Football World Cup [Archive] - theMouthPiece.com

Bigenglandfan

03.03.2006, 02:44

So have we picked our tMP England starting line-up yet? I've been tipping Carrick to be a world cup starter for about 3 years. I saw him play for west ham at that time. Everyone was talking about Joe Cole then, and to me, although I liked what I saw in Cole, Carrick looked even classier. Gerrard is a great player, but he dosn't play the holding role as well as Carrick and so it's a straight choice between Gerrard and Lampard for the attacking midfield role. I'll choose Lampard.
Ferdinand continues to be a racehorse who can play like a donkey so it's a Terry/ King partnership for me. Full backs are our weakness but you have to pick specialists in the positions (not.. oh dear, Ferdinand/gerrard/SWP are good players, we'll see if they can play left-back).
I presume that the Rooney/Owen partnership won't cause too many arguments.

So that leaves me with

Robinson; Neville(Gary); King; Terry: Bridge (if Ashley Cole is unfit); Beckham; Carrick; Lampard; Joe Cole; Rooney: Owen

How does that look to you? I think they could do very nicely.

DublinBass

03.03.2006, 06:29

Everyone was talking about Joe Cole then, and to me, although I liked what I saw in Cole, Carrick looked even classier.

Agreed. Especially as a Chelsea supporter I have been disappointed with Cole's production the past 12 months or so.

Gerrard is a great player, but he dosn't play the holding role as well as Carrick and so it's a straight choice between Gerrard and Lampard for the attacking midfield role. I'll choose Lampard.

I would choose Lampard over Gerrard, but I would rather have them both on the pitch.

I presume that the Rooney/Owen partnership won't cause too many arguments.

I'll admit I don't like Rooney, but mostly because of his off field antics. I just can't abide him represent a kingdom as great as England.

Robinson; Neville(Gary); King; Terry: Bridge (if Ashley Cole is unfit); Beckham; Carrick; Lampard; Joe Cole; Rooney: Owen

This might confuse poor Beckham a bit (as he probably thinks a 4-4-2 with a goalie only adds up to 10 and there should be a space for him) but I'd go with

Whomever in goal...doesn't really matter, they're all naff;
Neville, Carragher, Terry, Bridge;
Gerrard, Carrick, Lampard, Cole;
Defoe and Owen

Dave Payn

03.03.2006, 10:57

Whilst England aren't a one man team, I think their chances of having a decent tournament will depend on Rooney's fitness.

In the Uruguay friendly, people were saying England played 'better' after Beckham came off. I think England played more 'to their strengths'. In the first half, England seemed to be trying to play a more 'continental' passing game and it wasn't paying off. It was a more direct style which suits England better that got the win. Let's face it, having seen the video of the 1966 World Cup Final and tournament, you'd hardly say that they were a classy passing side even then. Germany aren't exactly exponents of 'the beautiful game' compared to Brazil but they've had more successes in tournaments simply by playing to their strenghts. If England revert to 'type' and stop listening to the football journos who've never played the game at any decent level who bemoan what brilliant football Brazil play compared to England we might get something out of this. If they get caught in two minds between being a free flowing passing team and the usual more direct English style, they'll be coming home early.

In any case, I can't see any other team than Brazil winning it at the moment. Or Trinidad and Tobago. ;)

andywooler

03.03.2006, 11:09

. In the first half, England seemed to be trying to play a more 'continental' passing game and it wasn't paying off.

And that was part of the problem - I though Gerrard in particular was misplacing too many passes and for me, wasn't missed when he left the pitch.

Everyone was talking about Joe Cole then, and to me, although I liked what I saw in Cole, Carrick looked even classier

Can't agree with that - Joe was imho clearly the MOTM. Having watched a lot of both of them at West Ham, Cole is much more consistent. One good game doesn't make Carrick class!

I would choose Lampard over Gerrard
I'm with you on that one!

Finally, in case anyone thinks I see too much ex Claret & Blue in this team, I thought Ferdinand was very average in the game and could have cost us a couple of goals.
(It won't be long before his brother ousts him from the team!)

Dave Payn

03.03.2006, 11:14

Finally, in case anyone thinks I see too much ex Claret & Blue in this team, I thought Ferdinand was very average in the game and could have cost us a couple of goals.
(It won't be long before his brother ousts him from the team!)

I disagree. Ferdinand wasn't average. He was poor! (No this ISN'T an anti Man U rant! He was excellent at the last World Cup but his form has dipped). Campbell's not really going to be in the equation by the looks of it, so I guess the first choice central defenders should be Terry and King for me.

andywooler

03.03.2006, 11:22

I guess the first choice central defenders should be Terry and King for me.
With you on that one!

On a slightly different aspect of this tournament, I'm planning on going out to Köln for the Sweden game, don't have match tickets but plan to enjoy the atmosphere with some Swedish ex colleagues of mine.
Anyone up for a tMp band in Köln on the day of the England Sweden match?

Dave Payn

03.03.2006, 11:30

Going slightly OT myself.... the next England manager.....

Well, the manager when England won the World Cup was Alf Ramsey who previously guided Ipswich to the championship. In terms of World Cup placings, our next most successful manager was Bobby Robson (also ex Ipswich.....)

OK, so who's the current Ipswich manager.... Joe Royle.

Ah...now there, my masterplan falls down. Oh well, it seemed like a good idea at the time..... ;)

andywooler

03.03.2006, 11:39

Going slightly OT myself.... the next England manager.....

Sir Trevor & Stuart Pearce get my money.

Dave Payn

03.03.2006, 11:42

Sir Trevor & Stuart Pearce get my money.

Who's Sir Trevor Pearce? ;)

Anyway, back on topic. How do tMP-ers rate the host nation's chances, particularly in light of the 4-1 drubbing Italy handed out to them in midweek?

Rapier

03.03.2006, 11:44

I wouldn't pick ANY Neville for a kickabout in the park! Beckam would be dropped from my squad, as would Ferdinand. Not on current form. Crouch would get a seat on the bench, but only get on if they really needed him. Sean Wright Phillips would be in my starting line up.

Still all said and done, it is only football and not a game that really matters (like Rugby, or Womens Beach Volleyball. ) ;)

andywooler

03.03.2006, 11:45

Who's Sir Trevor Pearce? ;)

You might better know him as Lord Brooking of Green Street

IYOUNG

03.03.2006, 11:45

And that was part of the problem - I though Gerrard in particular was misplacing too many passes and for me, wasn't missed when he left the pitch.

Can't agree with that - Joe was imho clearly the MOTM. Having watched a lot of both of them at West Ham, Cole is much more consistent. One good game doesn't make Carrick class!

I'm with you on that one!

Finally, in case anyone thinks I see too much ex Claret & Blue in this team, I thought Ferdinand was very average in the game and could have cost us a couple of goals.
(It won't be long before his brother ousts him from the team!)

Crumbs a football forum and i'm agreeing with everything said.....whatever next

Andy - comments like this about the great SG will get you shot, good job wev'e moved from the Liverpool FC thread.

SG has been misplacing passes for years for England, people are easily fooled when 1 or 2 good ones appear, which in all fairness do happen.

as for Rio, very talented but will end up going the same way as David James.

My Xi would be

Robinson

Neville
Terry
King
Cole or Bridge or......anyone but Phil Neville (not sure if Konchesky is really up to it)

Beckham
Lampard
Carrick
Cole

Rooney
Owen

Take 5 strikers as Alan Mullery and trevor francis said yesterday goals win you games, you don't need 2 left backs and jamie Carragher for example

andywooler

03.03.2006, 11:50

(not sure if Konchesky is really up to it)
Take 5 strikers as Alan Mullery and trevor francis said yesterday goals win you games, you don't need 2 left backs and jamie Carragher for example

Agreed - Konchesky is too inconsistent for me at the moment. If we need anyone from WHU, it ought to be Etherington who has really shown his talent since leaving Spurs.

