 400 miles

If you are referring to the pittance from the WRC then you would be wrong - each NW band getting less than £40 towards travelling is a joke but we are supposed to be grateful!

Nice to see you trying to stir things up again and hiding once again Melt
tell me why you do it then? i mean all brass banders!you travel to and from rehearsals, to and from competitions,it rules your lives and you dont get paid.I am speaking from experience.I have lived with a "bander" for years .
you see, I just cannot understand why you all are so passionate about something that just seems to boost the conductors ego! and cost so much
to boot.
(think hard chris you know me??)

Griffis
10.03.2008, 12:26
Wel said Dewi once again congrats ( little bit Jealous ) but one day...

Heard you deserved the soloist prize too... enjoy it See you soon

Cheers Smithy, was a big shock for the band (and me especially) but there we go...it had to happen sooner or later suppose!

davethehorny
10.03.2008, 12:42
Well the playing was OK but not sparkling the result means Wales sending a poor second to the European championships ….. think England without Johnny Wilkinson!!

tcboy - 6 post as a newbie - all anti Tredegar!

Am I detecting a similar thread to your postings in 2008 as highlighted by Kiz7 in 2007?

May I also respectfully suggest that two people in the box does not mean a more consistent result. Take a peep at the West of England thread. Any competition decided by personal preference will throw up results that some people will find baffling. Having two adjudicators is not the answer to the problem some people thnk it is.

Congratulations to all at Tredegar - best of luck at the Europeans next year.

stopher
10.03.2008, 12:48
tell me why you do it then? i mean all brass banders!you travel to and from rehearsals, to and from competitions,it rules your lives and you dont get paid.I am speaking from experience.I have lived with a "bander" for years .
you see, I just cannot understand why you all are so passionate about something that just seems to boost the conductors ego! and cost so much
to boot.
(think hard chris you know me??)

Why do I do it - I enjoy so it keeps me out of the house and also out of prison!

To be honest, hope I don't know you as all you seem to do is wind people up!

Sop_Or_Bass?
10.03.2008, 12:52
think England without Johnny Wilkinson!!

May have been of benefit on Saturday!

ablower
10.03.2008, 12:53
Thanks for that, it's just a shame that our band probably won't be going to Swansea again, due to the resistance from some of the players who don't want to contest!

I feel the band made progress once again yesterday, much improved playing am sorry we can't continue to get even better.

Pastit
10.03.2008, 12:54
As a brief aside to the results debate, Wrexham Brass would like to thank Briton Ferry band for their assistance with a rehearsal room and their hospitality. I believe it helped refresh the band following their 6.30 am start!!

ablower
10.03.2008, 13:07
Yes I totally agree that Knighton Town Band played well yesterday, but probably won't get the chance to go to Swansea for another go next year due to anti contesting from some of the band members.
Thanks anyway.

Mountain Trekker
10.03.2008, 13:17
Yes I totally agree that Knighton Town Band played well yesterday, but probably won't get the chance to go to Swansea for another go next year due to anti contesting from some of the band members.
Thanks anyway.

A real shame we won't be going back, I thoroughly enjoyed the day. We did play well and over the last couple of months improved beyond recognition but a small minority seem to be very powefull!! :mad:

Anno Draconis
10.03.2008, 13:44
tell me why you do it then? i mean all brass banders!you travel to and from rehearsals, to and from competitions,it rules your lives and you dont get paid.I am speaking from experience.I have lived with a "bander" for years .
you see, I just cannot understand why you all are so passionate about something that just seems to boost the conductors ego! and cost so much
to boot.

If that's a serious question (as opposed to just trolling :rolleyes: ) then it's a very good one, and if you want to hear people's opinions you could start a new thread on that topic. I think you'd get a lot of response (especially at this time of year, when people who've had a bad day at the Area are asking themselves that very question!)


(think hard chris you know me??)

Well throw the guy a bone and tell 'im your name then. Honestly, this cloak-and-dagger cr@p ....:rolleyes:

melt em all down
10.03.2008, 14:12
Why do I do it - I enjoy so it keeps me out of the house and also out of prison!

To be honest, hope I don't know you as all you seem to do is wind people up!
all i want to know is WHY you all go to so much trouble for nothing
I dont understand playing music without getting paid and nobody has ever been able to give me a good reason for doing such a thing.
I really do find it unbeleivable that brass bands expect their players to perform for no fee and expect them to pay their own way as you had to at the weekend.dont you feel ripped off?

Anno Draconis
10.03.2008, 14:21
I dont understand playing music without getting paid and nobody has ever been able to give me a good reason for doing such a thing.

That's one of the saddest lines I've ever read. I genuinely feel sorry for you now.

Griffis
10.03.2008, 14:23
all i want to know is WHY you all go to so much trouble for nothing
I dont understand playing music without getting paid and nobody has ever been able to give me a good reason for doing such a thing.
I really do find it unbeleivable that brass bands expect their players to perform for no fee and expect them to pay their own way as you had to at the weekend.dont you feel ripped off?

You obviously don't "enjoy" playing music then...I play music for free sometimes, but I also get paid to play sometimes, but I always enjoy playing music, maybe that's the difference! Sounds to me like you wouldnt even get out of bed unless somebody paid you ;) (just a little joke before you have a go...)

melt em all down
10.03.2008, 14:31
That's one of the saddest lines I've ever read. I genuinely feel sorry for you now.
sticks & stones ,still no good reason for not getting paid to play!

melt em all down
10.03.2008, 14:41
You obviously don't "enjoy" playing music then...I play music for free sometimes, but I also get paid to play sometimes, but I always enjoy playing music, maybe that's the difference! Sounds to me like you wouldnt even get out of bed unless somebody paid you ;) (just a little joke before you have a go...)
quite right dewi! many a true word spoken in jest!
and actually i do enjoy playing music as long as i get my fee.
thats the phone going ......another Paid gig ...ching ching!!!!!

Hells Bones
10.03.2008, 15:06
I know I said it yesterday but once again, Well done Dewi! Hope you're not too hungover today though!

stopher
10.03.2008, 15:10
all i want to know is WHY you all go to so much trouble for nothing
I dont understand playing music without getting paid and nobody has ever been able to give me a good reason for doing such a thing.
I really do find it unbeleivable that brass bands expect their players to perform for no fee and expect them to pay their own way as you had to at the weekend.dont you feel ripped off?

It's my hobby, what i got a degree in from Salford, gives me great satisfaction teaching young kids to play, getting a decent result now and again and I actually enjoy it

cornetblower
10.03.2008, 15:29
A real shame we won't be going back, I thoroughly enjoyed the day. We did play well and over the last couple of months improved beyond recognition but a small minority seem to be very powefull!! :mad:

I really hope that you are back next year. Don't let the minority spoil it for the rest of you.

Jan H
10.03.2008, 15:39
Moderator request:

The people who want to continue discussing whether playing music can be enjoyed without being paid, are kindly asked to create a new topic in The Rehearsal Room forum. Further posts about it in this thread will be considered off-topic and deleted on sight.

Thanks

jimmy H
10.03.2008, 16:11
Just noticed that Newbridge won by 4 points! as i did not hear them or Baumaris were they really that far ahead of all other bands on the day or is this a slightly flattering score? After their result in Porthcawl i guess they were a lot better.








rob if most bands worked as hard as newbridge do ,these results wouldnt seem a misprint ,plus listening to the better bands may add something to ones own playing and thought performance

jimmy H
10.03.2008, 16:18
Wel said Dewi once again congrats ( little bit Jealous ) but one day...

