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Di
20.02.2007, 17:35
THE NORTH WEST REGIONAL CHAMPIONSHIPS
Sunday 11th March 2007
Winter Gardens, Blackpool


Details courtesy www.4barsrest.com


Section : Championship
Date : Sunday 11th March
Test Piece : Isaiah 40 (Robert Redhead)
Venue : Empress Ballroom
Adjudicator : James Scott
Draw : 1:30pm
Play Commences: At conclusion of 1st section (approx 2:30)




Participating Bands:

BT, M. Fowles
Bactiguard Wire Brass, P. Andrews
Blackburn & Darwen, N. Sheppard
Dobcross Silver (TBA)
Fairey, Major P. Parkes
Foden’s Richardson, G. Cutt
Freckleton, P. Dalton
Leyland, R. Gray
Pemberton Old Wigan JJB, M. Peacock
United Co-op Milnrow, A. White
Vernon Building Society Poynton, A. Lawton MBE
Wingates, A. Berryman


Section : First
Date: Sunday 11th March
Test Piece : Sinfonietta for Brass Band, ‘The Wayfarer’ (Eric Ball)
Venue : Empress Ballroom
Adjudicator : Roy Roe
Draw Time: 9:30
Play commences : 10:30





Participating Bands:


Ashton-under-Lyne, P. Chalk
Besses o’ th’ Barn, J. Hinckley
Diggle, M. Beevers
Haslingden & Helmshore, D. Holland
Hoover (Bolton), R. Cargill
Longridge, P. Lockett
Maxilead Metals Tyldesley, R. Taylor
Mossley, D. Byers
Poulton-le-Fylde, S. Tarry
Roberts Bakery, C. Cranson
Silk Brass Astra Zeneca Macclesfield, J. Cant
Timperley, D. Evans
United Co-op (Crewe), J. Sparkes


Section : Second
Date : Sunday 11th March
Test Piece : Carnival (Helen Perkin)
Venue : Pavilion Theatre
Adjudicator : Colin Hardy
Draw : 2:30
Play commences : At conclusion of 3rd section (approx 3:30)


Participating Bands:


Blackpool Brass, A. Warriner
Boarshurst Silver, D. Morris
Bollington Brass, P. Christian
Delph, P. Goodwin
Greenall’s, J. Ludden
Manx Concert Brass, I. Clague MBE
Old Hall Brass, T. Halliwell
Rainford, N. Samuel
Stalybridge Old, R. Collinson
Trinity Girls, S. Barton
United Co-operatives 2000 Brass, J. Meredith
Wardle & District Anderson Brass, S. Conway


Section: Third
Date : Sunday 11th March
Test Piece : Prelude & Jubilate (Darrol Barry)
Venue : Pavilion Theatre
Adjudicator : Ian Brownbill
Draw Time : 9am & 11. 15
Play commences : 10.00




Participating Bands:

BMP Europe Goodshaw, D. Ashworth
City of Chester, P. Mottershead
Dobcross Youth 2003, T. Griffiths
Douglas Town, G. Higginbottom
Eagley, G. Westwood
Eccleston Brass, I. Bateson
Flixton, K. Gibbs
Friezland, L. Tingay
Hawk Green (Marple), P Pavey
Hazel Grove, N. Bowden
Middleton, C. Whiteoak
Morecambe, C. Larder
Oldham (Lees), J. Collins
Pemberton Old Wigan JJB ‘B’, P. Ashley
Pilling Jubilee Silver, B. Porter
Rivington & Adlington, D. Mort
Skelmersdale Prize, A. Booth
Valley Brass (Haydock), D. Chadwick
Whitworth Vale & Healey, J. Binns


Section : Fourth
Date : Sunday 11th March
Test Piece : The Seasons, Suite for Brass Band (Philip Wilby)
Venue : Spanish Hall
Adjudicator : John Maines
Draw Time : 10 & 12:45
Play commences : 11:00


Particiapting Bands :


Barnton Silver, S. Yates
Besses Boys, J. Holt
Blackley, A. Smith
Brindle, K. Richmond
Carrbrook Brass, L. Dunkley
Coppull & Standish, H. Bentham
Eaton Farnworth & Walkden, P. Ashley
Eccles Borough, L. Webb
Formby, L. Hough
Golborne, E. Hill
Greenfield, D. Chapman
Hesketh Bank Silver, G. Clough
Littleborough Public, M. Bailey
Lostock Hall Memorial, I. McKnight
Nelson Brass, J. Roberts
Parr (Richardson Ltd.), J. Smith
Ramsey Town, R. Quane
Rode Hall Silver, S. Thompson
Tarleton & District Brass, G. Bould
Uppermill, A. Widdop

madandcrazytromboneguy
25.02.2007, 02:39
Im amazed theres no reply on this 1 yet

got a few friends in this section, from the college course and some players who have made the trip over the pennines from yorkshire to lancashire

I'll try and get over there this year as it is still a very strong region (still playing 2nd fiddle to yorkshire i.m.o. ;) )

best of luck to all those bands competing especially the bands ive either had a play with or who Ive got mates in

see you there! :D

TheMusicMan
25.02.2007, 14:09
Just so you all know - the tMP Predictogizmatron is up and running. Get your votes in!!!

Here's the announcement : http://www.themouthpiece.com/vb/showthread.php?t=26781

See link at top of page

nadband
25.02.2007, 16:45
Looking forward to the contest only two weeks left though,pretty scary thought. Should be good fun though, good luck everyone see you there!

Andy_Euph
26.02.2007, 15:37
I'll try and get over there this year as it is still a very strong region (still playing 2nd fiddle to yorkshire i.m.o. ;) )


I'll have to disagree with you on that, in my eyes the north west is far stronger than yorkshire in every section execpt the top section. Having only been down here a couple of years I've been amazed at how strong the sections are in the north west, i've heard a number of 3rd section bands over the last couple of years who wouldn't be out of place in the 1st/2nd section elsewhere in the country. Band for band I think the north west leads the way :tup

Should be a good contest, i'm looking forward to it just hoping that a) it doesn't snow again, b) the beer is a little better than years past and c) i don't miss a pano top b flat :clap:

Anno Draconis
26.02.2007, 17:38
I'll have to disagree with you on that, in my eyes the north west is far stronger than yorkshire in every section execpt the top section. Having only been down here a couple of years I've been amazed at how strong the sections are in the north west, i've heard a number of 3rd section bands over the last couple of years who wouldn't be out of place in the 1st/2nd section elsewhere in the country. Band for band I think the north west leads the way :tup

Should be a good contest, i'm looking forward to it just hoping that a) it doesn't snow again, b) the beer is a little better than years past and c) i don't miss a pano top b flat :clap:

From 1st section down, I'm pretty confident the NW has more strength in depth than any other region.

My first Blackpool area was in 1988 and the beer hasn't improved since, so don't hold yer breath.

Lauradoll
27.02.2007, 19:50
COME ON BT!!!! And also Wire Brass.

leisa
27.02.2007, 21:30
go flixton!! :-D

lottie4744
28.02.2007, 10:17
Anyone heard Pemberton lately? Playing really well, possible spanner in works?

davidquinlan
28.02.2007, 10:36
Go Manx!!

cookie101880
28.02.2007, 15:58
Having looked at the predictions for this area I see Dobcross Silver has some nominations in the championship section.As far as I new they weren't competing? Can anyone shed any light on the subject???

cookie101880
28.02.2007, 16:17
Come On Oldham!!!!!!

horn1
28.02.2007, 17:26
Having looked at the predictions for this area I see Dobcross Silver has some nominations in the championship section.As far as I new they weren't competing? Can anyone shed any light on the subject???


They're not competing as far as I know.

Stix
01.03.2007, 13:43
VBS Poynton will be in the Championship section having been promoted this year!! all the best to bands competing and come on poynton!!!

tpcornet12
01.03.2007, 16:10
VBS Poynton will be in the Championship section having been promoted this year!! all the best to bands competing and come on poynton!!!

I too will be lending my support to Vernon! Good luck guys!:tup

Stix
01.03.2007, 16:46
Thanks Tim! All the best to you as well. Dont think ive seen you since being locked out of ure chalet at pontins with Andy at about 5 in the morning!! ;) Hope your ok, Alex x

tpcornet12
01.03.2007, 17:07
Thanks Tim! All the best to you as well. Dont think ive seen you since being locked out of ure chalet at pontins with Andy at about 5 in the morning!! ;) Hope your ok, Alex x

Cheers Alex. I've seen some of your crew as I've been playing with the Bierkeller band a bit lately!!
See you in Blackpool. x

LeDragon
02.03.2007, 17:31
All the best to BT in the Championship Section.

horn-girlie
03.03.2007, 15:01
my 1st areas out of the north west, but all the best to all bands, particularly Bollington :)

tpcornet12
04.03.2007, 10:39
my 1st areas out of the north west, but all the best to all bands, particularly Bollington :)

Thanks Lizzie

It's a shame you won't be with us. Are you coming for a listen? I'll be playing 3rd cornet you know! Should be fun - I've not played back row for 15 years - It makes my face go numb playing ff below the stave!!! :D

horn-girlie
04.03.2007, 11:14
Thanks Lizzie

It's a shame you won't be with us. Are you coming for a listen? I'll be playing 3rd cornet you know! Should be fun - I've not played back row for 15 years - It makes my face go numb playing ff below the stave!!! :D

3rd cornet?!? really?! are your areas on saturday? if so then I can't come because its the same day as the midlands areas, but good luck for it anyway!

tpcornet12
04.03.2007, 12:37
3rd cornet?!? really?! are your areas on saturday? if so then I can't come because its the same day as the midlands areas, but good luck for it anyway!
We play on Sunday. (at least I think we do!)
Good luck back. Me, Martin and Bezzer are off to the Yorkshires later to see the top section, can't wait!! :D

cookie101880
05.03.2007, 08:26
We're playing in the Pavillion Theatre this year, in all the years going i've never played there.Anyone got any idea of what the accoustic is like?

AndyCat
05.03.2007, 10:17
We're playing in the Pavillion Theatre this year, in all the years going i've never played there.Anyone got any idea of what the accoustic is like?

Hard Work! It's quite a funny acoustic, and depends what else the hall is set up for. We play there in the Senior Cup, and some bands get penalised for "overblowing", but it doesn't sound that way on stage.
I've also done a lot of Summer work in there with various other bands, and the acoustic is very dependant on what's in the hall!

Hell's_Trombone
05.03.2007, 13:54
Having looked at the predictions for this area I see Dobcross Silver has some nominations in the championship section.As far as I new they weren't competing? Can anyone shed any light on the subject???

Nope we aint going, but I think most of us are playing for other bands there. Infact, I'm up against ya!!! hahaha! I'd say we're gonna beat ya but I have only been to half an hour of the rehearsal last night so I can quite honestly say I wasn't listening and have no idea what they actually sound like!!!

cookie101880
05.03.2007, 14:11
You might beat us hun but it'll have to be damn good to do that haha. Who you playing for anyway?