I also liked Pardew's idea of having Teddy Sheringham around the team somehwere - never had pace to lose so age doesn't matter so much (coming off the bench when we're in the ****!)

Cornishwomble

03.03.2006, 13:10

Who's Sir Trevor Pearce? ;)

Anyway, back on topic. How do tMP-ers rate the host nation's chances, particularly in light of the 4-1 drubbing Italy handed out to them in midweek?
I wouldn't underestimate them, they were pants in the lead up to the last World cup and still made the final. They are one of the good tournament sides!

Don't know if anyone read last month's 442 but they ran an article where they ran the world cup on Football manager 2006 and after 3 runs it was Germany Vs England every time, and England won it twice!

Thirteen Ball

03.03.2006, 13:11

Agreed - Konchesky is too inconsistent for me at the moment. If we need anyone from WHU, it ought to be Etherington who has really shown his talent since leaving Spurs.

Isn't he a natural left-sider as well?

How come he's not been given a crack? I know Joe cole's got the side locked down now, but surely he's worth having around just in case someone clatters Joe and injures him. (Paul robinson, for example!)

If Ashley Cole's not fit, Carragher has to start at LB for me. Never looked flustered, very composed, and can get forward to support as well.

I disagree that Carrick is better at the holding midfield role than Steven Gerrard. The problem is getting gerrard to STAY in that role. He likes to bomb forward and create, so however good he is at the role, it doesn't suit him. I don't honestly believe you can play Gerrard and Lampard in the same team without another defensive-minded midfielder, as neither is likely to cover back for the other when one goes forward. With cole having locked down the left side of midfield, it looks to me like beckham has to go, or either one of lampard or gerrard.

Owen and Rooney in attack without doubt.

King and Terry at the back. Campbell can't seriously be considered and Rio's just had too many howlers for me. It's a shame cos he was great at the last world cup but just isn't cutting it.

Ashley cole if he's fit, even though he goes missing when defending sometimes, Carragher if he isn't. Neville at right back, cos he can cross, overlap and knows when to cover back.

Gotta be robinson in net. Why calamity James even gets a seat on the bench is beyond me. Just hopeless.

IYOUNG

03.03.2006, 13:17

Isn't he a natural left-sider as well?

How come he's not been given a crack? I know Joe cole's got the side locked down now, but surely he's worth having around just in case someone clatters Joe and injures him. (Paul robinson, for example!)

If Ashley Cole's not fit, Carragher has to start at LB for me. Never looked flustered, very composed, and can get forward to support as well.

I disagree that Carrick is better at the holding midfield role than Steven Gerrard. The problem is getting gerrard to STAY in that role. He likes to bomb forward and create, so however good he is at the role, it doesn't suit him. I don't honestly believe you can play Gerrard and Lampard in the same team without another defensive-minded midfielder, as neither is likely to cover back for the other when one goes forward. With cole having locked down the left side of midfield, it looks to me like beckham has to go, or either one of lampard or gerrard.

Owen and Rooney in attack without doubt.

King and Terry at the back. Campbell can't seriously be considered and Rio's just had too many howlers for me. It's a shame cos he was great at the last world cup but just isn't cutting it.

Ashley cole if he's fit, even though he goes missing when defending sometimes, Carragher if he isn't. Neville at right back, cos he can cross, overlap and knows when to cover back.

Gotta be robinson in net. Why calamity James even gets a seat on the bench is beyond me. Just hopeless.

Why hasn't Etherington had a crack? same for gareth barry and others i'm afraid, SGE just won't risk it.

I haven't witnessed Gerrard bombing forward as you describe it for England, maybe he is instructed otherwise in which case he is wasted.

Watching the campbell story with interest, if fit and ready still a good bet in my view.

Undoubtedly gary Neville is the best right back we have.

And as previously said never under estimate those Germans

Ian

will enderby

03.03.2006, 13:27

dosnt wayn rooney think we are in with a good chance of the world cup this year what do you all think you think we got the winning team ?

Thirteen Ball

03.03.2006, 13:45

It's certainly possible, If we're strong as a unit, like the germans are every tournament.

If you're strong as a unit, and everyone sticks to their job, you can do well. Greece proved that at the euros. Make a plan and stick to it. If the other team doesn't find an answer, they can't beat you.

Give or take the odd 35-yard top corner shot from some uraguayan! What a hit that was!

PeterBale

03.03.2006, 14:22

Whilst most people seem to agree on Owen up front, I just wonder whether he will have had long enough to get back after his latest injury. We don't want to find ourselves back in the Bryan Robson situation of relying on a player who then breaks down early in the tournament. If fit, I'd definitely go for Rooney/Owen, but can we afford to take the risk?

will enderby

03.03.2006, 14:24

you watch the match then on wednesday i thort it was boring beckham made a few good crosses i didnt see any of the goals tho any good who scored ?

Thirteen Ball

03.03.2006, 14:24

Cantonian

03.03.2006, 14:38

Lampard and Gerrard can play in the same team with a holding midfielder (Carrick) if Beckham doesn't play. He is not worth his place currently.

Thirteen Ball

03.03.2006, 15:00

Lampard and Gerrard can play in the same team with a holding midfielder (Carrick) if Beckham doesn't play. He is not worth his place currently.

Yup, like I said. Gerrard would have to provide the width on the right as I don't recall ever seeing Lamps stray to within 20 yards of either wing touchline, but he's well capable of that and hits a great cross. Even if he tucks in a bit, neville's a great crosser of the ball as well.

But to play the two of them, beckham has to go.... unless you convince Gerrard not to go further than the edge of the centre circle, and do the enforcer's job. And while he can do that job brilliantly, it's a complete waste of his other talents.

Bigenglandfan

03.03.2006, 18:17

My Xi would be

Robinson

Neville
Terry
King
Cole or Bridge or......anyone but Phil Neville (not sure if Konchesky is really up to it)

Beckham
Lampard
Carrick
Cole

Rooney
Owen

You've picked the same side as me Mr Young, I reckon we must be on the right track.

Bigenglandfan

03.03.2006, 18:21

I disagree that Carrick is better at the holding midfield role than Steven Gerrard. The problem is getting gerrard to STAY in that role.

Which automatically means that Carrick is better, cos the job of the "holding" midfielder is to............ hold!

ian perks

03.03.2006, 19:00

Only 1 team in it for me BRAZIL:clap:
Just pure class, icant see them been beat at all.
As for England yes will get through first stage then i think its
GET THE NEXT PLANE HOME LADS:biggrin:

ian perks

03.03.2006, 19:06

Crumbs a football forum and i'm agreeing with everything said.....whatever next

Andy - comments like this about the great SG will get you shot, good job wev'e moved from the Liverpool FC thread.

SG has been misplacing passes for years for England, people are easily fooled when 1 or 2 good ones appear, which in all fairness do happen.

as for Rio, very talented but will end up going the same way as David James.

My Xi would be

Robinson

Neville
Terry
King
Cole or Bridge or......anyone but Phil Neville (not sure if Konchesky is really up to it)

Beckham
Lampard
Carrick
Cole

Rooney
Owen

Take 5 strikers as Alan Mullery and trevor francis said yesterday goals win you games, you don't need 2 left backs and jamie Carragher for example
So you would leave out SUPER STEVE GERRARD :biggrin:
Sorry have to disagree with you as a LIVERPOOL FAN but it would be Goodbye Carrick:clap:

Bigenglandfan

04.03.2006, 03:23

I don't honestly believe you can play Gerrard and Lampard in the same team without another defensive-minded midfielder, as neither is likely to cover back for the other when one goes forward. With cole having locked down the left side of midfield, it looks to me like beckham has to go, or either one of lampard or gerrard.