Heard you deserved the soloist prize too... enjoy it See you soon


smithy you changed your name ,taz suits you haha

no2taz
10.03.2008, 16:40
smithy you changed your name ,taz suits you haha

Haha Jimmy ... how are you good to see you down in Swansea... and Mrs H too...
Its always been TAZ on here No 2 TAZ ( no TAZING please ) you know how paul hates TAZZERS.

Will you be in Blackpool for a listen Epic is a good listers piece im sure we can find room on the coach foryou both LOL

2nd man down
10.03.2008, 16:49
Moderator request;

Please try to keep one to one discussions away from specific topic threads, it makes for a lot of reading that other posters are not interested in.

Further off topic posts will have to be removed.

2md, on behalf of the tMP moderator team.

no2taz
10.03.2008, 16:53
Ooops Gues that told us ....... My appologies 2md

toptutti
10.03.2008, 17:32
Good to see Point of Ayr back with a bang

Mephi
10.03.2008, 18:01
After all the sniping about Point of Ayr reforming I would just like to say a massive well done for your efforts and then getting back to winning ways straight away. Those bands that aren't happy will only have a short time before you are out of their way because you'll get back where you belong with any luck! Bring on the japes of 1997 onwards when the band put several notable noses out of joint (even if you have to do it without a Delph dwelling principal cornet and have to rely on crazy Keith!) With the other results in the Championship section it seems like tides may be turning! Well done Tred and BTM!

emzbaby31
10.03.2008, 18:01
Bumbling along at the mottom i dont think so!!! really good result for newport!!! shame we missed out on harrogate but bring it on borough are back!!! :D

TredegarSteveR
10.03.2008, 19:30
Cheers Smithy, was a big shock for the band (and me especially) but there we go...it had to happen sooner or later suppose!
Awesome result for the band Dewi and great to see you getting a well deserved soloist prize. See you soon mate.

RobBari
10.03.2008, 19:30
rob if most bands worked as hard as newbridge do ,these results wouldnt seem a misprint ,plus listening to the better bands may add something to ones own playing and thought performance

Never thought it a misprint, and am more than aware of the work ethic at Newbridge, it is however unusual at any contest never mind the areas to have such a large points differential ( however it seems with Tred winning by 3pts as well things are changing).
As for listening to better bands to improve ones own performance i could not agree more, however when Newbridge were playing ( draw no. 2) we were backstage waiting to play at No. 4. I have listened to Newbridge enough times to know how good a band they are and are more than capable of winning with a big margin, my original request was just for the opinions of those bandsmen who did indeed hear their performance as well as Baumaris and Markham.
By the way, did you hear any of the performances, as your comment does not really answer my original question?

caesar romaro
10.03.2008, 19:45
Hi mate, hope you're well. Can't make it to Swansea I'm afraid but I'll be keeping an eye out for the results!
alright gaz, or should i say gizmo? why are you afraid to go to swansea? hows that spot on your nose mate, keith (POA)
As you were!

no2taz
10.03.2008, 19:51
By the way, did you hear any of the performances, as your comment does not really answer my original question?

I can vouch fro Mr H here by sayin that i know he listens to every band in every section at any contest he might decide to attend. You could say he is a hard core band enthuiast...

even Mrs H gets dragged allong LOL..

( hope you donyt mund me butting in on that one Jimmy only i happend to be online before you )

no2taz
10.03.2008, 19:56
[QUOTE=RobBari;587014]Never thought it a misprint, and am more than aware of the work ethic at Newbridge, it is however unusual at any contest never mind the areas to have such a large points differential ( however it seems with Tred winning by 3pts as well things are changing).
/QUOTE]


Newbridge won the second section area playing Immages of a Millenium by 4 points in 2006... and Weston super mare Championship section in 2006 on Esence of time by 4 points... It can be done...

caesar romaro
10.03.2008, 20:15
After all the sniping about Point of Ayr reforming I would just like to say a massive well done for your efforts and then getting back to winning ways straight away. Those bands that aren't happy will only have a short time before you are out of their way because you'll get back where you belong with any luck! Bring on the japes of 1997 onwards when the band put several notable noses out of joint (even if you have to do it without a Delph dwelling principal cornet and have to rely on crazy Keith!) With the other results in the Championship section it seems like tides may be turning! Well done Tred and BTM!
you watch it you! crazy keith.

caesar romaro
10.03.2008, 20:29
One of the bands missing from the swansea list for the last two years is Conwy, the band doesn't exist now, Due to people leaving to go to uni or work reasons or some who had just had enough, unable to replace them the band decided to fold. keith (POA) ex MD Conwy

RobBari
10.03.2008, 20:31
Newbridge won the second section area playing Immages of a Millenium by 4 points in 2006... and Weston super mare Championship section in 2006 on Esence of time by 4 points... It can be done...[/quote]

It was never my intention to undermine the acheivement of Newbridge on Saturday, i've been around long enough to know that a band can be miles better than the others and deserve a big margin of victory. I simply wanted to hear opinions on the relative performances of the top 3 bands. I thought Markham gave a good performance and 3rd place was a good return for us, I have no complaints about being beaten by two very good bands.
:)

Rambo
10.03.2008, 20:33
Congratulations to all the winning bands, especially Point Of Ayr, 15 practices and victory for a bunch of wrinklies is not bad.
Crazy Kieth?
not now!
new nick name................ Baby sitter Kieth!:(

spyder
10.03.2008, 22:25
Congratulations to all the winning bands, especially Point Of Ayr, 15 practices and victory for a bunch of wrinklies is not bad.
Crazy Kieth?
not now!
new nick name................ Baby sitter Kieth!:(

Ditto Clwydians comments - nice to see Point back on stage.
Nice attire as well - looked like you'd all walked through a famous supermarket! And those ties must have cost a fortune.

As for Crazy Keith - diapers & dummies at the ready

no2taz
10.03.2008, 22:31
Newbridge won the second section area playing Immages of a Millenium by 4 points in 2006... and Weston super mare Championship section in 2006 on Esence of time by 4 points... It can be done...

It was never my intention to undermine the acheivement of Newbridge on Saturday, i've been around long enough to know that a band can be miles better than the others and deserve a big margin of victory. I simply wanted to hear opinions on the relative performances of the top 3 bands. I thought Markham gave a good performance and 3rd place was a good return for us, I have no complaints about being beaten by two very good bands.
:)[/QUOTE]

My appologies Robbari i did not mean my last comment to come across as a ticking off.. was purley for information and a feble attempt at inspiration..

caesar romaro
10.03.2008, 22:50
Ditto Clwydians comments - nice to see Point back on stage.
Nice attire as well - looked like you'd all walked through a famous supermarket! And those ties must have cost a fortune.

As for Crazy Keith - diapers & dummies at the ready
I thought we all looked very smart aswell, "every little helps"
difficult finding the lads in the dark though! keith(POA)

hughess
11.03.2008, 10:16
Ditto Clwydians comments - nice to see Point back on stage.
Nice attire as well - looked like you'd all walked through a famous supermarket! And those ties must have cost a fortune.

As for Crazy Keith - diapers & dummies at the ready

The ties cost more than the suits.

jonmoss
11.03.2008, 12:08
I thought we all looked very smart aswell, "every little helps"
difficult finding the lads in the dark though! keith(POA)

Great to see you 'old' rogues again. Did you notice we made sure you had left the Indian first before leaving The Wig ??? ;)

Many congrats on the result - a fantastic achievement !!! :clap: :clap:

Mountain Trekker
11.03.2008, 12:36
I really hope that you are back next year. Don't let the minority spoil it for the rest of you.