Hell's_Trombone
05.03.2007, 14:15
lol well tell you what if we beat you I'll get you a pint, if you beat us you get me a pint!! (*hopes you don't notice how obvious it is that it'll be you buying!!*)

Playing for Hazel Grove on bass trom! Only got asked to play on friday! Organised or what?! Been rather hectic trying to register today!! :rolleyes:

cookie101880
05.03.2007, 14:27
What!! At the winter gardens prices, That''ll cost me a fortune!!! Expensive C**P beer!

madandcrazytromboneguy
07.03.2007, 02:52
ive noticed that 4br feel oldham will do a dodworth and win the 3rd section over here at the 1st time of asking, probably true if your progressions as solid as dod's has obviously been.

im predicting big things for the 2 bands i helped out last year lostock hall and eccles, dont let me down guys, both of you should have a great chance of qualifiying for the final this year, would also be nice to see L.P.B. do well this year, go for it Matt, get the best out of your troops and im sure you'll do well.

looked at previous records and results and fodens and faireys are 1s to be really jealous about lol, think leylands were pretty fine aswell, after that though it gets a little bit inconsistant, would imagine wingates will be the nearest contenders, although the yorkshire big 4 got split this weekend, maybe the N.W. big 4 will be split aswell, who knows!

blackpool brass who helped us guys on the course should be on course for another fine result, good luck guys im sure you'll do well, think old hall will be up there too, give em hell on that stage peter, get the best soloist prize while your at it aswell if it goes to the cornets this year!

shame dobcross arent going this year, good look on bass trom kate, love great sounding female bass trombone players, adds that bit of spice to the performance ;):D

think i'll leave it there for now, i'm hoping to be there guys to see you all so good luck, play hard, and drink harder :P

tat
07.03.2007, 10:28
Are 4Barsrest on drugs?? They have a 3rd section band as dark horses in the 4th section and a 2nd section band as the dark horses in the 3rd section? Not saying anything about thier predictions!! Come on Whitworth!!!!

budstellabecks
07.03.2007, 10:37
Are 4Barsrest on drugs?? They have a 3rd section band as dark horses in the 4th section and a 2nd section band as the dark horses in the 3rd section? Not saying anything about thier predictions!! Come on Whitworth!!!!

Some strange predictions in there indeed.

cookie101880
07.03.2007, 10:44
I think somethings gone wrong as they predict Dobcross youth to come 4th in the 4th section yet they preview them as playing in the 3rd section.They also preview Wardle as playing in the 2nd section yet have them as dark horses in the 3rd!!! Strange!

horn1
07.03.2007, 11:00
The 4barsrest links were wrong yesterday, so some stuff went to yorshire and some the wrong section. Looks OK now though!

notsosilentbob
07.03.2007, 13:53
They've also done a write up for Dobcross who arent going (as we have established on here).

With regards to the 3rd predictions, its nice of them to tip us to do so well but we are well aware in the bandroom that its a huge ask to go up and win the area at the first attempt (congrats to Dodworth on that by the way). We arent counting any chickens by any stretch and just hope to play the best we can on the day same as everyone, the rest is up to the random results machine :biggrin:.

Good luck to all competitors on the day and lets hope for less snow! :wink:

tat
07.03.2007, 15:00
Am sure you'll do very well, by all accounts your band is on top form at the moment and should produce a performance to earn a return trip to Harrogate. Good Luck

PurpleHaze
07.03.2007, 19:33
Wow, only just remembered my username! Can't wait for the regionals this year!!!!! I'm hoping we'll do ALOT better than last year but i'm not expecting miracles.

les
07.03.2007, 22:08
Here's wishing everyone at the North West Area good luck.

Thanks for the vote of confidence by the way Clive.

Obviously 4Barsrest don't share your confidence in us. Coming low down the field at Preston might have something to do with the fact we were playing up a section attempting a very challenging piece, and are yet to compete in the 4th section since we have been on the contest scene again.

We felt this was a calculated risk to take after our winning the 3rd section at Wilkinsons!

We are all looking forward to the week-end.

At least we haven't been given the kiss of death!

Good to see you are playing regulary on top bone in the yorkshire first section. Hope you will find another 2 trom players to join you!

Les
MD Eccles Borough Band

tpcornet12
07.03.2007, 23:22
I'm really quite glad 4BR haven't predicted us to qualify (they never do by the way) as I see it as bad luck if they do but I am a little confused why! Since 2003 in 2nd section we have a 1st and a 2nd in areas and two 2nds in finals!!!:( Why would we get 3rd this year?

HBB
08.03.2007, 03:22
Here's wishing everyone at the North West Area good luck.

Thanks for the vote of confidence by the way Clive.

Obviously 4Barsrest don't share your confidence in us. Coming low down the field at Preston might have something to do with the fact we were playing up a section attempting a very challenging piece, and are yet to compete in the 4th section since we have been on the contest scene again.

We felt this was a calculated risk to take after our winning the 3rd section at Wilkinsons!

We are all looking forward to the week-end.

At least we haven't been given the kiss of death!

Good to see you are playing regulary on top bone in the yorkshire first section. Hope you will find another 2 trom players to join you!

Les
MD Eccles Borough Band
Good Luck to all at Eccles (Go Sarah!!)!

madandcrazytromboneguy
08.03.2007, 05:26
LOL, 3rd section mate, not 1st, my lip wouldn't quite be up to top trom on that just yet, but i'll get there, the music we are playing in rehearsals certainly has less bars rest that most pieces ive played before so its looking good! looking forward to it now, good luck with timperley aswell, should be a busy but enjoyable day for you Les!

Hells Bones
08.03.2007, 10:58
I hear that the 4br predictions are usually unreliable, We are predicted 2nd in the second section (and we would like almost nothing better) but we are'nt using that as a definite, we know we need to play very well to get anywhere near that spot. Any one having fun with Carnival?

HB

Richard_Brigg
08.03.2007, 15:46
are Haydock not competing?

tat
08.03.2007, 16:36
Been told Dobcross Youth have withdrawn??

notsosilentbob
08.03.2007, 18:38
Am sure you'll do very well, by all accounts your band is on top form at the moment and should produce a performance to earn a return trip to Harrogate. Good Luck

Thanks, you too :)

bandcampgal
08.03.2007, 19:33
and lets hope for less snow! :wink:
i heard from somewhere that snow is predicted for this weekend - i hope not cos i nearly went flat on my backside getting off the coach last year! hope its sunny so i can get team horn 2 go paddling in the sea!!

4br have us as dark horses - kiss of death mwhahaha! heres hoping for an early draw so that members of our b band won't rub it in our faces that we can't av a drink till after wev played!! and hopefully the queues at the bar will go down slightly faster than at yorkshire wher i spent a good half an hour with a group from sellers waitin 2 b served :mad:

andyp
08.03.2007, 22:23
i heard from somewhere that snow is predicted for this weekend

Sure that isn't another 4br dodgy prediction?

From Accuweather.com, Blackpool, Sunday day...
Windy with sunny periods. Winds from the SSW at 43 km/h.
Realfeel®: 5 °C

Andy Cooper
08.03.2007, 23:01
We are quite happy 4BR have not tipped us - they had us as dark horses at Pontins and that was the kiss of death!!!

good luck to all.

postie
09.03.2007, 00:02
Good luck to Rachel and Flixton go for it and make my prediction come true.

jamieow
09.03.2007, 08:56
all the best to Wire Brass and to Nick and Gav in the engine room!!

Andy_Euph
09.03.2007, 17:53
Heavy rain for sunday according to the BBC...i must say i'm shocked! :biggrin:

Good luck to everyone this weekend

Nuke
09.03.2007, 18:11
Good luck to all the bands playing this weekend.

Used to play with the Haydock band but they don't seem to be competing this year at all. Hopefully they will be back as they were a great band to play for.

To the gentleman who predicted snow, it snowed last year so anything is possible.

Carina Halliwell
10.03.2007, 11:19
well after travelling over to Yorkshire last wkend I came away feeling disappointed with the standard of the top section - I don't think any of the bands actually played the damn piece. and before everyone starts having a go, I'm not saying the bands where c**p just that there was a lot of slips and not enough music in it all - basically I think they all underestimated it. anyway to get to my point, if the top top bands at Yorkshire have undersestimated the music then theres a damn good chance the top top bands at the north west will make the same mistake, and if so there is hope for all us lesser mortals in the championship section. I definately have a feeling that the results will suprise a few people :rolleyes:

Just wanna say, Good Luck to Jo, Sanders, Simon, Chappers, Amy, Ace (at 196), Jenny (at beginning), Rhiannon (on that C and at 118, Nic after 100, Team Horn at 130 and last but by know means least Dave "smelly a**e" Marsh at the very beginning!! Oh and good luck to Mark (TBA) Peacock (keep that beat goin!). I hope I got everybody there!!!!

as regards to the snow on sunday - i think we may get away with that one altho ANYTHING can happen!!!

anyway good luck to all the bands competeing - especially Pemberton Old Wigan JJB "B" Band (Go Mum!!!!), and Golborne (sock it to em Martin!!!)

George Fairhurst
10.03.2007, 15:56
""I hope I got everybody there!!!!""

NO YOU DIDN'T, YOU MISSED STEVE AND ME ?????????

sparkling_quavers
10.03.2007, 17:23
Very best of luck to Wire Brass, from hearing the band recently I am sure their performance will be of real quality. the top section should be really good to listen to - what a great piece. I am really looking forward to tommorrow now and hope to catch up with lots of people :biggrin:

BIG Paul
10.03.2007, 18:55
Best of luck to all fourth section bands tomorrow especially Carrbrook

flashbarry
11.03.2007, 05:56
Good luck to everyone today in Blackpool, we still miss coming to this contest after all these years.

Have a few beers for us.

Cheers,
Darrol & Rach

andyp
11.03.2007, 08:15
Forecast for Blackpool now says rain all afternoon! :(

Still, at least no snow. Good luck everyone!

Hells Bones
11.03.2007, 10:11
Good Luck to Mossley, Uppermill and to Delph, hope we all do well!!!

MRSH
11.03.2007, 10:21
Section 3 on its way (Split Draw)

Section 3

Pavilion Theatre
Adjudicator: Ian Brownbill
Draw: 9.00am & 11.15am
Commences: 10.00am

Bands

BMP Europe Goodshaw, D. Ashworth, 2
City of Chester, P. Mottershead, 4
Dobcross Youth 2003, T. Griffiths, 7
Douglas Town, G. Higginbottom, 10
Eagley, G. Westwood, 3
Eccleston Brass, I. Bateson
Flixton, K. Gibbs
Friezland, L. Tingay, 5
Hawk Green (Marple), P. Pavey, 8
Hazel Grove, N. Bowden
Middleton, C. Whiteoak, 6
Morecambe, C. Larder, 1
Oldham (Lees), J. Collins, 9
Pemberton Old Wigan JJB ‘B’, P. Ashley
Pilling Jubilee Silver, B. Porter
Rivington & Adlington, D. Mort
Skelmersdale Prize, A. Booth
Valley Brass (Haydock), D. Chadwick
Whitworth Vale & Healey, J. Binns

3 bands qualify.

Courtesy of 4barsrest (http://www.4barsrest.com/news/detail.asp?id=5227)

MRSH
11.03.2007, 10:26
Section 4 on its way (Split Draw)

Section 4

Spanish Hall
Adjudicator: John Maines
Draw: 10.00am & 12.45pm
Commences: 11.00am

Bands

Barnton Silver, S. Yates, 5
Besses Boys, J. Holt, 4
Blackley, A. Smith
Brindle, K. Richmond, 8
Carrbrook Brass, L. Dunkley, 7
Coppull & Standish, H. Bentham
Eaton Farnworth & Walkden, P. Ashley
Eccles Borough, L. Webb
Formby, L. Hough, 1
Golborne, E. Hill, 3
Greenfield, D. Chapman, 9
Hesketh Bank Silver, G. Clough, w
Littleborough Public, M. Bailey
Lostock Hall Memorial, I. McKnight, 6
Nelson Brass, J. Roberts
Parr (Richardson Ltd.), J. Smith, 2
Ramsey Town, R. Quane, 10
Rode Hall Silver, S. Thompson
Tarleton & District Brass, G. Bould
Uppermill, A. Widdop

3 bands qualify.

Courtesy of 4barsrest (http://www.4barsrest.com/news/detail.asp?id=5227)

madandcrazytromboneguy
11.03.2007, 12:39
whats with this split draw stuff?