I agree with you 100%. However, is there anyone out there who honestly believes that SGE has got the guts to tell Beckham (and all his agents, publicists, sponsors ect,ect) that we don't need him as captain anymore and his new job is as a benchwarmer??

Chris Sanders

04.03.2006, 09:54

What More Does Nolan Have To Do To Get A Chance?? He's Immense!!

I hate the way Svens squads are a popularity contest picked from the back page of the sun. Neville is a waste of space, his mother should be ashamed of herself, at City we have two better young players for the position in Onouha and Richards, and im sure there are plenty more budding right backs elsewhere??

Rio is a disgrace, he's cocky, arrogant and lazy, he never uses the ball progressivly, he just feeds it backwards to either Robinson or Terry, and when he does try to push forward he embarrasses himself like the other night??

Joe Cole deserves to start this summer, he has great vision and along with swp on the right wing will give us a wide attacking force with great options on both wings as well as having Lampard down the centre (provided we can find someone better than Rio to feed to him)

I believe experience means nothing when a younger player will give you 110% pace and energy...

Andy_Euph

04.03.2006, 10:20

Totally agree with you Chris, Rio was a joke the other night, making simple errors that you wouldn't even find in a schoolboy game! I thought Darren Bent deserves a place in the squad after the other night, his work rate was good and he was let down by the likes of Beckham and Neville either not playing him the ball or them putting up duff crosses.

Chris Sanders

04.03.2006, 10:27

Bigenglandfan

04.03.2006, 17:19

The best thing about being a Leeds fan, who lives overseas, is that you get to watch all the prem games as a strictly neutral. Just watched Fulham - Arsenal and the gunners were back to looking like the "team that can't be beaten". They absolutely tookthe mickey out of Fulham who had won 8 of their last 9 home games. Terry Henry looked like the best player on the planet.

Earlier on I watched the Chelsea game gainst W Brom.. very ordinary..including some of the players I picked for my prospective England World Cup team.

Got to go now, the Liverpool game kicked off 2 minutes ago. Will Gerard pursuade me that he is a better bet for the England midfield than the 4 players that I have picked??

madandcrazytromboneguy

15.03.2006, 22:16

ABSOLUTELY NO CHANCE!

england are the most overhyped country in football!

england NEVER! play the players who are on form

we should play the gk's who assist in creating the most clean sheets

we should pick defenders who are notoriusly solid, dont make silly mistakes to allow opposition players to score goals

we should choose the midfielders who have a mixture of creativity, 1s who constantly give good service to both the front and back lines, 1s who can change a game for us!

and as for the strikers!, the 1s who score the most goals in a season should be picked, and if you can mix it with both small pacey 1s with big target guys, then you are then on for a winning squad!

players are picked for their big name or the big name club they play for, this isnt right!

theres so many good players who arent gettin a chance at all, maybe even players outside of the premiership!. the regulars are all still playing in all the friendlys, when they should be used as a chance for the more fringe players to prove themselves!

SURELY! there will be someone who will agree with me on this 1, ANYONE?!

Steve

15.03.2006, 22:19

Stop the interviews!!!! We have found our man. Step aside Curbs / ONeil / Psycho / McClaren!

madandcrazytromboneguy

15.03.2006, 22:43

in all seriousness steve, they should leave m.o'n alone, he is looking after his wife who is still recovering, why can't they leave the poor bloke alone, they dont give a toss about them and their health, they are just baying for blood, and his coachin services, it aint right i dont think, he said he would come back to footy when he's good and ready!

Steve

15.03.2006, 22:47

And what better position than one that doesnt involve daily training and running of a club? Im sure if he isnt interested he will turn it down.

madandcrazytromboneguy

15.03.2006, 23:07

in terms of the squad i would consider picking, well that is about as random as it comes isnt it

paul robinson for me is clearly the most consistant GK england have, and i'd be more than happy for anyone to argue with that decision

right back is an interesting 1, is gary neville really the best we can hope for?, if he is, then the world cup teams just need a good left winger, and we will be ******ed lol. i think boltons nicky hunt would do an excellent job for us, he's been great for bolton this season and at his fairly young age, if he can keep a regular place in 1 of the premierships most improving team, and he can keep some real quality right wingers at bay, like he has done in the premiership, then he could well get a call up.

left back, if ashley cole and wayne bridge were both fully fit, they would be the obvious choices, is there anyone with better fitness who would do a better job?, hopefully those 2 will get fit so they get called up.

centre backs, we are blessed with some very good centre backs, not just in the premiership, the championship has some rock solid centre backs who give in my opinion, more metal to the game, but if they were all fit, im guessin that the centre backs would be campbell, terry, ferdinand, and woodgate. i'll be honest and say that a combo of any of those 4 would be solid enough i think, but all 4 MUST be fully fit!

right wingers, beckham is lazy!, if england can find a decent dead ball taker who can also provide a decent cross, then beckham will not be the 1st choice right winger, or not in my squad!, shaun wright phillips has great pace, good skills, works hard, and would probably get the position for me, and then theres youngsters like aaron lennon and nathan dyer, again, both blessed with pace to burn, and some good skills also!

left winger, well this is a tough 1, stu downing would be the obvious choice for his natural left sidedness lol, i think that if ash cole and wayne bridge are both on the left side as the back and winger, then they could do a job together, altho downing would get my vote.

centre mids!, this is a fun position, can lampard and gerrard work as the ideal pairing that we all want them to be?, or do they have some SERIOUS competition?, yes they do, boltons kevin nolan has been superb this season!, he can attack, he can defend, he can cross and pass, he can be a captain, WHAT MORE DO YA WANT IN A MIDFIELDER! lol, joe cole has obvious talent, and i think he's more useful in the middle rather than the wing, carrick also has some talent, altho can be a little inconsistant on occasion, centre midfield is probably the most healthiest positions that england have at their disposal, not much doubt there in my mind!

and now, UPFRONT!, what a dilemma, england is blessed with talented strikers, BUT, can we find the right 2 man combo?, theres obvious players like rooney, owen, defoe, crouch, etc, BUT, 1 thing that we do have, is a good number of good consistant goalscorers, besides them 4, whoelse might have a chance?, darren bent, james beattie has recently hit form, marlon harewood hasnt let the hammers down this season, nathan ellington hit amazing form last season with wigan, and its a shame he aint hit it off with west brom yet, and talking of the championship, dave kitson and leroy lita of reading, rob hulse, robbie blake, richard cresswell, all very consistant for leeds this season, ashley young at watford has been at his best, HELL WE ARE BLESSED WITH GOALS GALORE HERE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :D

with the talent england does have individually, we should be 1 of the favourites, but we aint picking the right players at the right times and this is whats letting us down, in my opinion!

jingleram

15.03.2006, 23:15

right wingers, beckham is lazy!, if england can find a decent dead ball taker who can also provide a decent cross, then beckham will not be the 1st choice right winger, or not in my squad!, shaun wright phillips has great pace, good skills, works hard, and would probably get the position for me, and then theres youngsters like aaron lennon and nathan dyer, again, both blessed with pace to burn, and some good skills also!

Kieren Dyer?

madandcrazytromboneguy

15.03.2006, 23:17

if he wanted it, he would have applied, not them approach him!

SIMPLE AS!

no i did mean nathan dyer, he's a young lad at southampton, but yeah i had forgotten k.dyer, another player with some talent, if he's fit, he'd get in my squad i think

also, i said youngsters, k.dyer aint so young now, he's late 20's now i think, could be wrong, 26, 27, or 28 i think k.dyer is, nathan dyer is still only 19 or 20 i think

Steve

15.03.2006, 23:23

Never been head hunted Clive? Maybe he got a mate to apply for him? If he wasnt slightly interested then Im sure he would have made a statement by now, the job doesnt start for a few months anyway!

jingleram

15.03.2006, 23:24

Okay my mistake, sorry!