I hope so too, I shall do my upmost to make sure we are. :p

smi00107
11.03.2008, 12:41
Well done to Blaenavon Town Band for winning the Third Section on Saturday. After some really poor results in the last few years at Swansea it is great to see the band with a bit a stability now.
Well done to Lyndon Price who has made a big impact at BTB. He has worked so hard in getting intonation, tuning and tempos just right on DSOTM.
Ev :)

ablower
11.03.2008, 12:42
I hope so too, I shall do my upmost to make sure we are. :p


I also hope that Knighton Town Band will be back next year

ABERTROM
11.03.2008, 13:14
Well done Blaenavon Town.
I wonder what the finals piece will be.
I'd better buy some slide cream before then.

the shed builder
11.03.2008, 13:31
The ties cost more than the suits.
the chicken curry smeared all down my tie must at least of doubled the value! its knackered after one contest, is that a record? machine washable suits is the way to go....... roll on harrogate

LeDragon
11.03.2008, 18:56
alright gaz, or should i say gizmo? why are you afraid to go to swansea? hows that spot on your nose mate, keith (POA)
As you were!

Haha don't remind me about that spot!!!

Congrats on the result mate

Cantonian
12.03.2008, 17:32
Absolutely gutted.
I thought there was a real positive feeling on stage in our performance. MD brought the music out and soloists nailed all.
How can a band that comes so high everywhere else get shafted so much at the area.
The Brangwyn Bogey still remains for us, if the band do go down to the 1st section it surely does make a mockery of all the results in recent areas.

Well done to the eventual winners and qualifiers though.

Mr Morrison, the adjudicator, in his summing up said that it was a band contest not a Conductor's contest.

I heard all bands except for Tred and Northop and must admit that I found the interpretation of Eric Ball's Festival Music by Mr Pritchard so far away from what is written on the copies that ity made me squirm. Several other more knowledgable persons around me made very similar comments. The notes played by Ton were (as usual) very good and desrving of a higher placing. However at the areas IMHO it was too great a gamble for the MD to give such a different interpretation of the piece

Mr_Euniverse
12.03.2008, 22:30
Mr Morrison, the adjudicator, in his summing up said that it was a band contest not a Conductor's contest.

I heard all bands except for Tred and Northop and must admit that I found the interpretation of Eric Ball's Festival Music by Mr Pritchard so far away from what is written on the copies that ity made me squirm. Several other more knowledgable persons around me made very similar comments. The notes played by Ton were (as usual) very good and desrving of a higher placing. However at the areas IMHO it was too great a gamble for the MD to give such a different interpretation of the piece

So if Alan Morrison said it was "not a conductors contest" why were we penalised so much for what you think as an interpretation error?
People were saying that both ours and Cory's performance were very similiar (in terms of interpretation mostly)

cspuk
12.03.2008, 22:40
What a reslt for TREDEGAR !!!

Alyn James
13.03.2008, 01:05
Mr Morrison, the adjudicator, in his summing up said that it was a band contest not a Conductor's contest.

I heard all bands except for Tred and Northop and must admit that I found the interpretation of Eric Ball's Festival Music by Mr Pritchard so far away from what is written on the copies that ity made me squirm. Several other more knowledgable persons around me made very similar comments. The notes played by Ton were (as usual) very good and desrving of a higher placing. However at the areas IMHO it was too great a gamble for the MD to give such a different interpretation of the piece

Thanks for showing your appreciation of our playing :clap: .... not sure about the "squirm" bit, though....it's a funny old game...

GarethPritchard
13.03.2008, 10:45
Mr Morrison, the adjudicator, in his summing up said that it was a band contest not a Conductor's contest.

I heard all bands except for Tred and Northop and must admit that I found the interpretation of Eric Ball's Festival Music by Mr Pritchard so far away from what is written on the copies that ity made me squirm. Several other more knowledgable persons around me made very similar comments. The notes played by Ton were (as usual) very good and desrving of a higher placing. However at the areas IMHO it was too great a gamble for the MD to give such a different interpretation of the piece

I'm intrigued on a few counts.


What is it with you and my interpretations? Didn't you also criticise my interpretation of Partita at Pontins?
What criteria do you use to come to this harsh criticism?
What qualifies you to make these derisory comments?
What exactly is it that you think I did that was 'so far from what was written on the copies' that made you with all your experience 'squirm' then?Just for your information, the band was criticised by the adjudicator for playing annomalies including clicks, ensemble and the like. However, like you, I thought that harsh because I felt the band played very well and in my 40 years experience in Top Class Banding (including winning performances at the Open, Norwegian National et al) I have yet to experience a perfect performance.

Just for your information, the interpretation was first and foremost 'in my heart' but also based on memeory of playing the piece with Eric Ball himself and other emminent conductors such as Walter Hargreaves, Peter Parkes, Bram Tovey and of our winning performance with Brodsworth Colliery Band at the Grand Shield in 1982 with Dennis Carr. If I'd realised beforehand that he had wanted a 'straight up and down emotionless' performance, in the best interests of my band's attempt at qualifying for London, I would have done so.

During my days at Ransomes, I noticed an adjudication in a frame on the wall, when I asked what it was I was told that it was from the British Open in 1950 when Resurgam was the Test Piece and Eric Ball was their Conductor on the day. The reason it was put in a frame was............... it said that the Conductor obviously didn't understand the Composer's intentions!!!!!!!!!!!!!! On the same day, Eric Ball was heard to say to Harry Mortimer (the winning conductor) that he thought the performance was fantastic and that Harry had found things in the score that he never invisaged.

I should also like to draw your attention to the ongoing discussion of interpretations of Beethoven and Mozart symphonies that when conducted by very eminent conductors (far above my musical prowess) can vary in length by many minutes. I would not dare to say any of them were right or wrong or that any would make me 'squirm'............they are just different and should all have the right to be accepted for what they are - that conductor's feeling for that piece of music.

I suppose the alternative could be a MASSIVE metronome for all the bands to play to.

Strange thing interpretation eh?

JonP
13.03.2008, 14:29
IL say it again!

"They Dont Like It Up Em Sir!!"

Gavin
13.03.2008, 14:50
IL say it again!

"They Dont Like It Up Em Sir!!"

?? http://planetsmilies.net/confused-smiley-17428.gif (http://planetsmilies.net)

JonP
13.03.2008, 15:54
Im just gently chuckling at the whole thing. Nothing personal is meant against anyone or any band.

Jan H
13.03.2008, 17:01
In the 4BR retrospective (http://www.4barsrest.com/articles/2008/art820e.asp ),
Iwan Fox mentions that if Cory wins the European Championships this year, Wales would be allowed to send 3 bands to next year's championships.

Where does he get that crazy idea from? The rule has always been the champions is invited back = the country of the winning band gets to send 1 additional band.

Hells Bones
13.03.2008, 17:10
Link didn't work Jan

Jan H
13.03.2008, 17:37
Link didn't work Jan
I have fixed it... :tup and here is it again:
http://www.4barsrest.com/articles/2008/art820e.asp

Cantonian
13.03.2008, 17:38
I'm intrigued on a few counts.


What is it with you and my interpretations? Didn't you also criticise my interpretation of Partita at Pontins?
What criteria do you use to come to this harsh criticism?
What qualifies you to make these derisory comments?
What exactly is it that you think I did that was 'so far from what was written on the copies' that made you with all your experience 'squirm' then?
Just for your information, the interpretation was first and foremost 'in my heart' ...... If I'd realised beforehand that he had wanted a 'straight up and down emotionless' performance, in the best interests of my band's attempt at qualifying for London, I would have done so.