I'm guessin it can only be for when the judges have their half time break

if its coz of somethingelse though please say!

im really annoyed coz ive not been able to make it today, the trains from hebden on a sunday mornin are useless!

plus on top of that, its a busride from preston coz the lines up!

LAST MINUTE GOOD LUCK TO LOSTOCK HALL, ECCLES, AND LITTLEBROUGH!

aimee_euph
11.03.2007, 16:55
Section 4
Bands

Barnton Silver, S. Yates, 5
Besses Boys, J. Holt, 4
Blackley, A. Smith, 13
Brindle, K. Richmond, 8
Carrbrook Brass, L. Dunkley, 7
Coppull & Standish, H. Bentham, 19
Eaton Farnworth & Walkden, P. Ashley, 11
Eccles Borough, L. Webb, 15
Formby, L. Hough, 1
Golborne, E. Hill, 3
Greenfield, D. Chapman, 9
Hesketh Bank Silver, G. Clough, W
Littleborough Public, M. Bailey, 16
Lostock Hall Memorial, I. McKnight, 6
Nelson Brass, J. Roberts, 17
Parr (Richardson Ltd.), J. Smith, 2
Ramsey Town, R. Quane, 10
Rode Hall Silver, S. Thompson, 18
Tarleton & District Brass, G. Bould, 12
Uppermill, A. Widdop, 14

3 bands qualify.


Section 3
Results:

1. Oldham (Lees), J. Collins, 9, 185
2. Middleton, C. Whiteoak, 6, 183
3. Eccleston Brass, I. Bateson, 19, 182
4. Pemberton Old Wigan JJB ‘B’, P. Ashley, 18, 181
5. Flixton, K. Gibbs, 14, 180
6. Morecambe, C. Larder, 1, 179

BMP Europe Goodshaw, D. Ashworth, 2
City of Chester, P. Mottershead, 4
Dobcross Youth 2003, T. Griffiths, 7
Douglas Town, G. Higginbottom, 10
Eagley, D. Thornton, 3
Friezland, L. Tingay, 5
Hawk Green (Marple), P. Pavey, 8
Hazel Grove, N. Bowden, 16
Pilling Jubilee Silver, B. Porter, 17
Rivington & Adlington, D. Mort, 13
Skelmersdale Prize, A. Booth, 11
Valley Brass (Haydock), D. Chadwick, 15
Whitworth Vale & Healey, J. Binns, 12

3 bands qualify.


Section 2
Bands

Blackpool Brass, A. Warriner, 12
Boarshurst Silver, D. Morris, 8
Bollington Brass, P. Christian, 6
Delph, P. Goodwin, 4
Greenall’s, J. Ludden, 5
Manx Concert Brass, I. Clague MBE, 1
Old Hall Brass, T. Halliwell, 11
Rainford, N. Samuel, 7
Stalybridge Old, R. Collinson, 9
Trinity Girls, S. Barton, 2
United Co-operatives 2000 Brass, J. Meredith, 10
Wardle & District Anderson Brass, S. Conway, 3


Section 1
Bands

1. Timperley, D. Evans, 7, 190
2. Poulton-le-Fylde, S. Tarry, 13, 189
3. Mossley, D. Byers, 8, 188
4. Roberts Bakery, C. Cranson, 3, 187
5. United Co-op (Crewe), J. Sparkes, 4, 186
6. Ashton-under-Lyne, P. Chalk, 1, 184
7. Longridge, P. Lockett, 10, 183
8. Diggle, M. Beevers, 2, 182
9. Maxilead Metals Tyldesley, R. Taylor, 6, 181
10. Haslingden & Helmshore, D. Holland, 9, 180
11. Silk Brass Astra Zeneca Macclesfield, J. Cant, 12, 179
12. Besses o’ th’ Barn, J. Hinckley, 5, 178
13. Hoover (Bolton), R. Cargill, 11, 177

Top 2 bands qualify


Championship Section
Bands

BT, M. Fowles, 10
Bactiguard Wire Brass, P. Andrews, 7
Blackburn & Darwen, N. Sheppard, 11
Dobcross Silver, w
Fairey, Major P. Parkes, 2
Foden’s Richardson, G. Cutt, 5
Freckleton, P. Dalton, 4
Leyland, R. Gray, 8
Pemberton Old Wigan JJB, M. Peacock, 6
United Co-op Milnrow, A. White, 3
Vernon Building Society Poynton, A. Lawton MBE, 9
Wingates, A. Berryman, 1

this is from 4barsrest

PurpleHaze
11.03.2007, 18:29
Just got back from a looooooonnnng day in Blackpool. A mixture of dissapointment and happiness with the results in third section. To come in the top 6th after not even being noticed on 4barsrest was pretty gratifying although it would have been nice to qualify for the finals. Didn't hear Flixton or Middleton play but apparantly they were very good.

Andyrob75
11.03.2007, 18:42
Well done to all my fellow band mates at The Oldham Band (Lees) for qualifying for the National Finals for the third consecutive year...and also being crowned North West Area 3rd Section Champions at the first attempt..sorry that I couldn't be there to take in the win with you all, but really good to see the band going from strength to strength....makes up for the wilderness years and all the hard work put in since! Come on Oldham!!!!

I'd also like to say congrats to all the bands that have qualified, especially my good mates at Middleton!

Aardvark
11.03.2007, 19:01
Champ section results received by text

1.Fodens
2.Leyland
3.Wingates
4.BT
5.Faireys

super_sop
11.03.2007, 19:11
Fantastic news, absolutely brilliant to see fodens back on top spot again.
well done guys

PurpleHaze
11.03.2007, 19:14
I have a question for you guys. I watched about seven third section bands and noticed that *most* (but not all) of the bands that were in the top six got a big cheer at the end of the playing. Do you think that this influences the adjudicator, even slightly without him knowing it?

BIG Paul
11.03.2007, 20:17
Well done to Uppermill on second place in 4th section

Crazysop
11.03.2007, 20:38
Come on Oldham!!!!

I'd also like to say congrats to all the bands that have qualified, especially my good mates at Middleton!

Hi Andy, shame you wern't there, oldham played a blinder!!!!! See you in Harrogate!

sevenhelz
11.03.2007, 21:12
Anyone got word of the second section?
x

Bradderz!!!
11.03.2007, 21:30
Champs: Relegated - Haydock and Blackburn and Darwin

1st Section: Promoted to Champs: Timperley, Crewe Co-op
Relegated to 2nd: Haslingden and Helmshore, Hoover Bolton

AndyCat
11.03.2007, 21:53
Champs: Relegated - Haydock and Blackburn and Darwin

1st Section: Promoted to Champs: Timperley, Crewe Co-op
Relegated to 2nd: Haslingden and Helmshore, Hoover Bolton

apparently 3 are to go down.......

notsosilentbob
11.03.2007, 21:58
Just back now.

What a day. We felt we'd played well albeit with a few more clips than we'd like. Was obviously delighted with the win. Congrats to Middleton also, especially the 'radiant' 2nd trom ;), and grats to Eccleston. Still not sunk in yet. Harrogate here we come :biggrin:.

Congratulations to all qualifiers :clap:.

(Will post up more when sober :-?)

Stuart

madsaz
11.03.2007, 22:02
On behalf of Ashton Band I'd like to publicly thank Haslingden band for the loan of their Hymn Books. Having drawn first, we realised we had forgotten to bring them. Ok, everyone claims to know the National Anthem off by heart, but we didn't want to test that on stage! Their help was greatly appreciated - thanks indeed.

tpcornet12
11.03.2007, 22:25
2nd Section;

1. Wardle
2. Blackpool
3. ?
4. Bollington
Sorry I missed who got 3rd but no doubt someone will update accordingly.

We hoped for better as we get promoted this year and it feels strange not to go to the Finals when promoted but never mind.

The real disappointment for me today was the fact that champ section ran 1 hour before 2nd section meaning that unless you had a really early draw you couldn't really get to see the top bands.
Really pleased that Fodens won. BT had a good result with 4th.

Stix
11.03.2007, 22:26
we (VBS Poynton) were extremley dissapointed with our performance. We have played it soooo mushc better than we did on stage and were really upset that it didnt happen on stage. Last in the contest was certainly a blow! onward and upward!

Also, boyfriend plays for Besses, they werent totally happy with their performance but were really dissapointed with their result,. had a string of bad luck!

ah well x

joelrn
11.03.2007, 23:40
Champs: Relegated - Haydock and Blackburn and Darwin

1st Section: Promoted to Champs: Timperley, Crewe Co-op
Relegated to 2nd: Haslingden and Helmshore, Hoover Bolton


Personally I think that it is pathetic that all you have to comment on is who's going to be relegated from which sections after such a great day of music making. Have you taken nothing positive from the day that you could share on TMP???

chiephonium
12.03.2007, 00:09
What a great day....

Fodens I had 2nd to Leyland... - thought RG's reading was superb.....!

Nevertheless well done to Garry and everone at Fodens - very technical and great sound. - wow.

Bit dissapointed by Faireys though - thought they could have done much better....

Wire Brass can feel very hard done by.... - they were solid throughout with great soloists, 10th is very harsh...

Hope everyone has had a great day like me (and Neil Twist :guiness !)

Best of luck to the top 2 for the Nationals -- see you there!


bonjourno.

Hells Bones
12.03.2007, 00:31
Delph Band came 8th in the second section, we were very happy with our performance and and were quite stunned at failing to be placed, but hey, that's contesting

Anno Draconis
12.03.2007, 08:41
On behalf of Middleton Band I'd just like to say:


YYYYYEEEEEEEEESSSSSSSS!
COME ON!


Thank you for your attention :D

MattB
12.03.2007, 08:53
Our performance was a total disaster. Started terribly (1st time that's happened!) and the band didn't recover until mid way into the second movement. Sadly this doesn't reflect on how well the bands been playing recently. It's been that good I had us in the top six with a good performance, but unfortunately these freak occurances happen! Anyone else ever been brimming with confidence before the contest only for everything possible that could go wrong does?

stotty74
12.03.2007, 08:58
First time ever yesterday at the Area's. Tried to see all the 1st Section and top Section bands, but missed one in each. Not sure i'd like to do that every year though!!!

Had Foden's slightly ahead of Leyland. Surprised with Wingates. First on and such a solid performance, they definitely deserve their 3rd place, and BT also played really well. Managed to get the top four , but thought Fairey's might have just crept in. Wire should have been higher aswell. Thought it was a good debut for you, but obviously my opininon doesn't count.

As for 1st Section, Timperley sounded very good, but then i had Co-op Crewe and Besse's. Couldn't really have been more wrong!! Well done to Stu and Rachel playing for Timperley, you both played really well.

blueorange
12.03.2007, 08:59
Just sobered up enough to post my congrats to all at Oldham - we played well (a few clips here and there but buzzing with the result!!) Well done guys!!!

horn1
12.03.2007, 09:41
Just like to say well done to Oldham, brilliant result! We were really pleased with our performance and unfortunately incredabily baffled by our result. But hey that's contesting for you!

AndyCat
12.03.2007, 10:08
Not a brilliant day for us at Freckleton.

Our troubles started after registration, when the door was locked to get out to the stage and the official supposedly letting us out wasn't there. By the time Gary had run round to let us out, most of the previous band were already changed!

Then, on getting on stage, we found that there was a kit bass drum as listed, but no bass drum pedal! So off goes Gary again to try and find Ray Payne (whilst the band is sat on stage), to return saying he can't find him, so on we go without the use of a bass drum at all.

Our performance went quite well, and we were never going to challenge Fodens, Leyland etc., but we are very dissapointed with 9th really. Although probably not as dissapointed as Faireys and Wire!