Thirteen Ball

17.03.2006, 18:05

So you would leave out SUPER STEVE GERRARD :biggrin:

Yes, unless we've got Thierry Henry up front, and Stevie G can pick him out with a great over the shoulder ball like he did for liverpool the other week! ;)

Funny thing is, that's not the first howler he's pulled off. It's just the first one he's not got away with.

Sorry have to disagree with you as a LIVERPOOL FAN but it would be Goodbye Carrick:clap:

England need a defensive-minded midfielder, as the full-backs are expected to push on, and Rio goes missing far too much. Drop Rio + make him the tea boy, Campbell and Terry in the centre (or Woodgate and terry if Woody's fit) and Carrick in front of them.

I'll admit, Gerrard is a better tackler and a better passer than Carrick, and arguably has better vision, so can probably do that role better.... but he won't. Every time Sven's tried to deploy him in a deeper role, he's gone bombing forward and left a massive gap in front of the centre halves. He can't be trusted to do what he's told, so someone who can should play.

Like a band, balance is everything. Don't try and squash players in to fit a system. Pick your system, then pick the best players that fit that system. Even if it means leaving quality out for the sake of balance.

A good player in his right position is better than a superstar OUT of position.

madandcrazytromboneguy

17.03.2006, 21:41

if all english players were fit

who would be your 1st 11?

if all are fit, this is svens predicted 1st 11

gk - paul robinson
dl - ashley cole
dr - gary neville
dc - rio ferdinand
dc - john terry
ml - joe cole
mr - david beckham
mc - frank lampard
mc - stephen gerrard
st - michael owen
st - wayne rooney

for me, robbo in goal would have to stay, no one else can touch him for either form or ability in my opinion

ashley cole if he's fit would stay, although wayne bridge aint a bad replacement if he can get fit aswell

gary neville has to go!, luke young seems to have been svens 2nd choice right back, but i'd choose nicky hunt of bolton, has been in good form (despite the howler against west ham, although lets face it, every player contributes to a howler now and again), and has obvious ability

dc's is easy coz you'd just pick the fittest and most consistant pairing out of the big 4 - terry, campbell, ferdinand, woodgate

ml, no contest, stewart downing is englands only natural left footed left winger, and he's young, and has talent and ability

right wing is a young area like the left side in that i think s.w.p. and the even younger aaron lennon sould be given a chance ahead of beckham

i'd like to see sven try some totally different centre mid pairings. he's tried lampard and gerrard and for the majority, are a good enough pairing, but theres loadsa other options!, joe cole, kevin nolan, danny murphy, michael carrick, kieron dyer, jermaine jenas, michael brown, james milner, lee hendrie, GOD THE LIST GOES ON!

upfront, we are blessed with good strikers, INDIVIDUALLY!, but not as a pairing. sven has had loadsa chances to try out strike pairings and he's wasted them!, on top of the obvious owen rooney combo, theres crouch, darren bent, james beattie, jermaine defoe, maybe even marlon harewood or dean ashton. personally i'd just see who has scored the most goals at the end of the season and put them in the squad!

and as a try out, why not pick a friendly against a decent country, and field a squad totally of none premiership/other top divison players. the talent in the championship and even lower than that is really promising and its only coz they arent playin against rich people that they arent getting picked, they should be given a chance to see what they are all about!, thats a point, what squad would you pick of players out of the premiership?

leeds united have ian bennett, frazer richardson, matty kilgallon, simon walton, sean gregan, dan harding, sean derry, danny pugh, ian moore, robbie blake, richard cresswell, and rob hulse, ALL ENGLISH!

many other championship clubs have good english players, even some who have an england cap to their name already, rob green and andy johnson for example

lets face reality, the squad has too many lightweights, who should replace them?

Chris Sanders

17.03.2006, 21:46

leeds united have ian bennett, frazer richardson, matty kilgallon, simon walton, sean gregan, dan harding, sean derry, danny pugh, ian moore, robbie blake, richard cresswell, and rob hulse, ALL ENGLISH!

and how many are WORLD CLASS

get a grip

inexperienced players would be eaten alive at the world cup

dyl

17.03.2006, 21:56

dc's is easy coz you'd just pick the fittest and most consistant pairing out of the big 4 - terry, campbell, ferdinand, woodgate

I may be biased, being a Liverpool fan, but I find it shocking that people aren't considering Carragher for a spot - did you guys not see his exploits in the Champs League last season? Not much would get past Carra and Terry I'm sure. Mind you, being Welsh, I'd much rather see a centre-half pairing of Bramble and Ferdinand! ;)

lynchie

17.03.2006, 22:33

I don't see why people would consider dropping Gary Neville... he's been excellent for club and country for years, and can still put in a good cross. He's had experience at the top level that most of the guys being touted here just don't have, and come through it very strong.

And as for Beckham... I think his publicity and former club have clouded some people's judgement. He's still one of the most accurate passers of the ball I've seen, is still hitting brilliant free kicks, and has established himself as a key player at probably the biggest club in the world.

Then again, Ireland didn't qualify so I'll be watching as a slightly depressed neutral.

madandcrazytromboneguy

17.03.2006, 22:33

and how many are WORLD CLASS

get a grip

inexperienced players would be eaten alive at the world cup

you get a grip!, how can they gain experience if they aint given a chance!

madandcrazytromboneguy

17.03.2006, 22:35

madandcrazytromboneguy

17.03.2006, 22:37

I may be biased, being a Liverpool fan, but I find it shocking that people aren't considering Carragher for a spot - did you guys not see his exploits in the Champs League last season? Not much would get past Carra and Terry I'm sure. Mind you, being Welsh, I'd much rather see a centre-half pairing of Bramble and Ferdinand! ;)

wouldnt play carragher in the centre, maybe right back

bramble is a wasted talent, he could be good but playing for newcastle aint done him any good at all

Tom-King

17.03.2006, 22:39

errmmm....
maybe its just me - but people are complaining about Gerrard not being able to play deep - and have mixed feelings about Carrick (ok he has his days but i have to admit im not a fan) - whats wrong with Scott Parker?!? Played brilliantly for Newcastle this year - consistent hard worker, which is what you need in that position surely?

madandcrazytromboneguy

17.03.2006, 22:45

talking of the world cup overall, who would be in your WORLD SQUAD?!

also, which country do you think has quality in all 11 positions?, for me, has to be italy, question is, can they all work as a team?

brazil have the strikers and midfield, but gk and defence are a bit inconsistant, probably the same for argentina too

spain arent all that strong in defence either, but again, some good quality in midfield and upfront

holland are very strong just about throught all 11 positions, but like italy, can they play as a team?

it might be fair to say that there isnt a totally unstoppable team coz some are excellent team grafters but lack some individual quality, others are superb individually, but can't work as a team at all!

madandcrazytromboneguy

17.03.2006, 22:47

madandcrazytromboneguy

17.03.2006, 22:49

just 1 little point about the championship players

peter taylor recently picked an under 21 squad which included NO premiership players at all!

you talk about all the great young quality england have, WELL ITS IN THE CHAMPIONSHIP!

(or a lot of it starts outside of the premiership, and then gets dragged into the prem. via a cash filled contract from a club with money!)

chizzum

17.03.2006, 22:58

Robinson
Neville Carragher Terry Cole/Bridge
Beckham King J.Cole
Gerrard Lampard
Rooney

chizzum

17.03.2006, 23:01

Bigenglandfan

18.03.2006, 02:18

Chris Sanders

18.03.2006, 10:30

We have not yet seen a decent England performance when Beckham, Lampard and Gerrard have all been playing.

Agreed, two great players (and Beckham), cant work together though??

My Team;

Robinson /(i cant understand why DJ is class week in week out then abismal for his country?)