I should also like to draw your attention to the ongoing discussion of interpretations of Beethoven and Mozart symphonies that when conducted by very eminent conductors (far above my musical prowess) can vary in length by many minutes. I would not dare to say any of them were right or wrong or that any would make me 'squirm'............they are just different and should all have the right to be accepted for what they are - that conductor's feeling for that piece of music.

I suppose the alternative could be a MASSIVE metronome for all the bands to play to.

Strange thing interpretation eh?

1. I have just looked through my comments from Pontins and cannot see any place where I criticised Ton's performance.
2+3.I'm sorry if you feel my criticism derisory and harsh, but the main criterion is that of my two ears listening to the perforrmance. My qualification is that of experience, also having played under many great musicians and brass band composers including Eric Ball several times.
4. Whilst I cannot remember every example of what I (and others) thought was far away from what is written, the first bars 'in my opinion' set the tone. There are two beats (in tempo) rest at the end of the third and sixth bar. You had two 'general pauses'! Similarly at the end of the first movement.

Like you I do not agree with the Metronomic approach, but I feel that music must flow.

Perhaps you are right in that the conductors feeling for a piece of music gives different interpretations of that music, whether a symphony or test piece. My interpretation of the music we played on Sunday is different to yours.

An 'straight up and down emotionless performance' is impossible in Eric Ball's music (even in a pastiche of Mozart), but unfortunately in the confines of a contest, a 'different' interpretation of a piece, as you know, does not often satisfy the adjudicator(s)

As a part of a concert, then your interpretation, in my view would be considered intriguing and perhaps deserving of congratulation for looking for something different in this Symphonic suite. However in the context of a band contest Test piece, my opinion (amongst others) was that you took a great risk and made me squirm in my seat.

The bottom line is what the entire fora as displayed on tMP are all about. Opinions!

Gavin
13.03.2008, 17:48
4. Whilst I cannot remember every example of what I (and others) thought was far away from what is written, the first bars 'in my opinion' set the tone. There are two beats (in tempo) rest at the end of the third and sixth bar. You had two 'general pauses'! Similarly at the end of the first movement.

If this is a sample of your recollection, I can assure you that you have the wrong performance. It was, in fact, Burry Port who did what you are talking about with the pauses at the beginning and at the end of the first movement. There is a very illegal recording that will prove that we did not do this. Perhaps as I was one of the only conductors to conduct the first movement in the two beats per bar instructed by the composer you mistook my second beat at metronome 80 to be something else.

I do not have time to comment on any of the rest at this point other than the work squirm makes me squirm.

Gareth - on Gavin's computer

JonP
13.03.2008, 19:01
In the 4BR retrospective (http://www.4barsrest.com/articles/2008/art820e.asp ),
Iwan Fox mentions that if Cory wins the European Championships this year, Wales would be allowed to send 3 bands to next year's championships.

Where does he get that crazy idea from? The rule has always been the champions is invited back = the country of the winning band gets to send 1 additional band.

It was last year that Brighouse should have attended the contest as it was held in the UK. They did not receive the invitation and were told that the winning bands nation would be allowed to nominate one other band rather than the old rule of the host nation getting an extra band.

I think Iwan Fox is right.

JonP
13.03.2008, 19:07
The bottom line is what the entire fora as displayed on tMP are all about. Opinions!

Whoever is right or wrong in this doesnt really matter. The man whos opinion was important is Alan Morrison. His opinion is expressed in the result. Harsh but true. Didnt hear Ton, but the finest adjudicator in the world (my wife) did. Unfortunatley her comments are top secret! She did say however that she thought Tred should Beat Cory and they did!!

Nice one Tred!! Well done Ian!! Il say it once more!!

"They dont like it up em sir!!"

sop 1
13.03.2008, 19:14
well done jon heard the band,great performance!

Hoss
13.03.2008, 21:01
Great response from Mr G Pritchard re his interpretation, a direct and robust riposte...BRAVO !!! An observation however is that opinions are like bottoms..everyone has one and brass banding is fun, a hobby and we all shouldnt take it too seriously, its all about making music.:)

Splitzer
13.03.2008, 22:41
Anyone able to shed light on a rumour I heard from Swansea - I heard that a band had asked to play earlier than their original draw due to a player being called away in an emergency and another band objecting only moments before the other band walked on stage??:confused:

JonP
13.03.2008, 23:11
Anyone able to shed light on a rumour I heard from Swansea - I heard that a band had asked to play earlier than their original draw due to a player being called away in an emergency and another band objecting only moments before the other band walked on stage??:confused:

Funny you should say that Splitz. Something like that did happen.

I can shed some light on it and will, but lets see if they will own up first.

There are a few of their members very active here right now!

Lets see.

Hells Bones
13.03.2008, 23:19
Would I be right in thinking it was something to do with an imminent arrival?

Jan H
13.03.2008, 23:41
It was last year that Brighouse should have attended the contest as it was held in the UK. They did not receive the invitation and were told that the winning bands nation would be allowed to nominate one other band rather than the old rule of the host nation getting an extra band.

I think Iwan Fox is right.
I correct myself, The rule has not "always" been that the country of the winning band gets a second representative. But it has been like that for the last couple of years. That's why last year there were two Belgian bands, but only one English (in the champ section), This year there will be two Belgian bands as well. Th elast time there were three bands from a single country, was when YBS got a "special" invitation (black dyke was defending champion and Leyland was the official English nomination, irc). So I think Iwan Fox is wrong :)

Anyway, congratulations to Tredegar; I hope I'm able to see you next year in Ostend ;)

tam-tam2
14.03.2008, 00:44
Must congratulate all Gwent band on their performance last Saturday - especially my old band Rogerstone in the Second Section - shame you didn't quite get the qualification spot.

Congrats to Tredegar and BTM for their success - that certainly makes banding in Wales more interesting for the outsider.

Special mention to Cross-keys too who have a super record at the area for the last three years - hope you have better luck in Harrrogate this time around. You should be used to the stage there by now!!

darcy21
14.03.2008, 01:54
Funny you should say that Splitz. Something like that did happen.

I can shed some light on it and will, but lets see if they will own up first.

There are a few of their members very active here right now!

Lets see.

:confused: yes, i myself didnt understand what was going on on sunday, loads of confusion as to what was happening.

we were told one thing then told a completely different thing 5 minutes later.:confused:

confusion and band contests seem to go hand in hand.:confused:

Mr_Euniverse
14.03.2008, 09:25
1. I have just looked through my comments from Pontins and cannot see any place where I criticised Ton's performance.


Perhaps you are right in that the conductors feeling for a piece of music gives different interpretations of that music, whether a symphony or test piece. My interpretation of the music we played on Sunday is different to yours.

Opinions!


Have to say all we are commenting on here is interpretation.

Didn't Alan Morrison say at the start, "this is not a conductor's contest" and on the lines of not looking for a carbon copy of how he conducted with Brighouse (and incidentally got slated by David Read)?
:ranting2:
I just wish that when adjudicators stand up in front of the audience and say things that swayed them either way they are honest and the results reflect what he says. He seemed very concerned about pedalling, BTM and Cory were apparently the 2 most noticable bands bass pedalling (2nd & 3rd).
Need I say more

Roscoff
14.03.2008, 09:27
I will clear it up for you then Darcy. One of BTM's players was informed while at the contest that their father was in a critical condition in hospital and so BTM asked if they could go on straight away so that the player could leave asap. All bands agreed that this would be ok except one. Now I wonder who it was?