I'm sure this contest would benefit from 2 adjudicators, even if the entry fee was higher for us, and it must be time for some new blood in the box, please?!? The remarks were unconstructive, mainly unreadable without lots of study, and really quite vague.

Well done to all the qualifiers in all sections, do us proud at the RAH and Harrogate! Unlucky to the other bands who had a bad result, especially Besses who must be devastated after all the work I know they've put in.

Chris Sanders
12.03.2007, 10:13
apparently 3 are to go down.......

If so I make that Poynton?

1, Fodens 3 1 1 5
2, Leyland 1 3 2 6
3, Fairey 2 2 5 9
4, Wingates 4 4 3 11
5, BT 5 6 4 15
6, Dobx 6 5 5.5 16.5
7, Freck 6 7 9 22 =
7, Milnrow 6 10 6 22 =
7, Pem 7 8 7 22 =
10, Wire 6 6.5 10 22.5
11, Poynton 6 6.5 11 23.5
12, Haydock 11 9 5.5 25.5
13, Blackburn 6 12 8 26

davidquinlan
12.03.2007, 10:13
Well done to my old mates at Manx who in second section, secured a solid 6th place from the dreaded No 1 draw.

They can probably be found right now in Scruffy Murphys ....

[Yes I know it 10am Monday morning...]

aimee_euph
12.03.2007, 10:18
whats with this split draw stuff?

I'm guessin it can only be for when the judges have their half time break

if its coz of somethingelse though please say!


It is because the section is so big, it is not fair for all of the 4th section to come in from everywhere in time for the draw only to find out they have been drawn last...not much fun!

It allows the second half of the draw to be able to plan their day round a second draw.

Not sure if this is right but that's the way i thought it worked...

Darth_Tuba
12.03.2007, 10:21
Very pleased to qualify for another finals in a tough area. Only heard two other bands, Wingates and Faireys. Was impressed with Wingates, clean performance with good soloists and a sensible reading, perhaps just lacking the odd Wow moment at crescendos to push into the top 2. Faireys were generally quite good, but tuning was an issue in the opening, and the poco a poco accel at V seemed to have happened within a few bars to me (and percussion didn't all play at the end?). I only heard those two bands I'm afraid so not much of a valid opinion in the grand scheme of things!

PeterBale
12.03.2007, 10:21
whats with this split draw stuff?

I'm guessin it can only be for when the judges have their half time break

if its coz of somethingelse though please say!

Surely the point of a split draw is to reduce the amount of time players need to be kept hanging around: seems to make sense when you've got a big section with that many bands.

AndyCat
12.03.2007, 10:33
If so I make that Poynton?

1, Fodens 3 1 1 5
2, Leyland 1 3 2 6
3, Fairey 2 2 5 9
4, Wingates 4 4 3 11
5, BT 5 6 4 15
6, Dobx 6 5 5.5 16.5
7, Freck 6 7 9 22 =
7, Milnrow 6 10 6 22 =
7, Pem 7 8 7 22 =
10, Wire 6 6.5 10 22.5
11, Poynton 6 6.5 11 23.5
12, Haydock 11 9 5.5 25.5
13, Blackburn 6 12 8 26


I think DobX and Heydock will get maximum points?

Chris Sanders
12.03.2007, 10:44
Ah, I didnt know that?


I'm sure this contest would benefit from 2 adjudicators, even if the entry fee was higher for us, and it must be time for some new blood in the box, please?!? The remarks were unconstructive, mainly unreadable without lots of study, and really quite vague.

Amen to that...

Nobody minds constructive criticism, something to build and improve on?

I think its time that the powers that be paid out for proper musicians of a different genre, possibly a top class orchestral musician? Somebody who understands brass, has a good idea of ensemble musicianship?

In my opinion a possible problem could be that the best musicians for the job are some of the guys conducting?

Hells Bones
12.03.2007, 11:42
Well when our adjudication was read out, when the guy had announced 2nd, we thought we had won, the adjudicator said a word at the beggining about what he was looking for and we had done everything he asked for. We had backed off a considerable way from our normal sound so as not to be aggressive. And, of course, we did everything that the score asked of us, so we were shocked when we didn't even place

Soil Lover
12.03.2007, 11:47
I think DobX and Heydock will get maximum points?

I also thought that if just promoted or demoted a band gets a years grace of promotion / demotion :confused:

davidquinlan
12.03.2007, 11:51
Well done to Ramsey Town, also from the Isle of Man who have qualified for the 4th Section finals.

andyp
12.03.2007, 12:07
Congrats to everyone who qualified - we are very pleased indeed, especially doing it with 3 players down, a tribute to everyone's hard work.

It's surprising how drunk you can get in 90 minutes.................

:woo

AndyCat
12.03.2007, 12:16
I also thought that if just promoted or demoted a band gets a years grace of promotion / demotion :confused:

Don't think so, you just get average points for the year before. Pretty sure. The one year we were first section we bounced straight back up again anyway.

Chris Sanders
12.03.2007, 12:29
Don't think so, you just get average points for the year before. Pretty sure. The one year we were first section we bounced straight back up again anyway.

I thought that only applied in the Open??

Rach_Horn
12.03.2007, 12:34
Congrats to Middleton in the third section esp Hero! Big congrats also to Timperly ( Rach , Stu and Chell esp :D ) and Fodens and Leyland in Champ section :clap:

Stix
12.03.2007, 12:49
If so I make that Poynton?

1, Fodens 3 1 1 5
2, Leyland 1 3 2 6
3, Fairey 2 2 5 9
4, Wingates 4 4 3 11
5, BT 5 6 4 15
6, Dobx 6 5 5.5 16.5
7, Freck 6 7 9 22 =
7, Milnrow 6 10 6 22 =
7, Pem 7 8 7 22 =
10, Wire 6 6.5 10 22.5
11, Poynton 6 6.5 11 23.5
12, Haydock 11 9 5.5 25.5
13, Blackburn 6 12 8 26

cheers chris, just what people want to see the day after theyve had a bad result! why all the rush?? We worked dam hard on that piece, and just had a bad day... were aware of the possibilty of going back down.. just a bit sad to see it being the subject of discussion.

sparkling_quavers
12.03.2007, 13:04
congratulations to all the qualifiers but, in particular, to Timperley who represent Trafford to an excellent standard, and also to Middleton - having heard the band on a number of occassions over the last few years the recent improvements have been immense and I am sure you will do great in Harrogate. I was really pleased with our performance (Flixton). The most dissappointing part of the day was that a band in our section saw fit to cheer and scream when we were placed 5th. This I thought was totally inappropriate and, to be perfectly honest, downright rude! Such a shame that success, especially at this level, can be tainted with that sort of arrogant attitude.

SuperCat
12.03.2007, 13:20
Some surprising results in the 2nd section. Shocker for Boarshurst, are they relegated from this? A shame if so, as they have made good steady progress over the past few years.

Catley

Chris Sanders
12.03.2007, 13:29
cheers chris, just what people want to see the day after theyve had a bad result! why all the rush?? We worked dam hard on that piece, and just had a bad day... were aware of the possibilty of going back down.. just a bit sad to see it being the subject of discussion.

Sorry Alex, I wasnt doing it to see who was going down, you know Id hate to see you go down, so unfair after just one bad result. I was doing it to see whether we would be safe for next year!!

johnflugel
12.03.2007, 13:29
What were the general feelings from the championship section?

Stix
12.03.2007, 13:35
What were the general feelings from the championship section?

i HATE that hall. I dont think it does any of the bands any favours. Especially on a piece like Isiah. All the technical stuff is lost in there.

Maybe only my opnion though.

notsosilentbob
12.03.2007, 13:50
The most dissappointing part of the day was that a band in our section saw fit to cheer and scream when we were placed 5th. This I thought was totally inappropriate and, to be perfectly honest, downright rude! Such a shame that success, especially at this level, can be tainted with that sort of arrogant attitude.

sparkling, I heard that too and straight away spoke to the persons involved. It was out of order, doesnt reflect the attitude of the band and wont happen again. We do have a high number of teenagers in the band as people are aware and sometimes excitement can get the better of them. However, this is no excuse and you have my personal apologies as a player and committee member of Oldham Band (Lees).

Stuart

madsaz
12.03.2007, 13:51
Is the North West the only area that has 1 adjudicator? How can that be fair if all the others have 2? I can't believe I haven't noticed this before, dim blonde that I am.

Maybe some of the new found sponsorhip money could go towards emplying another one so our areas are judged in the same way as the others - I know cost cutting comes into it.

There are always results considered "surprising" by many in the hall - at least if 2 had agreed some of the really odd ones would have more credibility (or better still wouldn't happen).

Its hard to rationalise a result when you have heard decent performaces not do well, or things that sounded poor get placed - even accepting one mans opinion blah blah blah...

If the prize for each section is the same - i.e. national finals, then surely the process needs to be the same too?

flugtastic
12.03.2007, 14:08
well done to everybody that qualified yesterday! ESPECIALLY UPPERMILL!
what a weekend its been!! harrogates going to be more fun tho! 2 weeks after my 18th hehe! PARTY!

davidquinlan
12.03.2007, 14:14
i HATE that hall. I dont think it does any of the bands any favours. Especially on a piece like Isiah. All the technical stuff is lost in there.

Maybe only my opnion though.

Why should bands get favours? It's a competition!

As long as all bands in a section play in the same hall, it's a level playing field. The hall may not have the most suitable acoustic, but as I said, it's the same for all. It's just another issue that must be overcome in order to produce a performance (that the adjudicators may or not think is the best on the day!)

You can't blame the hall, but you can blame a bands inability to adapt to an acoustic.

Anno Draconis
12.03.2007, 14:16
i HATE that hall. I dont think it does any of the bands any favours. Especially on a piece like Isiah. All the technical stuff is lost in there.

Maybe only my opnion though.

Not just your opinion; trying to play Entertainments in there to an empty hall off number 1 last year (when it was about -4 degrees on stage!) was one of my least edifying contest experiences. Hopefully next year the Opera House will be available again, then we could use the OH, the Spanish Room and the Theatre, and bin the ballroom. I enjoyed playing in the Pavilion Theatre (new experience for me) and I don't think I was the only one.

Well done to Leyland, enjoyed the performance, and Russell Gray is one of the most likeable top section conductors I've met, so it's nice to see him picking up more trophies!

Respect to Stuart ("notsosilentbob") for his quick response to Rachel - I know a few people in the bar yesterday were a little bit annoyed about the cheering of Flixton's 5th place and it's good to see the band involved handle this sort of stuff properly, with a word in the ear of the people concerned and a quick apology, and no big fuss.
None of which should detract from the winning performance, which by all accounts was very good (I missed it, unfortunately). We'll be looking for revenge in Harrogate, though :D

Stix
12.03.2007, 14:16
Why should bands get favours? It's a competition!

As long as all bands in a section play in the same hall, it's a level playing field. The hall may not have the most suitable acoustic, but as I said, it's the same for all. It's just another issue that must be overcome in order to produce a performance (that the adjudicators may or not think is the best on the day!)

You can't blame the hall, but you can blame a bands inability to adapt to an acoustic.

i dont expect any favours, as i dont think any other bands should. However, i can have an opnion of not liking the hall. you cant take that away from me. I didnt say we shouldnt be there. I just think its a shame all the bands make an effort of all the technical stuff, and sometimes, its lost. Thats an opnion, not blaming our performance on the hall in any way.