(position vacant - appy within)/Carragher / Terry / Bridge

SWP/Gerrard or Lampard (prob Frank?) / King / Cole

Rooney /(Owen/Crouch?)

Manager - Big Sam (Can create winning performances and manage resources without funds)

Coach - Pearce (only coach so he can stay with City)

lynchie

18.03.2006, 15:18

once england can unearth another decent passer/crosser/setpiece taker, then beckhams time will be over!

Probably, but they haven't found one yet...

And calling Beckham lazy is rubbish... he was the only Real player really trying against Arsenal! Sure he was pants by his high standards in the European championships, but surprisingly a lot of Real's players underperformed then so possibly it was something to do with the coaching... and since then he's been solid.

chizzum

18.03.2006, 18:44

.........................................Robinson. .............................
Neville..............Carragher.................... ..Terry.............Cole/Bridge
..........Beckham......................King....... .........Cole................
......................Gerrard..................... Lampard......................
...................................Rooney

This would work actually because king would play in a holding mid place letting gerrard and lampard do what their best at, at the same time. A double wammy! And for width we have J.Cole to fly up the left wing which he does on his own and becks and neville can cross perfectly from the right. But all this i can see you saying is on midfield attackers. Well rooney is a one man striker and owen might be fit for the world cup but not in top class playing form. So this would work with all the attacking mids with king helping out THE STRONGEST TWO CENTRE BACKS ENGLAND HAS!!!!!!!! sod ferdinand, he's playing rubbish so therefore an all round quality team with EVERY player playing in their best positions!!!

Thirteen Ball

23.03.2006, 13:40

I've always rated king more as a sweeper than a midfielder. He's not got quick enough feet to mix it wit the best in midfield, but he could probably hold down a holding role very well.

The only thing I'd say is that gerrard, lampard and backham can't all play in the same team. We've seen it time and again. Especially with gerrard and becks. They're both show-ponies, both "I can hit long passes better than you," and the competition is detrimental to the team. It's obvious all 3 see themselves as the obvious captain, and the other two resent beckham because sven won't drop him even though he's poor at the mo.

Club football has a big influence on internationals, and given the fact that the team's picked mainly from liverpool, but liverpool players don't pass to anyone but liverpool players, the options are instantly restricted. Gerrard NEVER passes to rooney (everton and man U, two reasons not to in his eyes.) Neville very rarely passed to anyone except beckham and scholes (before scholes retired) and now passes almost exclusively to beckham (ex man U) and Rooney (current Man U.)

For me, beckham and Gerrard both have to go. Carrick or king deep in midfield, Cole and Wright-Phillips providing the width, Lamps tying it together in the middle.

Rooney for definite. Owen if he's fit, crouch if he ain't. Darren bent shouldn't even be trusted to make the tea.

Steve

23.03.2006, 14:27

I wouldn’t say the team is mainly picked from Liverpool players by any stretch, infact there is only one regular in the starting lineup and 1 out of 11 is not a majority. I missed a lot of maths lessons though so may be wrong. Incidentally, Gerrard & Rooney are two of the closest friends in the England camp, Obviously the Man U / Everton connection is only relevant on the pitch (or not)!

My team with SGE restriction to a 4-4-2 would be Robinson, A.Cole, Terry, Carragher, Neville, J. Cole, Gerrard, Parker, Beckham, Rooney, Owen

Ideally it would be 3-5-2 Robinson, Terry (CB), Carragher (CB), Ferdinand (CB), A.Cole (WB), Gerrard (WB), Lampard (CM), J. Cole (CM), Beckham (CM), Rooney (CF), Owen (CF) Wonderfully versatile line up imho

Andy Moore

29.03.2006, 21:47

GK - Robinson -
DR - Neville/Carragher - I think Neville will be picked, but Carragher should. He was fantastic for Liverpool last season.
DL - Ashley Cole
DC - Terry
DC - Ferdinand - Is playing well for United? Not seen that much of him.
MR - Beckham - Has played for Real this year from what I've seen and heard, but if he doesn't perform he should be dropped before we get sent home.
ML - Joe Cole - Exactly what I think we need on the left side.
MC - Gerrard
MC - Lampard
FC - Rooney - Definitely
FC - Owen/Defoe - Owen will play the opener.

Andy Moore

29.03.2006, 21:52

And calling Beckham lazy is rubbish... he was the only Real player really trying against Arsenal! Sure he was pants by his high standards in the European championships, but surprisingly a lot of Real's players underperformed then so possibly it was something to do with the coaching... and since then he's been solid.

Exactly. A lot of people seem to be judging Beckham on his performances two years ago, after which he publically admitted not being fit enough to lead his country etc. He has recently been playing well for Real Madrid, and his passing game is much improved.

Andy Moore

29.03.2006, 22:00

Club football has a big influence on internationals, and given the fact that the team's picked mainly from liverpool, but liverpool players don't pass to anyone but liverpool players, the options are instantly restricted. Gerrard NEVER passes to rooney (everton and man U, two reasons not to in his eyes.) Neville very rarely passed to anyone except beckham and scholes (before scholes retired) and now passes almost exclusively to beckham (ex man U) and Rooney (current Man U.)
For me, beckham and Gerrard both have to go.
Are you confused? ;) In club football Liverpool players only intend to pass to members of their own team, i.e. Liverpool players. The same goes for Man U. When they play for England, this is not the case, because they are all on the seam team.
Do you seriously think players only pass to their 'mates'?

Aaron

30.03.2006, 08:00

Looking at the current form of Viduka & Kewell with Middlesborough & Liverpool respectively, I can see the Mighty Socceroos causing an upset or 2 in our group
COME ON THE MIGHTY ROOS!!!!

chizzum

30.03.2006, 10:19

By your remarks it seems to be a contraversy that players dont pass to anyone other than their own club players. This is not true and is totally differently when playing for England. Allthough i have too say that you are wrong that players in Liverpool pass to their own players as they do BUT!!! Gerrard passes to Henry doesn't he!!!!!!!!!!1

Steve

30.03.2006, 10:23

And ex-international Phil Neville seems to have given up passing all together and just tries to get his name on the scoresheet instead!!

Bigenglandfan

30.04.2006, 03:33

I was enjoying seeing Man U having the mickey taken out of them by Chelski (did you see what a mug Joe Cole made of ferdinand for the second goal.....classic!!).

And then...... that happened. I thought..."whoops, there goes the world cup for another 4 years!"

postie

30.04.2006, 11:30

I totally agree with you seeing our chance of doing anything in Germany going up in smoke was like a punch in the ribs. Rooney has virtually no chance of being fit in time the last occasion in Portugal he was out for 10 weeks. It is very sad the kid is irreplaceable!!!!!!!!!

chizzum

02.05.2006, 09:12

Its ok, Terry can go up front!!!!!!!

We are going out first round now!!!!

stevetrom

02.05.2006, 11:35

.........................................Robinson. .............................
Neville..............Carragher.................... ..Terry.............Cole/Bridge
..........Beckham......................King....... .........Cole................
......................Gerrard..................... Lampard......................
...................................Rooney

With the exception of Carragher (Ferdinand is Englands No1 Centre Back) not a bad looking team but with the current injury situation it will be more like:-

Robinson

Neville, Ferdinand, Terry? (or Carragher if Terry is not fit), Cole (half fit but no alternative)

Beckham, Gerrard, Lampard, Cole - no width and no holding player oh dear!

Owen (unfit but no option), Crouch (oh no this can not be happening !)

I think this is the team Sven will pick but I don't think we will even get out of the group stage now.:(

Thirteen Ball

02.05.2006, 16:28

Robinson

Neville, Ferdinand, Terry? (or Carragher if Terry is not fit), Cole (half fit but no alternative)

Beckham, Gerrard, Lampard, Cole - no width and no holding player oh dear!