TheMusicMan
14.03.2008, 09:42
I will clear it up for you then Darcy. One of BTM's players was informed while at the contest that their father was in a critical condition in hospital and so BTM asked if they could go on straight away so that the player could leave asap. All bands agreed that this would be ok except one. Now I wonder who it was?I don't know the details of this particular incident, as I was not there. But even if any band had said no, they wouldn't have been breaking any rules for saying no. OK, morally perhaps, saying no under the circumstances wouldn't be the nicest thing to have done, but no rules would have been broken.

Mr_Euniverse
14.03.2008, 09:58
I don't know the details of this particular incident, as I was not there. But even if any band had said no, they wouldn't have been breaking any rules for saying no. OK, morally perhaps, saying no under the circumstances wouldn't be the nicest thing to have done, but no rules would have been broken.

Let me just clear this up.

We were asked if BTM could go on in front of us. We told the association this would be OK taking account of the circumstances as we were there ready and waiting for one band to play would have been OK.
BTM would play no 5 and all other bands to play one after they'd been drawn.
The Welsh association told us that is against the rules. They said we would have to swap draws (from 5th to 8th). We were lining up in stage jackets to go on at the time. This would have meant us to get changed back into walking outs and wander round for a bit.

Roscoff
14.03.2008, 09:59
I don't know the details of this particular incident, as I was not there. But even if any band had said no, they wouldn't have been breaking any rules for saying no. OK, morally perhaps, saying no under the circumstances wouldn't be the nicest thing to have done, but no rules would have been broken.

Agreed. No rules were broken. But there are some things that are bigger than brass banding. Compassion for a fellow human being for a start.

Gavin
14.03.2008, 10:04
Let me just clear this up.

We were asked if BTM could go on in front of us. We told the association this would be OK taking account of the circumstances as we were there ready and waiting for one band to play would have been OK.
BTM would play no 5 and all other bands to play one after they'd been drawn.
The Welsh association told us that is against the rules. They said we would have to swap draws (from 5th to 8th). We were lining up in stage jackets to go on at the time. This would have meant us to get changed back into walking outs and wander round for a bit.

Don't think they are pointing the finger at us though. As you stated, we said we were willing to cooperate. I guess what they are referring to is a different conversation with another band that we aren't aware of

TheMusicMan
14.03.2008, 10:04
Let me just clear this up.

We were asked if BTM could go on in front of us. We told the association this would be OK taking account of the circumstances as we were there ready and waiting for one band to play would have been OK.
BTM would play no 5 and all other bands to play one after they'd been drawn.
The Welsh association told us that is against the rules. They said we would have to swap draws (from 5th to 8th). We were lining up in stage jackets to go on at the time. This would have meant us to get changed back into walking outs and wander round for a bit.I appreciate that Martyn thanks, however all I alluded to was that the band who perhaps said 'no' wouldn't have been breaking any rules by saying no.

Morally, under the circumstances and from a personal perspective I guess this is questionable, but breaks no rules by saying no.

Chunky
14.03.2008, 10:06
This would have meant us to get changed back into walking outs and wander round for a bit.

How awful for you.

The Wherryman
14.03.2008, 10:06
Let me just clear this up.

We were asked if BTM could go on in front of us. We told the association this would be OK taking account of the circumstances as we were there ready and waiting for one band to play would have been OK.
BTM would play no 5 and all other bands to play one after they'd been drawn.
The Welsh association told us that is against the rules. They said we would have to swap draws (from 5th to 8th). We were lining up in stage jackets to go on at the time. This would have meant us to get changed back into walking outs and wander round for a bit.

So if I've got this right, you would have been happy to play 6th, but not 8th - a difference of, perhaps, 20-30 minutes? Hardly time to get changed back into walking outs let alone wander around for a bit.

Gavin
14.03.2008, 10:09
So if I've got this right, you would have been happy to play 6th, but not 8th - a difference of, perhaps, 20-30 minutes? Hardly time to get changed back into walking outs let alone wander around for a bit.

Lets put an end to this now. The players from BTM are not talking about us. We said they COULD play before us.

Mr_Euniverse
14.03.2008, 10:10
Don't think they are pointing the finger at us though. As you stated, we said we were willing to cooperate. I guess what they are referring to is a different conversation with another band that we aren't aware of
:redface:

Jan H
14.03.2008, 10:12
The Welsh association told us that is against the rules. They said we would have to swap draws (from 5th to 8th). We were lining up in stage jackets to go on at the time. This would have meant us to get changed back into walking outs and wander round for a bit.
with a bit of creativity, you could have swapped with BTM (5th for 8th)
new order: 8 - 6 - 7 - 5
then you could have swapped again with band 6
new order: 8 - 5 - 7 - 6
then band 6 and 7 could have swapped
new order: 8 - 5 - 6 - 7

all within the official rules ;)

Gavin
14.03.2008, 10:15
with a bit of creativity, you could have swapped with BTM (5th for 8th)
new order: 8 - 6 - 7 - 5
then you could have swapped again with band 6
new order: 8 - 5 - 7 - 6
then band 6 and 7 could have swapped
new order: 8 - 5 - 6 - 7

all within the official rules ;)

True, but the Welsh Association said they wouldn't allow this

The Wherryman
14.03.2008, 10:17
Lets put an end to this now. The players from BTM are not talking about us. We said they COULD play before us.

Does anyone know who we are talking about? And, perhaps more importantly, how's the guy's dad?

Lawrencediana
14.03.2008, 10:20
So if I've got this right, you would have been happy to play 6th, but not 8th - a difference of, perhaps, 20-30 minutes? Hardly time to get changed back into walking outs let alone wander around for a bit.

But that is not the point really, when a band is close to the point of registration most of the mental preparation is done and I can see that having to wait an extra 45 minutes could play havoc and create problems for the performance. I think it would not have made too much difference to wait for 10-15mins but for 40-45 mins would have been a real concern.

Horny Dentist
14.03.2008, 10:21
Lets put an end to this now. The players from BTM are not talking about us. We said they COULD play before us.

I believe it to be just a bit more than coincidence that as BTM were warming up to go on stage before Tongwynlais, some of their players came to dig some information from us, and then 2 minutes later after we signed and were waiting to go on stage we were told a band had objected!!

I wonder who it could have been? Any keen detectives out there??

Horny Dentist
14.03.2008, 10:26
But that is not the point really, when a band is close to the point of registration most of the mental preparation is done and I can see that having to wait an extra 45 minutes could play havoc and create problems for the performance. I think it would not have made too much difference to wait for 10-15mins but for 40-45 mins would have been a real concern.

Well as things turned out we had to wait that 45 minutes - hour after registering - however the sheer determination to show who was boss following being pulled back from the stage doors an hour earlier worked well for us!

The Wherryman
14.03.2008, 10:27
But that is not the point really, when a band is close to the point of registration most of the mental preparation is done and I can see that having to wait an extra 45 minutes could play havoc and create problems for the performance. I think it would not have made too much difference to wait for 10-15mins but for 40-45 mins would have been a real concern.

...but that wasn't the reason given for saying "No" (and I'm not saying who said "No" or pointing any fingers).

Lawrencediana
14.03.2008, 10:29
Well as things turned out we had to wait that 45 minutes - hour after registering - however the sheer determination to show who was boss following being pulled back from the stage doors an hour earlier worked well for us!

It is a pain when rules get in the way, but very well done anyway and I hope the gentleman concerned makes a speedy recovery.

Captain Cymru
14.03.2008, 10:30
I believe it to be just a bit more than coincidence that as BTM were warming up to go on stage before Tongwynlais, some of their players came to dig some information from us, and then 2 minutes later after we signed and were waiting to go on stage we were told a band had objected!!