Ali
12.03.2007, 14:18
"well after travelling over to Yorkshire last wkend I came away feeling disappointed with the standard of the top section - I don't think any of the bands actually played the damn piece. and before everyone starts having a go, I'm not saying the bands where c**p just that there was a lot of slips and not enough music in it all - basically I think they all underestimated it. anyway to get to my point, if the top top bands at Yorkshire have undersestimated the music then theres a damn good chance the top top bands at the north west will make the same mistake, and if so there is hope for all us lesser mortals in the championship section. I definately have a feeling that the results will suprise a few people"

I must say that I cant remember reading a more offensive posting for quite a while! Wha planet are you on? Do you really think that the bands that played last weekend under-estimated Isaiah? What planet do you come from? With everything that is at stake in Yorkshire (from qualification places to pride in the toughest contest around) it sounds like you just think that we dont care. How dare you! I imagine all the bands (with maybe one or two possible exceptions) have worked extremely hard over the last couple of weeks and possibly more to come up with a performance of the piece. Just because there were slips in the performances (and thats probably because we are only human and not robots) you say these things. How did you do? How many slips were in your performance? Do you under-estimate the piece. Probably not! Think before you open your mouth.

billy_p
12.03.2007, 14:20
Dave, have you played in there? it's not suitable for bands of any standard. I cant see how the adjudicator could have picked out any real detail in the technical passages. More importantly, if people are paying money to listen to bands then they should get to hear more than just mush. I only heard a few bands and some of them could have been doing brilliant things at times but to be perfectly honest i wouldnt be able to say!!

This is by no means a complaint at the result though, we felt we played well for a first outing there, it was a good piece to spend time on and it was a quality weekend all in all, shame sometimes that you tend to remeber results more vividly than the actual day!

Ali
12.03.2007, 14:34
Ive played in that hall more times than I care to remember and its by far the worst concert/contest venue ive ever had the privilage of playing in. Its also the worst venue ive ever been in to listen to. Its bl***y awful. All the hard work that bands put in for the areas is destroyed by a hall that does no favours for anybody. If any conest is a lottery its this one because of it. All the clarity is lost and it just becomes a muffled nosie. All I can say is god help all of us that are playing in there for the Grand Lottery (I mean Shield) in May.

bigmamabadger
12.03.2007, 14:38
As usual, we was robbed...;)
Actually not so. we're pretty chuffed with our 8th, place; an improvement on last year's 10th and the previous year's 14th. Onward and upward.
BMB
Barnton Silver Band
xx

madsaz
12.03.2007, 14:38
I think I would have to agree with Ali.

The hall has to affect what the adjudicators heard - including in some respects covering some fairly glaring errors up, but also hiding tight detailed playing to the detriment of some bands.

It has helped us in the past - Masquerade for the Grand Shield is a notable example since we got a 2nd out of that particular lottery (so on that day though the venue was fine cheers - or at least didn't hurt us). I think you have to be pretty close to the stage to hear any detail & may account for the wide variations in what people seem to hear.

I'd prefer our local church hall to be honest, I'd get nicer scones too & wouldn't get ripped off in the bar (don't set me off on the topic of that Jacobs fruit cider.....)

joelrn
12.03.2007, 14:39
Why should bands get favours? It's a competition!

As long as all bands in a section play in the same hall, it's a level playing field. The hall may not have the most suitable acoustic, but as I said, it's the same for all. It's just another issue that must be overcome in order to produce a performance (that the adjudicators may or not think is the best on the day!)

You can't blame the hall, but you can blame a bands inability to adapt to an acoustic.

No-one would blame the acoustic for their performance, since, as you pointed out everyone played in the same hall, but from an audience point of view it makes the piece less good to listen to. Most of the detail of the piece, of which there is a lot, was totally inaudible, making it just a mush of sound.
It is also a shame that the ressonance of the hall stopped bands playing to their full potential dynamically.

davidquinlan
12.03.2007, 14:41
i dont expect any favours, as i dont think any other bands should. However, i can have an opnion of not liking the hall. you cant take that away from me. I didnt say we shouldnt be there. I just think its a shame all the bands make an effort of all the technical stuff, and sometimes, its lost. Thats an opnion, not blaming our performance on the hall in any way.

Sorry, I don't think I said that you couldn't have an opinion, or that you were blaming the performance of your band on the hall.

I have played in all halls in the Winter Gardens, the ballroom being my least favourite too.

Stix
12.03.2007, 14:44
You can't blame the hall, but you can blame a bands inability to adapt to an acoustic

fair enough you didnt say i could have an opnion, but with reference to your comment above, every band adapted to the hall, they were all capable of it, but no band is capable of making their techinal detail heard. Thats what i meant.

nickjones
12.03.2007, 14:47
First North West area competition since 1989 , really enjoyed the weekend , well done to Ramsey town who were in our hotel , really young band and a fantastic result for them.Really pleased for Paul Andrews , Andy Dale and everyone involved with Wire , first step on the ladder and a performance to be proud of no disgrace in the result , live to fight another day.
but as regards to the hall , it's not that bad , used to be the hall for the old mineworkers championship section. Well done to BT and Mike Fowles also to Andy Berryman and Wingates ( only heard the first two bands some class Bari playing from Maz at Wingates).

sparkling_quavers
12.03.2007, 14:50
sparkling, I heard that too and straight away spoke to the persons involved. It was out of order, doesnt reflect the attitude of the band and wont happen again. We do have a high number of teenagers in the band as people are aware and sometimes excitement can get the better of them. However, this is no excuse and you have my personal apologies as a player and committee member of Oldham Band (Lees).

Stuart

Thanks Stuart, apology accepted :tup Best of luck at the Nationals.

horn1
12.03.2007, 14:51
You can't blame the hall, but you can blame a bands inability to adapt to an acoustic

fair enough you didnt say i could have an opnion, but with reference to your comment above, every band adapted to the hall, they were all capable of it, but no band is capable of making their techinal detail heard. Thats what i meant.

I agree with you completely Alex, it puts everyone at a disadvantage having to play in that hall. It's bad enough for the 1st section but when you have the top section in there with much more complex pieces it's a nightmare. Whoever said they should think about using the Pavillion Theatre next year has the right idea. Although they could do with sorting the heating out, I nearly fried on stage!

notsosilentbob
12.03.2007, 15:00
Thanks Stuart, apology accepted :tup Best of luck at the Nationals.

Thank you.

Stuart

brasscrest
12.03.2007, 15:12
I agree with you completely Alex, it puts everyone at a disadvantage having to play in that hall. It's bad enough for the 1st section but when you have the top section in there with much more complex pieces it's a nightmare. Whoever said they should think about using the Pavillion Theatre next year has the right idea. Although they could do with sorting the heating out, I nearly fried on stage!

Compared to whom? If everyone is disadvantaged, then no one has an advantage - isn't that how things are supposed to be at a contest? Superlatives are funny things, aren't they? ;)

A contest is technically "fair" if all of the performers are subjected to the same conditions - regardless of how bad those conditions may be. But technically fair probably isn't the correct standard for something as important as an Area contest, where a poor result might lead to a band being relegated. If the hall is so bad that the adjudication is compromised, then the hall should not be used - regardless of scheduling issues.

The problem with this particular hall, based on the posts in this thread, seems to be that the adjudicators cannot hear enough detail to separate the performances properly. So a technically "fair" contest becomes a bit of a dice game, which is not fair to anyone, least of all those who have put in time to get the details right. Ir's also not fair to the adjudicators themselves - they are put in a position of attempting to separate bands when they can't hear the details that in a proper hall would be the things they would use to accomplish the separation.

Maz
12.03.2007, 15:17
Well done to BT and Mike Fowles also to Andy Berryman and Wingates ( only heard the first two bands some class Bari playing from Maz at Wingates).

Thank you! I knew it was in there somewhere!!

Was a bit disappointed that we didn't qualify - sincere congrats to Fodens and Leyland who did though - but can now see that if we just have another year together heading in the direction that we are, we can and will do better.

The hall wasn't as bad as I had remembered it being, but perhaps that was because we knew where the contest was and made arrangements to adjust, and also cos we took the band out to two different large venues to play in a different acoustic.

Happy day, heard some great comments about the band - onward and upward..

Darth_Tuba
12.03.2007, 15:39
All I can say is god help all of us that are playing in there for the Grand Lottery (I mean Shield) in May.

I think the Shield is in the Opera House? It was last year anyway, but we'll wait and see. Although I agree with everyone that the acoustic in the Ballroom is terrible for hearing enough detail, I don't think it effected the result to that great a degree. Half of any contest is tailoring a performance to the venue, the Opera House presents its own challenges. I do agree its poor though in the ballroom, and audience members sat to either side rather than in the middle get a very different impression of the performances.

As for adjudicators, I'm still confused as to why two adjudicators are better than one. Three perhaps... although how many times have we seen 3 adjudicators get it "wrong" in everyone elses eyes? ;) I think you could have 30 and someone would still complain! I do think some younger, but still experienced, names in the box would be nice though. Dave King is one who instantly springs to mind.

Anyway... roll on the Spring Festival and another 2 weeks lost to rehearsals! Living the dream! :p

PurpleHaze
12.03.2007, 16:39
Not just your opinion; trying to play Entertainments in there to an empty hall off number 1 last year (when it was about -4 degrees on stage!) was one of my least edifying contest experiences. Hopefully next year the Opera House will be available again, then we could use the OH, the Spanish Room and the Theatre, and bin the ballroom. I enjoyed playing in the Pavilion Theatre (new experience for me) and I don't think I was the only one.



Agreed 100%. Last year was not an enjoyable contest for me, it was also my first as well which didn't help. We were drawn pretty close to last and didn't really do well at all.
However the Pavillion theatre and being drawn right near the beginning this year did us justice and i enjoyed this contest thoroughly.

madsaz
12.03.2007, 16:57
You are right, you could have 30 and people will not agree. But statistically, the more people assessing independantly - ie they can't sit together and chat- the more likely you are that the outlier result doesn't happen. We can't ask for a panel of 30 (though if each band sent a rep to listen to a different section - blinded of course - the results would be interesting - not neccessarily valid, but interesting) - but if every other area has 2 that means that the experience should be standardised in some way.

And yes, I would love younger, less deaf adjudicators, but didn't want to be accused of ageism. David King would have been great - he listened to us a week ago and said we were great. Mind you, he was probably just being polite. Thats the other problem with Brass Banding - when we all say one thing and mean another!

leisa
12.03.2007, 17:04
congratulations to all the qualifiers but, in particular, to Timperley who represent Trafford to an excellent standard, and also to Middleton - having heard the band on a number of occassions over the last few years the recent improvements have been immense and I am sure you will do great in Harrogate. I was really pleased with our performance (Flixton). The most dissappointing part of the day was that a band in our section saw fit to cheer and scream when we were placed 5th. This I thought was totally inappropriate and, to be perfectly honest, downright rude! Such a shame that success, especially at this level, can be tainted with that sort of arrogant attitude.


Well done flixton i had a phone call from a veeery drunk nikki telling me your result and also telling me how proud she is that she plays with you lot!! I am very proud of you too uv come a long way since i left 3 yrs ago :biggrin:

Also well done to Leyland!! whooo and well done to Timperly specially Miss Lilley (the little star)! xx

spanishflee
12.03.2007, 18:28
I can't agree more, last year was an ordeal if you take into account the siberian weather, the freezing hall and one pair of white trainers. But this year still deserves a moan. I hate to say it by the time we got on stage the place was bordering on a sub-tropical swimming paradise with warm pacific breeze. Overall the Opera theatre was by far the best venue for the 3rd section. So I say keep the Moulin Rouge for next year!

Darth_Tuba
12.03.2007, 18:52
You are right, you could have 30 and people will not agree. But statistically, the more people assessing independantly - ie they can't sit together and chat- the more likely you are that the outlier result doesn't happen.