Owen (unfit but no option), Crouch (oh no this can not be happening !)

I think this is the team Sven will pick but I don't think we will even get out of the group stage now.:(

I think this is a pretty accurate prediction. Owen is nearly injury-free but he's not match-fit. Nor will he be in time. I just hope the lay-off has given him some rest. And 7 goals in his 12 games for newcastle shows he's mentally as sharp as he ever was. And a half-fit Michael Owen HAS to be preferable to a fully fit Jermaine Defoe.

Personally I'd like to see Crouch play. We desparately need some aerial firepower up front and it seems like he's the only option for that, as all out other centre-forwards are 5ft2in ankle-biters. It seems the classic big English centre-forward (Ferdinand, Shearer, Sheringham etc) is a thing of the past.

If only Sven had the sense to play a midfield of Gerrard, Lampard, Carrick and Cole, we might have some natural shape, a holding midfielder and everyone doing the job they do at club level. Plus three of them were in west ham's youth development together, the first team, and the england U21 setup so already know well how to play together. And Gerrard is eminently capable of providing width if he can combine with Neville.

Beckham's provided no width for england since euro 2000. He can't cut it in the centre, can't be persuaded to stay out on the wing and certainly isn't captain material. He has to go if we're to stand any hope of getting out of the group.

dyl

08.05.2006, 15:03

A great provisional squad by Sven! :)

Robinson (Tottenham), James (Manchester City), Green (Norwich), G Neville (Manchester United), R Ferdinand (Manchester United), Terry (Chelsea), A Cole (Arsenal), Campbell (Arsenal), Carragher (Liverpool), Bridge (Chelsea), Beckham (Real Madrid), Carrick (Tottenham), Lampard (Chelsea), Gerrard (Liverpool), Hargreaves (Bayern Munich), Jenas (Totenham), Downing (Middlesbrough), J Cole (Chelsea), Lennon (Tottenham), Rooney (Manchester United), Owen (Newcastle), Crouch (Liverpool), Walcott (Arsenal).

No Defoe, Bent or Wright-Phillips - yet Hargreaves and Walcott are in! Shocking!

Going to a World Cup with the following 4 strikers Rooney (unfit) , Owen (unfit), Crouch (not a prolific scorer) and Walcott (hasn't even played a Premiership match!).

Looks like Sven really doesn't want to win this!

Ah well. ;)

IYOUNG

08.05.2006, 15:04

well well well SGE has pulled a blinder out the bag here

Downing Walcott and Lennon all in the 23

No place at all for Bent and wright Phillips not even on standby

If Rooney and Owen unfit we would have a front line up of

Crouch, Defoe Johnson and Walcott

Looks very much like a squd based on wing play with Crouch in the centre

Bigenglandfan

08.05.2006, 15:20

I like it very much. I take my hat off to Sven, he's been a lot bolder than I would have given him credit for. The pace in the squad is exciting, and he hasn't picked Phil Neville which the Sunday papers were suggesting was an option.

Bigenglandfan

08.05.2006, 15:26

.................................Robinson

Neville............Terry....................Ferdin and..............A Cole

.............................,,,,..Carrick

Beckham...........Lampard...............Gerrard... ...........J Cole

......................................Owen

Looks like an above average team to me

tinytimp

08.05.2006, 15:40

Aargh! I have no interest in football whatsoever - I don't understand it, it bores me even when I've made numerous concerted efforts so sit and watch a game.

But as we're evidently not going to be able to get away from the World Cup this summer, I decided to choose a completely random team to follow...
...so come on Mexico! :clap:

(So that's a few celebratory Tequilas on the cards...)

madandcrazytromboneguy

08.05.2006, 15:49

What an absolute disgrace!

Eriksson needs his head screwin on coz he must have been DRUNK!when he chose this squad!

the players in caps are who i would definately pick, the others are a bit iffy or a complete let down i.m.o.

gk's - ROBINSON, james, green. i'dd replace green with carson purely on the fact that ive seen carson play live and if he gains the experience, he can be the next robinson, they are similar gk's. james would have to stay in purely on his experience, he can be v.good at times, but his howlers seem to be too regular aswell.

df's - neville, CAMPBELL, FERDINAND, TERRY, carragher, COLE, BRIDGE. carraghers a better full back than centre back but i feel he's been picked more as a centre back, and i feel the other 3 are better than him in that position. neville is a prima donna and he's only won so many caps for 2 reasons, 1stly he plays for man utd, 2ndly he aint had much competition. i'd give boltons nicky hunt a go, he's had his r.b. place all season and mostly he's played well, he would at least be in the squad, if maybe not full time right back. if danny mills had had a better season, he could have been considered also, but he's not on form right now.

mf's - beckham, COLE, GERRARD, LAMPARD, CARRICK, DOWNING, LENNON, HARGREAVES, jenas. SWP all the way for me on that right wing, beckham has no pace, and free kicks and corners could easily be taken by other players in our squad, albeit that i agree beckham is englands dead ball specialist, it would not be enough to be in my squad. SWP has the pace and flair that could scare the livin hell out of most left backs in this tourny and with lennon to back up SWP, that would be a class position for us, both players have shown their quality at club level this season, and altho SWP aint played much, he had a good game against newcastle, showing form when he needs to i.m.o. . not too sure about jenas, good player, but are there already better players in his position?, carrick, gerrard, and hargreaves for me could do that position, and 1 thing about hargreaves is, no-one see's much of him with him being in the german league, he could be a secret weapon in the centre midfield. kieron dyer would be in my squad but im guessin he's injured, someone please update me on that 1.

strkrs - rooney, owen, CROUCH, walcott. ok, obviously rooney would be in my squad if he was guarenteed to play in the thing, but he could only be available for the games that england might not even reach, pointless him takin up a position when a fitter player should be there insted, owen is also injured and isnt the player he used to be, he lacks the lightning pace he used to have and hasnt been all that hot for scoring recently either. walcott for me aint ready due to the fact he aint played much since joinin arsenal, i would have saved him for the next euro's. so in their place, DARREN BENT!!!!!!!!!!!!, nearly 20 league goals and he aint even been picked?!?!?!?!, absolutely disgraceful!. defoe is an odd case, started the season off excellent, showing skill, pace and scoring goals, then mido came in for spurs and defoe stopped scoring, keane switched on and defoe then didnt get picked. andy johnson has scored about 40goals in 2 seasons now for a club who aint the best, albeit a bit like shearer, many were penalties lol. it could be a position where you would have to look at who plays regular for england U21's and regular for their club aswell, i presume thats why wlacott has been picked coz he's played for the U21's. a few years ago, england had some great strikers, nowadays, its a problem position for us, to me, thats worrying!

so overall, with the squad i would have picked, we may reach the semi final or final, we would not win it. with erikssons squad, quarters or maybe semi's, not the final! we just aint good enough or more importantly, currently fit enough, too many injured players, or players not on form!

try this with his actual squad

.................................Robinson

Carragher............Terry....................Ferd inand..............A Cole

Lennon...........Lampard...............Gerrard.... ..........Downing

..............................Crouch........Walcot t

Looks like an above average team to me
then try with my squad

.................................Robinson

Hunt............Terry....................Ferdinand ..............A Cole

Wright-Phillips...........Lampard...............Gerrard.. ............Downing

.............................Crouch.........Bent

Looks like a very good team to me

Rapier

08.05.2006, 16:16

For a Trombone player, you have selected a good team and I agree with your mega post too! ;)

Cornishwomble

08.05.2006, 16:19

What an absolute disgrace!