I wonder who it could have been? Any keen detectives out there??

So why did you not request to play from the No1 draw then if this was so important?

Horny Dentist
14.03.2008, 10:36
So why did you not request to play from the No1 draw then if this was so important?

I believe the call came apporx 30 minutes after the championship section had begun.

Roscoff
14.03.2008, 11:18
Don't think they are pointing the finger at us though. As you stated, we said we were willing to cooperate. I guess what they are referring to is a different conversation with another band that we aren't aware of

No no. The finger is most certainly being pointed at you. No other band raised any objection.

salefc
14.03.2008, 11:19
Gladly at the end of the day, no matter what went on, it seems everyone got their just desserts. Some in more ways than one.

A well done to Tredegar, but to BTM who must have worn some tighter pants to keep things tight on the day!

Gavin
14.03.2008, 11:23
No no. The finger is most certainly being pointed at you. No other band raised any objection.

This matter has now been raised and solved with your band manager. May I suggest you speak with him? What you are saying is not true

Gavin
14.03.2008, 11:29
No no. The finger is most certainly being pointed at you. No other band raised any objection.

Unless you have proof of this, may I kindly ask that you retract your statement?

Roscoff
14.03.2008, 11:33
This matter has now been raised and solved with your band manager. May I suggest you speak with him? What you are saying is not true

If any other band raised an objection then Ton were only part of the problem. But still part of the problem. Either way I think it was a pretty disgraceful show.

Edit: And no I will not retract my statement by your own euphonium players admission your band were not willing to play later. Within your right of course. But being right, that's another matter.

TheMusicMan
14.03.2008, 11:45
Right everyone, time to step in... regarding the order of play at the Welsh area; I have spoken to the people concerned i.e. representatives from Ton and BTM, and they are both in full agreement that this item has been resolved, and therefore I am asking that there is no need for further debate on this matter, nor to throw any comments back and forth on this matter any further. Both gentlemen I spoke to are perfectly happy with each others explanations, and the conversation here on tMP has now become a little daft.

So, please do feel free to continue with discussions regarding the Welsh Regional Areas 2008, but absolutely no more petty comments about requests to amend the order of play or matters related.

Any such posts will be removed on sight, with no explanation as to why we [i] decide to do so. Period.

Thanks all...

JonP
14.03.2008, 12:48
Right everyone, time to step in... regarding the order of play at the Welsh area; I have spoken to the people concerned i.e. representatives from Ton and BTM, and they are both in full agreement that this item has been resolved, and therefore I am asking that there is no need for further debate on this matter, nor to throw any comments back and forth on this matter any further.

Any such posts will be removed on sight, with no explanation as to why we [i] decide to do so. Period.

Thanks all...


So whats the rules at teh welsh area about extenuating circumatances and changing / altering the draw?? Is it allowed to swap draws? Is that what was being said. It was ok to swap places but not to move all the bands back??

(NO Reference or link to BTM or Ton, and im not wishing to discuss that situation.)

JonP
14.03.2008, 13:00
Do we need protecting or something. Please explain Music Man. Perhaps i should cover my computer in bubble wrap so i dont cut myself on the sharp corners!! ;-)

Jan H
14.03.2008, 13:12
Do we need protecting or something. Please explain Music Man. Perhaps i should cover my computer in bubble wrap so i dont cut myself on the sharp corners!! ;-)
see

Any such posts will be removed on sight, with no explanation as to why we [i] decide to do so. Period.

Jan H
14.03.2008, 13:23
If there are people here that want to continue this topic in a serious way, they can and we would like that very much.

In the hypothetical case that there would be further hypothetical posts, these will be hypothetically removed. This is a friendly request. If we would have to repeat this (hypothetically speaking of course), there may be further consequences. Our rules are not so hypothetical ;)

Roscoff
14.03.2008, 14:06
I do not believe you removed that post:tup Anyway. Congrats to Tredegar as was previously stated.

tam-tam2
14.03.2008, 16:55
Must congratulate all Gwent band on their performance last Saturday - especially my old band Rogerstone in the Second Section - shame you didn't quite get the qualification spot.

Congrats to Tredegar and BTM for their success - that certainly makes banding in Wales more interesting for the outsider.

Special mention to Cross-keys too who have a super record at the area for the last three years - hope you have better luck in Harrrogate this time around. You should be used to the stage there by now!!


And.....;)
how could forget the incredible achievement of Newbridge Band. Their success just keeps on going and it must have been some performance to have won by 4 points. I am sure you will do very well at Harrogate!

JonP
14.03.2008, 19:08
And.....;)
how could forget the incredible achievement of Newbridge Band. Their success just keeps on going and it must have been some performance to have won by 4 points. I am sure you will do very well at Harrogate!\

Il put a tenner on them to win.

JonP
14.03.2008, 19:09
[B]If there are people here that want to continue this topic in a serious way, they can and we would like that very much.

B]

How?

Jan H
14.03.2008, 19:48
How?
not like this ^

the post before that was better ;)

tam-tam2
14.03.2008, 22:32
\

Il put a tenner on them to win.


So would I!!;)

JonP
16.03.2008, 13:53
It seems that the over moderation of this thread has killed it dead. Nice one Censors. Another success for your oh so tiresome PCness.

TheMusicMan
16.03.2008, 16:46
Jon, we had discussions yesterday about this and you were asked to simply drop it. Why can't you just leave things...? Please keep this thread on topic, making posts like this just doesn't help.... us or you!

Anno Draconis
16.03.2008, 17:19
It seems that the over moderation of this thread has killed it dead. Nice one Censors. Another success for your oh so tiresome PCness.

Can't speak for the other members, but I pretty much stopped reading this thread when it descended from sensible discussion of the contest to poisonous, snide comments. I wouldn't be surprised if that's why it's gone quiet. Nothing to do with moderation.

Incidentally, while I'm here, well done to Northop for your 5th place. Good result for the first year back at the top and something positive to build on for next year.:clap: Sorry that isn't a controversial statement but hey, some of us have a life.

hellraiser
17.03.2008, 12:27
... must admit that I found the interpretation of Eric Ball's Festival Music by Mr Pritchard so far away from what is written on the copies that ity made me squirm. Several other more knowledgable persons around me made very similar comments. The notes played by Ton were (as usual) very good and desrving of a higher placing. However at the areas IMHO it was too great a gamble for the MD to give such a different interpretation of the piece

I enjoyed the Tongwynlais interpretation + performance very much, and think it shame if they go down a section after this.

Remember that when you've been playing the testpiece with a band for a solid month before the contest, then perhaps what we all tend to do is compare interpretations with our own bands'. The adjudicator may have a different idea of how he thinks it should be.

JonP
19.03.2008, 21:33
Jon, we had discussions yesterday about this and you were asked to simply drop it. Why can't you just leave things...? Please keep this thread on topic, making posts like this just doesn't help.... us or you!

LOL. You make me laugh John. Honestly. ;-)

I wanted to say a big fat wel done to Blaenavon. They have had an awsome couple of results and have really raised thier game. Have great one in Harrogate. Thought thier sop was supurb. Nice one.

JonP
20.03.2008, 00:20
Can't speak for the other members, but I pretty much stopped reading this thread when it descended from sensible discussion of the contest to poisonous, snide comments. I wouldn't be surprised if that's why it's gone quiet. Nothing to do with moderation.

I dont want to discuss any issues that were previously discussed in this thread. Please understand i dont want to revisit anything we have been asked not to discuss. And id also like to mention that i was not involved in the last comments but hey Draconius(Andy Baker), i think if you read the thread you will find real people discussing a real issue in thier own real terms. There is nothing wrong with straight talking,or harsh comments if they are justified. Get down off your high horse, and with all due respect who are you to judge any of us.