I'm not arguing that more people isn't better, just that from one, you have to go up to three before it would work. Anyway... you only have to look at the Masters where they used three separate judges and adding up the placings to see that this won't avoid controversy in the slightest.

madsaz
12.03.2007, 18:55
Still, I think the suggestion about deafness might be one we can take forward.

Bradderz!!!
12.03.2007, 19:01
Well done Timperley, but there were a few dodgy results in the 1st section hey??!?! e.g. Besses 2nd from last??!? Apparently they didn't perform their best, but still, compared to some of the bands i heard they couldn't have been that bad?

Few other funnyones aswell!?! Anyone thinking the same?

bongo massive
12.03.2007, 19:01
Help needed - lost stick bag!

I played 8th in the Ballroom and have misplaced a black 'Jam Percussion' stick bag with sticks and a couple of triangles in it as well. If anyone has picked them up either to keep them safe or by accident please let me know

Thanks.......

Darth_Tuba
12.03.2007, 19:04
Still, I think the suggestion about deafness might be one we can take forward.

No arguements there. I agree the system really isn't perfect, I just don't think 2 sets of deaf ears make a good one... ;)

madsaz
12.03.2007, 19:08
good point, well argued.

aimee_euph
12.03.2007, 19:36
I think I would have to agree with Ali.

The hall has to affect what the adjudicators heard - including in some respects covering some fairly glaring errors up, but also hiding tight detailed playing to the detriment of some bands.


Simple - best mush wins.

malrep
12.03.2007, 20:51
Must admit, results were a bit of a shock in second section. Not taking anything away from the winners, well done to them. It seemed many other good bands played pretty well and got poor results - obviously not what he was looking for !

Heather
12.03.2007, 21:06
As usual, we was robbed...;)
Actually not so. we're pretty chuffed with our 8th, place; an improvement on last year's 10th and the previous year's 14th. Onward and upward.
BMB
Barnton Silver Band
xx

Congratulations on the most sensible message in this thread. Great attitude and all the best next year....hope you get in thew top 2.

kenbo
12.03.2007, 21:17
Well done to Eccles band. I listened to many of the band in the section you were robbed.

Andy_Euph
12.03.2007, 22:58
Quite a good weekend, stayed a few days and had a laugh. Good result for the band (Blackley) we are going in the right direction.

Well done to the winners, especially Timperley (even with Stu)

chiephonium
12.03.2007, 23:05
well after travelling over to Yorkshire last wkend I came away feeling disappointed with the standard of the top section - I don't think any of the bands actually played the damn piece. and before everyone starts having a go, I'm not saying the bands where c**p just that there was a lot of slips and not enough music in it all - basically I think they all underestimated it. anyway to get to my point, if the top top bands at Yorkshire have undersestimated the music then theres a damn good chance the top top bands at the north west will make the same mistake, and if so there is hope for all us lesser mortals in the championship section. I definately have a feeling that the results will suprise a few people :rolleyes:

what a foolish statement.....

why do you think there is going to be 5 YORKSHIRE bands at the finals this year......

where did your band come at your regionals?.........

could it be argued then that your band didn't play the damm piece?.......

why would any band under-estimate a test piece, that is utterly a stupid remark.....

i heard grimethorpe in a rehearsal 4 nights before the contest and thought to myself that this will take some beating - it was awesome.... as you might come to expect....

just because 2 of the "top" yorkshire bands had an off day (grimethorpe & ybs), and arguably an unfavourable draw, then there are fools talking about bands under-estimating pieces etc etc....

i came along to the north west area and thought fodens and leylands were a class apart.....

i also thought that wire brass should have been place higher that 10th, but that is not my job....

what i fail to understand is how you can possibly conceive that any band might under-estimate a test piece, ever, but especially when the test piece has been used before (nationals 1996) - probably conducted by many of the conductors before, and when national qualification is at stake......

i'd like to see how Pemberton Old JJB would perform in the Yorkshire Area!...

now that will surely have put the cat well amongst the pigeons eh?



bonjourno...

budstellabecks
12.03.2007, 23:06
Well done to Eccles band. I listened to many of the band in the section you were robbed.

I'm not sure what the rest of the band think but I have mixed emotions over the result. Delighted that we put in a good performance and got a very creditable 4th place, an even better result when you consider that this time last year there was less than half a band around the stands.

Still slightly gutted though that we were only a point off qualifying. It definitely gives us something to build on though.

Anyway, well done to Formby, Uppermill and Ramsey. Good luck to you all at the finals.

flugelboy
12.03.2007, 23:18
Quite a good weekend, stayed a few days and had a laugh. Good result for the band (Blackley) we are going in the right direction.

Well done to the winners, especially Timperley (even with Stu)
thanks for that griff i dont know whether to take that as a good or bad comment lol,well done though to all the bands that did well especially my old band blackley who look to be getting stronger.
was a good weeken!!

Andy_Euph
13.03.2007, 02:00
thanks for that griff i dont know whether to take that as a good or bad comment lol,well done though to all the bands that did well especially my old band blackley who look to be getting stronger.
was a good weeken!!

Haha, nah mate, totally deserved, you should clearly be a band to beat at Harrogate.

Oh BTW how did everyone else feel at the "geordie bashing" during the 4th section results?....all I can say is a hall filled with "southerners" and I made more sound than the rest of you lot put together :biggrin:

madandcrazytromboneguy
13.03.2007, 03:18
Ive played in that hall more times than I care to remember and its by far the worst concert/contest venue ive ever had the privilage of playing in. Its also the worst venue ive ever been in to listen to. Its bl***y awful. All the hard work that bands put in for the areas is destroyed by a hall that does no favours for anybody. If any conest is a lottery its this one because of it. All the clarity is lost and it just becomes a muffled nosie. All I can say is god help all of us that are playing in there for the Grand Lottery (I mean Shield) in May.

dunno if ive ever played in there but i know of a room thats dire to play in, that room at pontins where theres no flippin stage!, its terrible you lose all sound quality in there, im guessing its basically the extreme opposite to this room your on about in winter gardens

well done to eccles and lostock hall for your top 6 positions

unlucky matt, last aint nice no matter what happens on stage, better luck next time

les you had a day to remember, a 4th and a 1st, are you still recovering from the hangover you probably gave yourself from having about 20 celebratory drinks?! :D

coudn't make it to the NW areas this time, a major lack of early trains to blackpool and it were a bus service from preston, so i would have missed a fair few bands if i'd come, and probably a load more when needing to come back! think i'll try and get a hotel room next time and make a weekend of it :)

critic
13.03.2007, 07:19
what a foolish statement.....

why do you think there is going to be 5 YORKSHIRE bands at the finals this year......

where did your band come at your regionals?.........

could it be argued then that your band didn't play the damm piece?.......

why would any band under-estimate a test piece, that is utterly a stupid remark.....

i heard grimethorpe in a rehearsal 4 nights before the contest and thought to myself that this will take some beating - it was awesome.... as you might come to expect....

just because 2 of the "top" yorkshire bands had an off day (grimethorpe & ybs), and arguably an unfavourable draw, then there are fools talking about bands under-estimating pieces etc etc....

i came along to the north west area and thought fodens and leylands were a class apart.....

i also thought that wire brass should have been place higher that 10th, but that is not my job....

what i fail to understand is how you can possibly conceive that any band might under-estimate a test piece, ever, but especially when the test piece has been used before (nationals 1996) - probably conducted by many of the conductors before, and when national qualification is at stake......

i'd like to see how Pemberton Old JJB would perform in the Yorkshire Area!...

now that will surely have put the cat well amongst the pigeons eh?



bonjourno...
Idont think any band in yorkshire underestimated the piece there were 9 good performances in any other area some would have got in the top 6

chiephonium
13.03.2007, 10:52
? i just made that point .. der

Maz
13.03.2007, 11:03
Help needed - lost stick bag!

I played 8th in the Ballroom and have misplaced a black 'Jam Percussion' stick bag with sticks and a couple of triangles in it as well. If anyone has picked them up either to keep them safe or by accident please let me know

Thanks.......


Not again Pete!! Wot you like?

Darth_Tuba
13.03.2007, 11:28
At least he didn't go off for a walk this time... :p

lottie4744
13.03.2007, 11:45
whooo and well done to Timperly specially Miss Lilley (the little star)! xx

You mean Miss Lilley who didn't play and wasn't in attendance last weekend?! xxx

leisa
13.03.2007, 13:07
You mean Miss Lilley who didn't play and wasn't in attendance last weekend?! xxx

oops sorry lauren, well done anyway...for whatever you did do at weekend :-P xx

les
13.03.2007, 14:25
"les you had a day to remember, a 4th and a 1st, are you still recovering from the hangover you probably gave yourself from having about 20 celebratory drinks?! :D"

Thanks Clive, but I couldn't play for Timperley as it clashed with the 4th section, but I was there in spirit!(well when they read out the results anyway)

4th place was a pleasing result in the 4th section but as I am sure you are aware...When you miss out on qualification by one place, it's a gutted feeling as you were so close in travelling to the finals.

Well done to All the players in Eccles and a special word of thanks to Jim Davies on Percussion who, on one rehearsal, helped us out after being asked to step down from 3rd cornet due to too many cornet players at my disposal! A luxury indeed!

Also to Len Sharnock who helped us out on Eb bass after being well and truely landed in it by our less than reliable Eb bass player giving us just 10 days notice that he couldn't play at the next two contests! A conductors nightmare!!!

Anyhow Luckily it all turned out fine for the day. Congratulations to all the bands in the Northwest who qualified - Especially Formby in our section who won the contest off a number 1 draw - They must have been very good!:clap:

Les Webb
MD Eccles Borough Band

flugelboy
13.03.2007, 15:12
Congrats to Middleton in the third section esp Hero! Big congrats also to Timperly ( Rach , Stu and Chell esp :D ) and Fodens and Leyland in Champ section :clap:

awwww thanks rach,was an awsome weekend,so just gta see what happens now :D

pemjo
13.03.2007, 17:20
what a foolish statement.....

why do you think there is going to be 5 YORKSHIRE bands at the finals this year......

where did your band come at your regionals?.........

could it be argued then that your band didn't play the damm piece?.......

why would any band under-estimate a test piece, that is utterly a stupid remark.....

i heard grimethorpe in a rehearsal 4 nights before the contest and thought to myself that this will take some beating - it was awesome.... as you might come to expect....

just because 2 of the "top" yorkshire bands had an off day (grimethorpe & ybs), and arguably an unfavourable draw, then there are fools talking about bands under-estimating pieces etc etc....

i came along to the north west area and thought fodens and leylands were a class apart.....

i also thought that wire brass should have been place higher that 10th, but that is not my job....

what i fail to understand is how you can possibly conceive that any band might under-estimate a test piece, ever, but especially when the test piece has been used before (nationals 1996) - probably conducted by many of the conductors before, and when national qualification is at stake......

i'd like to see how Pemberton Old JJB would perform in the Yorkshire Area!...

now that will surely have put the cat well amongst the pigeons eh?



bonjourno...
I also went to the yorkshire area and I too was a little bit dissapointed in the bands that I heard. I don't mean dissapointed in the technicalities of the playing as it all went in, I was just expecting to be completley wowed with the music of the piece. It is such a lovely piece of music and their is music to be made and it didn't give me that shiver. I didn't hear the band that came first and second and I can only presume that they must have got the music out of the piece even with a few slips. We put these bands on a pedistal as we know they are amazing but all I think Carina was saying was that she expected more. Obviously they are in a diffrerent league to Pemberton and thats why we expected more.. You can't complain as your band came in the top six !!! So be happy!!

bongo massive
13.03.2007, 17:27
Not exactly breaking news I know, but just in case any good soul out there is thinking of asking their percussionists or whatever - I have found my stick bag and am going to get it from the WinterGardens tonight. Like I say, not exactly breaking news...........