Eriksson needs his head screwin on coz he must have been DRUNK!when he chose this squad!

mf's - beckham, COLE, GERRARD, LAMPARD, CARRICK, DOWNING, LENNON, HARGREAVES, jenas. SWP all the way for me on that right wing, beckham has no pace, and free kicks and corners could easily be taken by other players in our squad, albeit that i agree beckham is englands dead ball specialist, it would not be enough to be in my squad. SWP has the pace and flair that could scare the livin hell out of most left backs in this tourny and with lennon to back up SWP, that would be a class position for us, both players have shown their quality at club level this season, and altho SWP aint played much, he had a good game against newcastle, showing form when he needs to i.m.o. . not too sure about jenas, good player, but are there already better players in his position?, carrick, gerrard, and hargreaves for me could do that position, and 1 thing about hargreaves is, no-one see's much of him with him being in the german league, he could be a secret weapon in the centre midfield. kieron dyer would be in my squad but im guessin he's injured, someone please update me on that 1.

Sorry but you need your head screwing on if you think Hargreaves is better than Jenas.
Hargreaves is as much a secret weapon as Saddam's WMDs. It's talked about a lot but at the end of the day the threat isn't there. He's never done the business for for England and I would have put Jenas in the squad instead.

I like having Theo Walcott in the squad as it's an unknown quantity and I think he could come off the bench and do something for us. I also think Lennon is a good choice as he has been consistantly good for Spurs all season, in the same vein I would have picked Michael Dawson over Sol Campbell who still looks out of pace and a bit short on confidence

I'm still a bit dubious about Crouch although I thought he was outstanding against Argentina.

My big worry is if Robinson gets injured as I don't think we're strong in the goalkeeping department

I'm going to the England/ Hungary game on May 30th so I'm looking forward to how the team lines up

persins

08.05.2006, 16:48

Being a Spurs fan, I'm slightly confused about the selection. On the one hand I think Sven is absolutely right to pick Robinson, Carrick and Lennon in his squad but what is Jenas doing there? He's recovering from a fractured shin and even when he was fit, he's not been in the same league as some of the other midfielders in the squad. He will be a fringe player at best!!
I can't really understand the completely untried Walcott either, especially when SGE admits that it is a gamble and an illogical choice himself! Now there's a sign of confidence from the manager!
What about Darren Bent? The highest scoring ENGLISH striker in the Premiership and he's not even on Standby. I can understand Defoe not being in the squad since he hasn't exactly done the business this season but Bent must be gutted. Especially since Andrew Johnson is on Standby and all he has managed is scoring penalties in the Championship!! Looking at the English players in the Championship, I would expect Dave Kitson and Leroy Lita from Reading to be ahead in the pecking order.

The strikers are definitely a weak link as it stands at the moment. The only way I can see it working is if Carrick sits in front of the defense and allows Lampard, Gerrard, Walcott or Lennon to absolutely blitz the opposition with pace.

I personnally cannot see why Beckham justifies his place at the moment considering the competition in midfield. Sure, he is great for set pieces but so too are Carrick, Lampard and Gerrard.

Let's just hope they check out the hotel caterers before each match.

dyl

08.05.2006, 17:13

carraghers a better full back than centre back

Yeah, right.

Bigenglandfan

08.05.2006, 17:36

Dear MadandCrazytromGuy

Point 1; re post 85:

The team quoted as "originally posted by Bigenglandfan", is not my team at all... that has been edited somehow, but not by me! (please see post 83 for my team).

Point 2; Being mad and crazy is possibly an attribute for trombone playing, but it is certainly not a required skill for international football management. I think Sven's thinking is on a higher intellectual plane than you are currently operating on. The Walcott choice is already appearing to be inspired as it has taken a high percentage of the attention off Rooney. This could well last for several weeks and may just allow Rooney the space he needs to recover from his injury away from the media glare.

Point 3; Hargreaves is hardly an unknown quantity. The Bundesliga is televised around the world just as much as the premiership. I watch a live game of German soccer every week and have obviously seen Munchen several times this season. Hargreaves has, at best, been average, and certainly would not have made my squad on current form. Maybe I have seen him play more than Sven has!

Point 4; If you are an England fan.... chill out.... stop being critical.... and get behind your team.

Thirteen Ball

08.05.2006, 17:44

Well... I must say even by sven's standards he's played a blinder there.

A blindfold chimpanzee with one arm tied behind his back would have picked a better squad than that. What on earth is the man playing at?

Walcott and Crouch as the only fully fit strikers. Not exactly fearsome is it.

Crouch might fire if you could persuade Beckham he's a WINGER and should stay on the WING and cross a lot, but he seems to think he's Gazza since he went to spain. I personally wouldn't play him at all, but Sven will, no doubt.

I think we'll be solid enough, but ultimately uninventive, and whilever he insists on cro-barring players into positions they don't play in and letting Beckham wander around like a headless chicken, the midfield is always going to get crucified by a proper outfit.

And no Defoe, and no Wright-Phillips, and no Bent? Lunacy.

Can't see much to cheer about in that squad. I think we're doing a Scotland on this one. Group stage, 3 poor displays and home before the postcards.

Andy_Euph

08.05.2006, 18:07

Not too bad a team when you look at it really its the same as it would have been, just with a couple of surprises thrown in. Remember both Owen and Rooney really came of age in a major competition so maybe Sven think's this could happen with Walcott, as the majority of us will never have seen him play we don't know.

Just be thankful for small graces...at least he hasn't picked Dyer :tup

IYOUNG

08.05.2006, 19:00

Everyone please don't forget that SGE has until 9/9/06 to have a replacement for Rooney so Defoe or Johnson will be in if the worst happens.

I think as said before its worth a gamble with Walcott

I member of a 23 man squad that all

Bigenglandfan

08.05.2006, 19:15

Everyone please don't forget that SGE has until 9/9/06 to have a replacementl

LOL IYOUNG... I bet Sven wishes he had until 9th September!

At least Rooney would be fit by then, and baby Walcott would be a bit older!

David Pegram

09.05.2006, 09:03

andywooler

09.05.2006, 10:27

The saddest aspect of this squad for us Hammers is the inclusion of 5 people who were one time WHU Youth Academy players.
(of course, 3 of them were in the team that went down but that's another debate).
The good news is that last time there was a heavy WHU influence on the team, we won!

IYOUNG

09.05.2006, 11:04

LOL IYOUNG... I bet Sven wishes he had until 9th September!

At least Rooney would be fit by then, and baby Walcott would be a bit older!

oops 9/6/06 of course

IckleSop

09.05.2006, 11:16

Steve

09.05.2006, 12:04

Not everything is lost, its still a pretty strong squad all be it not as strong as it could have been.

If Rooney and Owen were dead certs Im sure SWP would have retained his place and the squad would have been unchanged.

There are obviously suprises but anyone remember how old Pele was when he became a world star?

-------------Robinson-------------
Neville---Terry---Carragher---Cole
Beckham--Lampard--Carrick--Cole
---------------------Gerrard----------
--------------Owen-------------------

Thats a strong possibility and looks like a world beater to me

stevetrom

09.05.2006, 12:13

Hopefull starting lineup

Robinson
Neville, Fedinand, terry, A.Cole
Beckham, Lampard, Gerrard, J.Cole
Rooney, Owen

Not bad

Possible line up

Green
Hargreaves, Carragher, Campbell, Bridge
Lennon, Jenas, Carrick, Downing
Crouch, Walcott

and if you think that team can win the WC you living in a dreamland !

GingerMaestro

09.05.2006, 12:20

Who cares what squad Sven picks They ain't going to win cause lets face it we are all still waiting for Beckham to show us what he can do on the big stage and gerrard hasn't exactly proved he has what it takes on the world stage and with out Rooney I think Walcott has just as good a chance to prove himself as anyone else.