Rant over.

I was wanting to ask why the associations are so strict about entries for the contests when they are (i think) wanting as many bands as possible to enter the contests. As an example, i know a band that i used ot be involved with were late with thier entry to the Area contest, which i assume would have included an entry fee. When they realised thier mistake and tried to address it, instead of being allowed into the cometition they were denied access and were not allowed to compete in the 4th section. This seems a little less than in the spirit of the event, and a little harsh. I know that someting similar happened to BTM some years ago, (not sure if it was the area).

Why is this the case?? The only reason i can think of is that the association (who i hold in contempt anyway on thier inability to make any decisions on a committee or managerial level, in any circumatances) have a deadline for printing the programmes for the event. Maybe there is some more pressing issue that im unaware of???

Anno Draconis
20.03.2008, 08:12
I dont want to discuss any issues that were previously discussed in this thread. Please understand i dont want to revisit anything we have been asked not to discuss. And id also like to mention that i was not involved in the last comments but hey Draconius(Andy Baker), i think if you read the thread you will find real people discussing a real issue in thier own real terms. There is nothing wrong with straight talking,or harsh comments if they are justified. Get down off your high horse, and with all due respect who are you to judge any of us.

Rant over.


Aah, so it's OK to for posters to express an opinion as long as you agree with it? I'm sure it did involve "real" people (unless you've got 10 user accounts and were having an argument with yourself :biggrin: ) but that didn't make it any more of an interesting read for those of us not directly involved. You asked why the thread's gone quiet, I gave an opinion. Thought you were all in favour of that?

I can't imagine that the deadline thing is anything to do with programme printing; this can be done the week before, as is done with football programmes. Especially as most contest programmes are straightforward booklets with only black print on the inside. Easy peasy; I do this for a living and I know I could get the area contest programmes and tickets printed on the Thursday before and delivered to the venue by Friday teatime. I suspect it's got more to do with the actual logistics of the contest - things like timings, whether or not they need a split draw, etc. Plus if they set an entry deadline and don't stick to it, some bands would hold off entering (and therefore paying the unrefundable entry fee) until they know that they will have a full band of registered players for the contest, and then enter at the last minute.

JonP
20.03.2008, 10:15
[QUOTE=Anno Draconis;589961]Aah, so it's OK to for posters to express an opinion as long as you agree with it? I'm sure it did involve "real" people (unless you've got 10 user accounts and were having an argument with yourself :biggrin: ) but that didn't make it any more of an interesting read for those of us not directly involved. You asked why the thread's gone quiet, I gave an opinion. Thought you were all in favour of that?

QUOTE]

Thats it, youve got me. Your so clever!

So in other words there is no actual reason we can think of a sto wehy a late ebtry system cant be put in place. Ive never known them use a split draw at the area. (you mean like at the masters right?? morning afternoon, that sort of thing?)

Anno Draconis
20.03.2008, 10:53
Thats it, youve got me. Your so clever!
Glad I'm finally getting the recognition I deserve ;)

So in other words there is no actual reason we can think of a sto wehy a late ebtry system cant be put in place. Ive never known them use a split draw at the area. (you mean like at the masters right?? morning afternoon, that sort of thing?)
Yes; it happens in the NW (and LSC I think?) where there are in excess of 20 bands in the 3rd and 4th section. They let the bands know about 4 weeks in advance which half of the draw they are in so they can book coaches, rehearsal venues or hotels if neccesary. Obviously in that case a band entering late would cock this system up. I know this doesn't really apply in Wales because the sections are generally smaller, but I suppose allowing later entries for different areas would be perceived as unfair by some.

Anno Draconis
20.03.2008, 10:57
Incidentally, how late was the band in question's entry? If they were only 48 hours late it certainly seems harsh, but if their entry went in 10 days after the deadline I'd be inclined to agree that they shouldn't be allowed in.

The registration of players argument still stands; I'm sure there would have been two or three extra bands at my area if they could have left it until the week before to enter, giving them more time to arm-twist players into signing. There has to be a cut-off point somewhere.....

marc71178
20.03.2008, 15:53
There has to be a cut off point, which is known by all bands.

If you miss it, you miss out - it's not as if it's a contest which bands are unaware of until near the date.

007ish
20.03.2008, 16:28
There has to be a cut off point, which is known by all bands.

If you miss it, you miss out - it's not as if it's a contest which bands are unaware of until near the date.


Agreed… but would it not have been courteous, especially in light of the present plight of Brass Banding, for the regional secretary to have given a call to the band sec. and confirmed that the situation was intentional, particularly for the Area’s? :-?

JonP
20.03.2008, 23:17
Agreed… but would it not have been courteous, especially in light of the present plight of Brass Banding, for the regional secretary to have given a call to the band sec. and confirmed that the situation was intentional, particularly for the Area’s? :-?
Absolutely.

marc71178
21.03.2008, 14:50
Agreed… but would it not have been courteous, especially in light of the present plight of Brass Banding, for the regional secretary to have given a call to the band sec. and confirmed that the situation was intentional, particularly for the Area’s? :-?

I don't see why.

Bearing in mind the number of tasks the secretary has at such a time, I don't see why they should chase up people who haven't entered, people have to take responsibility for their own situations, not try and lay the blame at someone else's door.

JonP
21.03.2008, 18:53
I don't see why.

Bearing in mind the number of tasks the secretary has at such a time, I don't see why they should chase up people who haven't entered, people have to take responsibility for their own situations, not try and lay the blame at someone else's door.

Shouldnt we be trying to put systems in place to ensure the maximum entries to contests though. I know it creates work but in the end, if no one entered in time someone would have to start making phonecalls, so why not set it up that way from the beginning?

The Wherryman
21.03.2008, 19:18
Shouldnt we be trying to put systems in place to ensure the maximum entries to contests though. I know it creates work but in the end, if no one entered in time someone would have to start making phonecalls, so why not set it up that way from the beginning?

Each band's contest secretary only has his/her own band to worry about. The regional secretary has enough on his/her plate without having to chase up tardy entries.

Perhaps we need a new thread "When should the Contest Secretary leave?" :-?

TheMusicMan
21.03.2008, 20:21
The reason there is a rule regarding entry close date is I guess due to the amount of preparatory work required prior to arranging the event, it's not down to association secretaries to chase bands of they haven't entered - that ball rests firmly and squarely with band secretaries. I would imagine that information on the closing dates for the major competitions is readily available.

Don't challenge the secretary, but certainly challenge the rule as to why there is whatever time between closing date and contest date.

Scenario: band wants to enter contest they have never entered before, band secretary contacts contest secretary who advises the band sec that the closing date has passed, band secretary says how ridiculous this is and that the contest secretary should have informed band secretary about closing date... :)

Get it...!

JonP
21.03.2008, 21:57
Each band's contest secretary only has his/her own band to worry about. The regional secretary has enough on his/her plate without having to chase up tardy entries.

Perhaps we need a new thread "When should the Contest Secretary leave?" :-?


Ok Ok, lets stay on topic here shall we. Im just suggestinjg that the whole problem could be avoided completely if there was a reminder system. How hard can it be?

TheMusicMan
21.03.2008, 22:19
Ok Ok, lets stay on topic here shall we. Im just suggestinjg that the whole problem could be avoided completely if there was a reminder system. How hard can it be?Fine for competitions where the band has entered previously Jon, but only for these competitions.

The problem could also be avoided if the band secretary did their job correctly.