Di
13.03.2007, 17:41
Not exactly breaking news I know, but just in case any good soul out there is thinking of asking their percussionists or whatever - I have found my stick bag and am going to get it from the WinterGardens tonight. Like I say, not exactly breaking news...........

Breaking news or not, its good to know you've found them. :)

Thanks for letting everyone know.

Carina Halliwell
13.03.2007, 17:56
I also went to the yorkshire area and I too was a little bit dissapointed in the bands that I heard. I don't mean dissapointed in the technicalities of the playing as it all went in, I was just expecting to be completley wowed with the music of the piece. It is such a lovely piece of music and their is music to be made and it didn't give me that shiver. I didn't hear the band that came first and second and I can only presume that they must have got the music out of the piece even with a few slips. We put these bands on a pedistal as we know they are amazing but all I think Carina was saying was that she expected more. Obviously they are in a diffrerent league to Pemberton and thats why we expected more.. You can't complain as your band came in the top six !!! So be happy!!


Thank you joanne!! at the end of the day it is just my opinion. Why does everybody take these things so personally?? and what chiephonium is your problem with Pemberton?

sianybee24
13.03.2007, 19:06
I think I can explain why big al was so upset with the remarks placed on here recently. I think it's probably the same for everyone. I know we worked very hard on the piece and we felt we did an accurate, solid performance and having spoken to many people who heard us on the day, they thought we played well too. Yes we were disappointed with the result but I think it's time to move on from this. I have duties to both sellers and pemberton. The interpretations were different and I think we get stuck in how we believe a piece should sound, especially when it has been used before and your bashing it at rehearsals every night. I think we just need to accept people look for different things in music. I believe we did a grand job on the piece. Let's hope that we can all move on from this!

rach_tenor_horn
13.03.2007, 19:14
"les you had a day to remember, a 4th and a 1st, are you still recovering from the hangover you probably gave yourself from having about 20 celebratory drinks?! :D"

Thanks Clive, but I couldn't play for Timperley as it clashed with the 4th section, but I was there in spirit!(well when they read out the results anyway)

4th place was a pleasing result in the 4th section but as I am sure you are aware...When you miss out on qualification by one place, it's a gutted feeling as you were so close in travelling to the finals.

Well done to All the players in Eccles and a special word of thanks to Jim Davies on Percussion who, on one rehearsal, helped us out after being asked to step down from 3rd cornet due to too many cornet players at my disposal! A luxury indeed!

Also to Len Sharnock who helped us out on Eb bass after being well and truely landed in it by our less than reliable Eb bass player giving us just 10 days notice that he couldn't play at the next two contests! A conductors nightmare!!!

Anyhow Luckily it all turned out fine for the day. Congratulations to all the bands in the Northwest who qualified - Especially Formby in our section who won the contest off a number 1 draw - They must have been very good!:clap:

Les Webb
MD Eccles Borough Band

Thanks very much! All of us at Formby band are extremely pleased with the result to say the least!! It came as a complete shock! Just shows that all the hard work and rehearsals paid off! :tup

Chris Sanders
14.03.2007, 08:11
I heard every band at the Yorkshire Area, and I played in that section the past 5 years, so I know exactly how good the bands are there. I also heard 5 performances at the Northwest? I can honestly say I have not heard one performance of Isaiah that moved me?

I guess people just want the feeling I had hearing YBS playing tristan in 2004? I think thats what people are saying, not taking anything away from the standard of the bands or the quality of the piece, I just dont think it was the most outstanding of years contesting?



Mind you I missed Fodens and Leyland?

George Fairhurst
14.03.2007, 11:45
You have hit the nail on the head there SANDMAN. I was at the finals in London and listened to most of the bands that day when Isaiah 40 was the test piece. It has stuck in my mind what a fantastic piece of music it was how well most of the bands played it that day and kept me from leaving the hall to go to 'the mews' for refreshments. I also attended the Yorkshire and North West areas and can say that I wasn't exactly moved by the majority of the performances I listened to. Maybe I was expecting so much more from todays superstars!!!!! but hey it's just a contest and goes little way to paying the bills.

Ali
14.03.2007, 11:46
THey might not of moved you but can you honestly say that every band underestimated the piece?

Chris Sanders
14.03.2007, 12:28
THey might not of moved you but can you honestly say that every band underestimated the piece?

I dont think anybody ever underestimates the area piece?

The only thing I didnt like about Sellers was the horrible uniforms ;)

PeterBale
14.03.2007, 13:37
I heard every band at the Yorkshire Area, and I played in that section the past 5 years, so I know exactly how good the bands are there. I also heard 5 performances at the Northwest? I can honestly say I have not heard one performance of Isaiah that moved me?

I guess people just want the feeling I had hearing YBS playing tristan in 2004? I think thats what people are saying, not taking anything away from the standard of the bands or the quality of the piece, I just dont think it was the most outstanding of years contesting?

Mind you I missed Fodens and Leyland?

Not being there, it is hard to say, but is it possible that one factor is the fact that three of the Yorkshire bands had already qualified? I realise there is a lot of pride at stake regardless of qualification, but I'm sure it must make their preparations a little different.

Carina Halliwell
14.03.2007, 18:15
Look just to clarify what I am trying to say.....

I DO NOT and have NEVER SAID that the Yorkshire bands were rubbish I just said I was dissapointed as I did not enjoy the performances because none of them moved me! I felt that bands were just note bashing - technically fantastic, but no music.

I apologise if I have offended anybody but that is not what I aimed to do. This is supposed to be a forum where one can voice thier opinions, and I'm sorry but I don't want to be a sheep and say that all the bands were fantastic when I didn't think that at all.


Oh and by the way Pemberton got 7th on Sunday - reason being there were far too many slips and nervy playing!

andyp
14.03.2007, 18:40
Just been reminded last night - the 3rd section finals are on 29th Sept - my birthday!!
Will be some weekend :biggrin:

Grunt
15.03.2007, 00:17
THey might not of moved you but can you honestly say that every band underestimated the piece?

I don't think any band under estimated the task in store. Every band gave it's own individual account of the piece. Whilst it is good to compare performances in each of the areas ultimately the final result is the decision of one person (or two) on any given day, and bands WILL attempt to taylor their performance to what they believe individual adjudicators want to hear, hence a winning performance in Blackpool might not have been placed in Bradford and vice versa.

Much of banding is about setting goals. When you are in the lower sections, your goal is to get promotion ... and then get further promotion etc. Once you get to the higher sections and the competition is greater, it is about challenging the establishment and the "name" bands.

We (Milnrow) came 6th in the championship section, an improvement from 10th last year. That is progress for us and means that we live to fight another day in the championship section. Success is not just about coming first!

Well done to all the bands who qualified - go and do the North West proud!!

critic
15.03.2007, 07:04
I think I can explain why big al was so upset with the remarks placed on here recently. I think it's probably the same for everyone. I know we worked very hard on the piece and we felt we did an accurate, solid performance and having spoken to many people who heard us on the day, they thought we played well too. Yes we were disappointed with the result but I think it's time to move on from this. I have duties to both sellers and pemberton. The interpretations were different and I think we get stuck in how we believe a piece should sound, especially when it has been used before and your bashing it at rehearsals every night. I think we just need to accept people look for different things in music. I believe we did a grand job on the piece. Let's hope that we can all move on from this!

Well you deserved higher than 9th but there were a lot of good performances

Ali
15.03.2007, 09:14
I wasnt complaing about our result or saying we were hard done by. All I was miffed at was the comment that none of the bands took it seriously and that to anybody in any section is quite offensive.

sopranoplayer
15.03.2007, 11:43
Can anyone explain why 6 bands all got 6 points 3 years ago?


If so I make that Poynton?

1, Fodens 3 1 1 5
2, Leyland 1 3 2 6
3, Fairey 2 2 5 9
4, Wingates 4 4 3 11
5, BT 5 6 4 15
6, Dobx 6 5 5.5 16.5
7, Freck 6 7 9 22 =
7, Milnrow 6 10 6 22 =
7, Pem 7 8 7 22 =
10, Wire 6 6.5 10 22.5
11, Poynton 6 6.5 11 23.5
12, Haydock 11 9 5.5 25.5
13, Blackburn 6 12 8 26

Lauradoll
15.03.2007, 11:48
Because they are the bands which were promoted in those years/ year after so get average points for the years they didn't compete in that section. And then also the band that did come 6th.

Stix
15.03.2007, 12:06
we acutally did come 6th last year!! :):)

sopranoplayer
15.03.2007, 12:27
we acutally did come 6th last year!! :):)

Nope you were 3rd last year?

AndyCat
15.03.2007, 12:58
When a band enters any section they get average points for the previous year, regardless of their actual position in the previous section, therefore any one coming into the top section gets an average place of 6.5 or 6 depending on how many were in the section that particular year.

So the two promoted bands PLUS the band who actually came 6th get those points.

If you get demoted, the same applies, ie if there are 12 bands you'll get 6, 20 bands 10 etc.

sopranoplayer
15.03.2007, 13:07
When a band enters any section they get average points for the previous year, regardless of their actual position in the previous section, therefore any one coming into the top section gets an average place of 6.5 or 6 depending on how many were in the section that particular year.

So the two promoted bands PLUS the band who actually came 6th get those points.

If you get demoted, the same applies, ie if there are 12 bands you'll get 6, 20 bands 10 etc.

Cheers Andy,

So if 2 bands were promoted and 1 came 6th how come 6 bands got 6 points unless 4 bands were promoted? or am I missing something?

Chris Sanders
15.03.2007, 13:16
I think I may have given the bands that did not compete and average by mistake, but I am far too lazy too work it out correctly!!

tubaloopy
15.03.2007, 13:18
Cheers Andy,

So if 2 bands were promoted and 1 came 6th how come 6 bands got 6 points unless 4 bands were promoted? or am I missing something?

They were all in a lower section 3 years ago (except 1) but have subsequently been promoted so are given mid points for that year.

Chris Sanders
15.03.2007, 13:24
They were all in a lower section 3 years ago (except 1) but have subsequently been promoted so are given mid points for that year.

aye, looking again I think it was right, what he said...

sopranoplayer
15.03.2007, 13:30
I think I may have given the bands that did not compete and average by mistake, but I am far too lazy too work it out correctly!!