JonP
21.03.2008, 23:52
Fine for competitions where the band has entered previously Jon, but only for these competitions.

The problem could also be avoided if the band secretary did their job correctly.


Yep absolutely, For the area though, everyband must have entered before unless they have been newly graded by the association so wouldnt the association know the name of every band eligable?

2nd man down
22.03.2008, 08:14
Yep absolutely, For the area though, everyband must have entered before unless they have been newly graded by the association so wouldnt the association know the name of every band eligable?


Not neccessarily, up until i joined emley the band hadn't competed in the area's for a long number of years, however they had been eligible to do so all that time. Should they have been contacted year after inactive year on the off chance that one year they would compete again? I'm sure this goes for quite a high number of bands.

If a band intends to enter a contest, the bands contest sec should sort it, that includes finding out and making sure the entry is in in time. Miss it, you wait till next year.

JonP
22.03.2008, 10:56
Not neccessarily, up until i joined emley the band hadn't competed in the area's for a long number of years, however they had been eligible to do so all that time. Should they have been contacted year after inactive year on the off chance that one year they would compete again? .

I would say yes. Why not?

TheMusicMan
22.03.2008, 11:15
I do actually agree with you Jon, but only up to a point. It is certainly in everyones interests to get as many bands competing in the regionals as possible, and yes it would be good if there were a system where all bands registered in a region are contacted either by mail, email or telephone well prior to the closing date. But really, this is something that falls under the remit of the band secretary to undertake, not the regional secretaries.

Better I think to challenge the rule that defines why there is a closing date.

2nd man down
22.03.2008, 11:20
just a quick cursory glance at IBEW shows 88 bands currently in existance and eligible to play in the yorkshire area alone. In 2008 only 57 competed. This doesn't account for newly formed/merged outfits that may spring up before next year

Thats 31 letters to send to bands who probably won't be there, and 88 plus bands to keep track of to make sure they've all registered, replied, gone under, not likely to compete etc.

Wouldn't it be easier just to let the bands take care of themselves rather than kiddy state looking after them?

JonP
22.03.2008, 19:03
.

Wouldn't it be easier just to let the bands take care of themselves rather than kiddy state looking after them?

Yea i suppose your right, but on one hand we are all complaining and moaning because not enough bands enter, we cant fill decent venues for contests and on the other hand we dont want to help each other in anyway at all.

Surely we either all look after each other to try and ensure that everyone enters or at least has every opportunity to do so, even if that means a reminder system, or as John has suggested why do we need closing dates at all fo the area?

Why not Just list all bands eligable in the programme and at the draw you will find who is entered. Put that up on a list at the front of the hall after the draw. Why Not? In fact, thats a much better idea than all the fussing with enry forms at all. Good idea Music Man.

andywooler
22.03.2008, 19:29
Why not Just list all bands eligable in the programme and at the draw you will find who is entered. Put that up on a list at the front of the hall after the draw. Why Not? In fact, thats a much better idea than all the fussing with enry forms at all. Good idea Music Man.
That's not at all what John said - he said question the need for a closing date which doesn't mean that there isn't reason for having one.
Put yourself in the shoes of the organisers trying to a) work out timings for the day, b) deciding whether or not a pre draw is needed, c ) understanding the finances you have available (based on known entry fees) .
Try running a contest yourself or getting involved with your local association/regional committee and see how these things are actually run.
(for the record, I have done both). It also looks a lot easier in your part of the world where there are less bands. (L&SC had 79 who turned up on the day compared to 43 in Wales).
Out of curiosity, did the band you conduct forget to enter or choose not to enter?

andywooler
22.03.2008, 19:34
I
Better I think to challenge the rule that defines why there is a closing date.John, I don't often disagree with you but... tell me of any contest you can enter which does NOT have a closing date - I suspect you will be hard pushed to find one.

JonP
23.03.2008, 17:24
Out of curiosity, did the band you conduct forget to enter or choose not to enter?

I was not conducting the band, i said, if you would be kind enough to read before you post, and stop ass u me ing, that it was a band i used to be involved with.

The aggressive attitude is not deserved here, as i think the aggressive attitude that bands receive when thier entries are late also dont deserve.

It may be diffucult to organise these things, but if it is so, why dont the guys who do oraganise them change things to make it eassier. Perhaps in your area you would prefer to have less bands enter. Would make your job easier after all.

TheMusicMan
23.03.2008, 18:37
John, I don't often disagree with you but... tell me of any contest you can enter which does NOT have a closing date - I suspect you will be hard pushed to find one.Hi Andy

You're right, there isn't one, but I don't understand your question sorry. In the previous post you (and I thank you for it) correct Jon as to what I meant - and you were right in your understanding opf what I meant, and to correct John for 'putting words in my mouth'... forum-wise I mean!

I am not suggesting that we don't or shouldn't have a closing date to a contest, just suggesting challenging the rule that defines when this date is. A month before... why? Two months before... why? Whatever date before... why...?

If contest sec's need a month then that's fine... but why a month?

That's all Andy... :)

andywooler
23.03.2008, 19:19
If contest sec's need a month then that's fine... but why a month?

That's all Andy... :)why not a month?

TheMusicMan
23.03.2008, 19:29
aha.... but I'm the one challenging ;)

andywooler
23.03.2008, 19:30
I was not conducting the band, i said, if you would be kind enough to read before you post, and stop ass u me ing, that it was a band i used to be involved with. I did read your earlier post - if you are NOT involved with a particular band as a conductor then perhaps you would like to update your website.

andywooler
23.03.2008, 19:33
aha.... but I'm the one challenging ;)Ok, challenge away and tell us all why a month is an inappropriate amount of time!

TheMusicMan
23.03.2008, 20:32
Well, I was only suggesting that the rule be challenged, I wasn't in fact, challenging it myself. However, as you ask... what takes a month to organise that couldn't be organised in that time if another band wanted to enter after the close date?

Nothing that I can think of other than if there were a fixed number of bands allowed

The Wherryman
23.03.2008, 20:35
Well, I was only suggesting that the rule be challenged, I wasn't in fact, challenging it myself. However, as you ask... what takes a month to organise that couldn't be organised in that time if another band wanted to enter after the close date?

Nothing that I can think of other than if there were a fixed number of bands allowed

And if all the bands wanted to enter after the close date...what then?

TheMusicMan
23.03.2008, 20:48
Well you obviously need to have some idea of the number of bands competing to know if there's a contest or not...:)

Again, I am not saying there shouldn't be a close date, just challenging the rule as to when this should be. Also, why can bands not be permitted to enter in certain circumstances after the close date.

The Wherryman
23.03.2008, 20:53
Well you obviously need to have some idea of the number of bands competing to know if there's a contest or not...:)

Ergo, there needs to be a close date. Q.E.D

andywooler
23.03.2008, 21:11
ok, so we dispense with the closing date:

- we have no idea if we need to pre draw
- we have little chance of knowing what time the contest will finish - of course, unless you are a coach driver, you might not care
- we cannot print a programme because we don't know if anyone is actually coming
- the registry work right up until the day providing the lists of eligible players and have to be on call on the day because band x decided to turn up. Colin J will love that one.

If you don't know 4 weeks prior to the regionals that you are going to be there then maybe you need to look at yourselves rather than the contest organisers. Oh look, there's a qualifier next weekend in Yorkshire - shall we go chaps?

JonP
24.03.2008, 18:46
I did read your earlier post - if you are NOT involved with a particular band as a conductor then perhaps you would like to update your website.


Noting to do with me dear boy. those in control of that were in control months ago. And obviously its not my website. Is it.