1, Fodens 3 1 1 5
2, Leyland 1 3 2 6
3, Fairey 2 2 5 9
4, Wingates 4 4 3 11
5, BT 5 6 4 15
6, Freck 6 7 9 22 =
6, Milnrow 6 10 6 22 =
6, Pem 7 8 7 22 =
7, Wire 6 6.5 10 22.5
8, Dobx 6 5 12 23
9, Poynton 6 6.5 11 23.5
10, B'burn 6 12 8 26
11, Haydock 11 9 12 32

Think I've done it right? not that its made any difference :rolleyes:

Stix
15.03.2007, 13:30
were we?? oh yeah, thats right. I get muddled up ALL THE TIME!! haha xx

AndyCat
15.03.2007, 13:36
1, Fodens 3 1 1 5
2, Leyland 1 3 2 6
3, Fairey 2 2 5 9
4, Wingates 4 4 3 11
5, BT 5 6 4 15
6, Freck 6 7 9 22 =
6, Milnrow 6 10 6 22 =
6, Pem 7 8 7 22 =
7, Wire 6 6.5 10 22.5
8, Dobx 6 5 12 23
9, Poynton 6 6.5 11 23.5
10, B'burn 6 12 8 26
11, Haydock 11 9 12 32

Think I've done it right? not that its made any difference :rolleyes:

Think that's what I got it too roughly, perhaps half a point here and there, but the same order. I'll check later.

sopranoplayer
15.03.2007, 13:45
Do you realise that if the bottom 8 had withdrawn we'd have all got 6 points :p .......gonna be a close bottom half section next year:cool:

joelrn
15.03.2007, 17:54
Do you realise that if the bottom 8 had withdrawn we'd have all got 6 points :p .......gonna be a close bottom half section next year:cool:

Does that mean if everyone withdraws we all go the nationals? ;)

PurpleHaze
16.03.2007, 23:48
Just read the write up of Sunday. It's really nice to read such positive feedback on the third section. I think there's something positive for every single band and hardly anything negative at all. :)

commadore
17.03.2007, 17:55
Its very interesting to wait a few days to see what people think about the results at the areas, and that is just what I have done! I go to these contests as a spectator, not a supporter but I am becoming increasingly disappointed in the quality of the results. Surely the competence of the adjudicator coupled with result in section one must come in to question? I sat there through all the first section bands and to put it bluntly, some of the placings were laughable. Apparently Roy Roe criticised some bands for tempos and dynamics? People may say that the conductors should have taken the hall in to account? What I say is that did the adjudicator take the hall in to account? When a first section band played with what I considered a "Big sound" it seems to me that Mr Roe thinks that because it is a first section band it is "overblowing", Wrong Mr Roe!. As for tempos, I think that playing the notes in a clear, musical way, no matter what tempo, is more important. One band that figured, who shall remain nameless, produced some of the worst playing of the day, with players actually stopping playing and putting thier instruments down and laughing!! Not to mention the soloists completely collapsing and general ensemble and band playing of a very poor standard! Lets be honest. Get some new blood to adjudicate! Its been said recently that people like David King should be approached? Bravo I say! there are too many top class performances going unnoticed for my liking and unfortunately the band press seem to be so sycophantic towards these "dinosaurs" and the band movement is suffering because of this. Lets move on and get real! Thats my rant over for this year! Well done to all the bands that qualified and best wishes for the finals. Our area IS of a higher standard that Yorkshire!!

Hells Bones
18.03.2007, 18:38
I heard a rumor that Boarshurst Silver are being relegated to the 4th section after they placing at the area in the 2nd section.

Is this true????? :eek:

Jeff_chick
18.03.2007, 19:05
Im with the band :)

Brian Kelly
18.03.2007, 19:33
I heard a rumor that Boarshurst Silver are being relegated to the 4th section after they placing at the area in the 2nd section.

Is this true????? :eek:

They can't be relegated from the 2nd section down to the 4th section.

If they are going to be relegated (and I don't know if they are or not), then they will go down to the 3rd section.

Hells Bones
18.03.2007, 19:38
That's what I thought but someone said that what I posted earlier today and it didn't sound right

horn1
19.03.2007, 09:20
Looks as if Boarshurst may be relagated from 2nd to 3rd section though.

Billyboy999
20.03.2007, 14:07
congratulations to all the qualifiers but, in particular, to Timperley who represent Trafford to an excellent standard, and also to Middleton - having heard the band on a number of occassions over the last few years the recent improvements have been immense and I am sure you will do great in Harrogate. I was really pleased with our performance (Flixton). The most dissappointing part of the day was that a band in our section saw fit to cheer and scream when we were placed 5th. This I thought was totally inappropriate and, to be perfectly honest, downright rude! Such a shame that success, especially at this level, can be tainted with that sort of arrogant attitude.


Bit suprised reading this. I seem to recall Flixton doing exactly the same a few of years ago only to come near the end. Tom O'Shanters Ride I believe.

Will the Sec
20.03.2007, 14:34
Its been said recently that people like David King should be approached? Bravo I say!

Bravo indeed, but what happens if David King makes decisions that you (or other persistent critics of adjudicators) don't like?

madsaz
20.03.2007, 20:19
It will always happen - someone is always upset. However - as long as those who could be believed to lack in credibility, say by the need to use a hearing aid (which overemphasises certain frequencies and cannot be a substitue for the real thing), are adjudicating, it gives the dissapointed bands more to moan about.

Its a credibility question - I am not saying some of the grand old men have no credibility - but clearly there comes a point when they are less able to discriminate by nature of their physical infirmaties i.e being deaf!

Even the great Jimmy Shepherd tells us he is now past top level contesting, prefering to enjoy his music instead. We know, as we tried to tempt him into the British Open to celebrate his 70th.

Grunt
20.03.2007, 22:48
For as long as there is banding there will be discussion about where bands are placed.

Whilst I agree that we should welcome some new faces into the box, even then not everybody will be happy with the results.

Do you want one, two or more adjudicators? If you have more than one should they confer? And so the quest for the perfect result goes on.

Contests are, more often than not, judged on the simplest things. Tempo markings, for example, are there for a reason and if a band goes wildly above or below a marking then they deserve to be marked down compared to the band that sticks to the marking, the same for dynamics. Add the various factors together and you have a result. (It sounds so somple!).

Yes, each adjudicator has his own preferences, but stick to the basics and you should get the result that you deserve - even if it's not the result you want!

kenbo
22.03.2007, 18:38
It will always happen - someone is always upset. However - as long as those who could be believed to lack in credibility, say by the need to use a hearing aid (which overemphasises certain frequencies and cannot be a substitue for the real thing), are adjudicating, it gives the dissapointed bands more to moan about.

Its a credibility question - I am not saying some of the grand old men have no credibility - but clearly there comes a point when they are less able to discriminate by nature of their physical infirmaties i.e being deaf!

Even the great Jimmy Shepherd tells us he is now past top level contesting, prefering to enjoy his music instead. We know, as we tried to tempt him into the British Open to celebrate his 70th.



I feel that I must point out to Madaz, a hearing impairment is neither an infirmity or physical difficulty, it is in fact a sensory loss. Some people with hearing loss may be more accutely tuned to various frequences us mere mortals my miss. Please never asume that somebody wearing an hearing aid has difficulty hearing everything, hearing difficulties are very different with everybody and that means people with a hearing difficulty hear things differently. Making assumptons is never a good idea.

madsaz
22.03.2007, 23:27
You are right - making assumptions is never a good idea. Just like you assume I have no insight into hearing impairment.

What I am absolutely certain of is that age related hearing loss - presbyacusis if you like - often involves significant loss of high frequency sound above all else - so the use of a hearing assistance device will not return hearing to "normal" ranges in all areas of frequency. This may mean the listener hears more bass than sop for instance.

Background noise can be defeating - so a very bouncy acoustic can be a further problem to the listener.

In a contest, many people argue about the result all the time. Nonetheless, however PC you want to be, using an adjudicator who by the very nature of their "sensory loss" cannot hear the band in the same way as the conductor (and therefore not hear the same performance as the conductor puts across) is in fact disabled - he in not enabled to do the job required. It doesn't matter if he hears other frequencies better, however advantageous that may be in other circumstances.

A contest relies on everyone hearing the same thing - that is why playing at a good venue such as the Symphony Hall is great - you know the whole auditorium gets the full performance.

Because this disability is due to a physical issue it is a physical difficulty. It may not mean the individual cannot enjoy music, but they are being set apart as the expert.

It is hard enough to agree with adjudicators, without the over-riding feeling they did not even hear the same performance. As my boyfriend points out, you wouldn't have much time for a blind Art Critic, but you wouldn't deny them entry to an art gallery.

Cheers,

Sara.

P.s. Yes, I do know Beethoven was deaf. I gather Paganini probably had Marfans syndrome too. Isn't that interesting?

andylockett86
23.03.2007, 01:13
[quote=madsaz;523141]
In a contest, many people argue about the result all the time. Nonetheless, however PC you want to be, using an adjudicator who by the very nature of their "sensory loss" cannot hear the band in the same way as the conductor (and therefore not hear the same performance as the conductor puts across) is in fact disabled - he in not enabled to do the job required. It doesn't matter if he hears other frequencies better, however advantageous that may be in other circumstances.

totally agree with you. there's loads of stuff on internet that proves hearing aids simply can't be good things for adjudicators to wear. one that i read said..........the only good hearing aid would be one which reads your mind and listens to exactly what you wan to hear!

mfearn
23.03.2007, 13:58
congratulations to all the qualifiers but, in particular, to Timperley who represent Trafford to an excellent standard, and also to Middleton - having heard the band on a number of occassions over the last few years the recent improvements have been immense and I am sure you will do great in Harrogate. I was really pleased with our performance (Flixton). The most dissappointing part of the day was that a band in our section saw fit to cheer and scream when we were placed 5th. This I thought was totally inappropriate and, to be perfectly honest, downright rude! Such a shame that success, especially at this level, can be tainted with that sort of arrogant attitude.


I would just like to add that i can also remember times as a player at flixton when we had cheered at another bands position, it is quite common and from it you should take it as, fair enough lets go and win it next time.

Bunnymonster
23.03.2007, 14:23
I am intrigued to know why (as I understand it) experienced musicians are prevented from becoming adjudicators due to visual impairment if this is not extended to hearing loss.

kenbo
23.03.2007, 15:25
Thanks to Madaz for their comments.

I understand where you are coming from. :D


Beethoven, original. :rolleyes: :woo


Sorry couldn't resist.
Kenbo

andegg
18.04.2007, 19:03
After the recent area contest I wrote on behalf of my band to the NWABBA expressing our concerns over the current adjudication situation at the North West Areas. I made a couple of points concerning the number and quality of adjudicator’s at this year’s area. Judging by various comments appearing here and on 4barsrest we are far from alone in believing that the current situation must change.
I received a reply from Peter Bates today and I was amazed and, quite frankly, disappointed to discover that we are the only band so far to write to the committee about adjudication. As Peter said in his reply “A lot has been written on 4barsrest but as this has not been sent to the Regional Committee there is nothing that can be done. People need to express their opinions direct to the Committee involved in running the event and not via a public media”.

We all find the time and trouble to put in the hours of practice required to rehearse the area test piece. Surely 10 minutes can be spared by one representative of each band to write to the organisers if we feel so strongly about this issue. Unless you want to be in the same post area situation next year (i.e. writing on 4barsrest and here bemoaning the state of the contest), I suggest all bands who are unhappy with the current system put pen to paper and please write to their regional committee. The next meeting of the NWABBA Championships Committee is on the 11th May, so you have nearly three weeks to write those letters.



Andrea Egginton

andegg
19.04.2007, 08:18
The address to write to is:
North West Regional Brass Band Championships Committee,
Secretary - Peter Bates,
643a Liverpool Road,
Peel Green,
Eccles,
M30 7BY

Thanks

Andrea Egginton

AndyCat
19.04.2007, 12:18
The address to write to is:
North West Regional Brass Band Championships Committee,
Secretary - Peter Bates,
643a Liverpool Road,
Peel Green,
Eccles,
M30 7BY

Thanks

Andrea Egginton

Andrea's absolutely right, if all we do is moan on here and elsewhere, nothing will change!

My letter is now in the post!

les
19.04.2007, 14:14
"Andrea's absolutely right, if all we do is moan on here and elsewhere, nothing will change!

My letter is now in the post!"

I shall also be instructing our contest secretary to send a letter expressing how, in the 4th section in the North West, can we only be granted ONE adjudicator for 19 bands, where as in Scotland, they are treated to TWO for only 5 bands if my memory serves me correctly!

No matter how good one adjudicator is, I feel there are only so many bands just one ear can listen to!

I struggled to listen to 12 bands at the yorkshire area, none of which in my opinion would have been placed in the top 4 in our area! and I believe myself to be a pretty keen musician and a good few years younger than our adjudicator, John Maines, who I thought did a good job trying to judge so many bands...He looked a bit shell shocked at the end of the day, but who could blame him!

Les Webb
MD Eccles Borough Band