Realistivally Rooney ain't goin to make the world cup so Defoe will get in the squad Crouch May suprise you all and Owen might be back and better than ever who knows

What ever squad Sven Picked you would find fault in so save it until the competition and the make comment on if he did the right thing or not

2nd man down

09.05.2006, 12:31

The problem with the England squad is, and I suppose this applies to every other footballing nation around the world, that no matter what team Sven puts out...even if he had his pick of the cream of English footballers and they were all fit and raring to go, no-one has the collective cohesion and the necessary skill to beat the Brazilians when they play their game how they can, so all this conjecture is really fairly academic.

The English team (or any of the home nations for that matter) don't play together enough to be able to gel in time for major tournaments. Same old same old.

madandcrazytromboneguy

09.05.2006, 16:11

Hmmm ive just been thinking about lennon and the posibility he'll be in the quad is that just stupid or does the boy have some talent??? im not really a spurs supporter but i just cant see svens logic?

hey becky, hope your ok coz we aint spoken in a while

just to clarify your suspitions about aaron lennon, im a leeds fan and i saw him on numerous occasions when he played for leeds and he has got talent. his pace and skill on the ball is brilliant and could frighten many left backs in this years world cup. once he improves his crossing ability, he will be a fantastic right winger for england!

madandcrazytromboneguy

09.05.2006, 16:17

madandcrazytromboneguy

09.05.2006, 16:19

just 1 point to all of you

KEEP YOUR INSULTS TO YOURSELVES!

Cornishwomble

09.05.2006, 16:24

Sorry I don't agree that we're not good enough. It's this total negativity that I hate, probably typically English but what is wrong with having some faith.

I don't think we're nailed on to win it and the loss of Rooney and maybe Owen is not good but there's no way we are a bad side.

It's funny to see that most people in the football world outside of England put us down as potential winners, but we seem to love knocking ourselves.

I don't doubt that come the end of the tornament we may not be winners so I'm certainly not going to make any big predictions about us. However I think we're one fo the strongest teams in the tournament and the only teams I fear are Brazil and Argentina, although our result against the latter tells me we don't have to fear them.

In my min d not doing well in the tournament is not making it through the group stages and the way the tournament is lined up the 2nd round opponents shouldn't be a problem. So what is not doing well? I'd love to know, especially as it is SIMPLE AS!

dyl

09.05.2006, 16:27

just 1 point to all of you

KEEP YOUR INSULTS TO YOURSELVES!
Clive - you seriously need to chill out - there are no insults directed at you as far as I can see. Sure, people may disagree with your posts, but that does not make them insulting.

Now we have 1 point to request from you as wll - leave the moderating to us. If there are any insults posted, then we will deal with them, taking the matter yourslef will only inflame the situation. But the fact of the matter is there aren't any insults here, so there's no problem, is there?

Now, back to the topic of the World Cup.

Anno Draconis

09.05.2006, 16:59

Cornishwomble

09.05.2006, 17:14

Lawro made a couple of good points about Walcott yesterday. 1st, many of Brazil's greatest players were "blooded" at the World Cup as teenagers, before they'd made much impact anywhere. Even if Walcott doesn't play he will gain masses of invaluable experience from being in the squad - if, as Wenger claims, he is the fastest English player he's ever seen, just think what an impact he could then make on Euro 2008.
2nd the selection distracts attention from the daft "Rooney's foot" frenzy!

Totally agree, Walcott is frightening at going forward and running at people. I doubt Sven is goin to have him starting matches but it was only a couple of years ago that an inexperienced Rooney was regarded in the same way.

I think my one gripe with his selection was having Andy Johnson over Darren Bent as stand by, I think Bent would do better and also as a winger on standy by I may have considered Keiran Richardson.

The bigest "Oi Sven NO" goes to the selection of Hargreaves, I can only assume that he has some compromising pictures of Sven locked away in a safety deposit box somewhere that guarantees his selection.

persins

09.05.2006, 17:51

just to clarify your suspitions about aaron lennon, im a leeds fan and i saw him on numerous occasions when he played for leeds and he has got talent. his pace and skill on the ball is brilliant and could frighten many left backs in this years world cup. once he improves his crossing ability, he will be a fantastic right winger for england!
As mentioned previously, I'm a Spurs fan and can confirm that the boy Lennon has been quality this season. He has got better and better as the season has gone on and I am by no means surprised that he has been included in this squad. Perhaps it is too much of a risk taking both Aaron Lennon and Walcott to the world cup but both could be capable of coming on and changing a match in the favour of England.

Bungle

10.05.2006, 13:37

I don't think we should worry too much about Rooney not playing. In 1966 Jimmy Greaves was injured and they played someone with only 5 caps and 1 England goal instead. That someone was Geoff Hurst.

Andy_Euph

10.05.2006, 17:38

What's with all the negativity, to quote Donald Sutherland "always with the negative waves"....come on everyone lets get behind England :biggrin: , I firmly believe will win this summer regardless of whether Rooney is playing.

COME ON ENGLAND!!!!!

stevetrom

15.05.2006, 08:48

If Walcott is a world beater why has'nt he played for Arsenal yet?

If Lennon has had a sucha good season why has Sven never picked him in a full England squad?

So we're going to the World Cup with an injured Rooney, Owen who has'nt played a full competitive match all year, Crouch who (whatever he may be good at) will never score many goals and Walcott who has never even played 1 minute of a premier league match.

How frightened are the Brazillians going to be ?

andywooler

15.05.2006, 10:25

Not having seen Walcott (has anyone? !!) I can't comment on him but having seen Lennon at WHU, I wasn't impressed and having seen Crouch in Cardiff, I would start to be a bit worried.
However, if the Gerrard that played Saturday turns up in Germany rather than the one that played the last couple of times I saw him then there's hope!

manx_yessir

15.05.2006, 14:41

stevetrom

15.05.2006, 14:52

My prediction to start in fisrt game:

Robinson
G.Neville Ferdinand Terry A.Cole

Carrick

Beckham Lampard J.Cole

Gerrard
Owen(Crouch if Owen not fit)

The team I would pick would be:

Robinson
G.Neville Carragher Terry A.Cole

Carrick

Gerrard Lampard Lennon

J.Cole
Owen (Or Crouch)

Yes I know, no Beckham! I just feel the others have more to offer. Feel free to suggest otherwise!

Thank goodness Sven is picking the team and not you !!!!!!

Carragher ahead of Ferdinand, we would have the slowest centre backs in history.

Lennon ahead of Beckham, 2 or 3 decent games for Spurs does not make you a world class player.

Without Rooney and Owen our chances will be virtually non existant, I do agree with the idea of playing Carrick in midfield allowing Gerrard, Lampard, Cole to support a lone striker but is that really the role Owen is best suited to?

2nd man down

15.05.2006, 15:04

Steve, don't be too hard on the lad, he can't be held responsible for that team selection, he's a scouser when all's said and done, it'll be stolen! :biggrin: :rolleyes:

dyl

15.05.2006, 15:29

Carragher ahead of Ferdinand, we would have the slowest centre backs in history.
But a better chance of no goals scored against you! It's football not the bleedin' 100 metres!

Lennon ahead of Beckham, 2 or 3 decent games for Spurs does not make you a world class player.
Beckham is well past his 'world class' stage - if he ever got there to begin with. A celebrity wife and multi-million-pound sponsorship deals doesn't make you a good player either.

stevetrom

15.05.2006, 16:04

But a better chance of no goals scored against you! It's football not the bleedin' 100 metres!

Beckham is well past his 'world class' stage - if he ever got there to begin with. A celebrity wife and multi-million-pound sponsorship deals doesn't make you a good player either.

but these international forwards have a nasty habit of running around (and Mr Terry won't have Makelele in front of him to help out either), old fashioned english centre half stoppers are OK in EPL but wioll be found out at the highest level, we wil need pace at the back.

Beckham is still the best english passer/crosser/dead ball striker (right footed), if not anywhere. Madrid seem happy with him as he has been offered a new contract.

dyl

15.05.2006, 16:10

Beckham is still the best english passer/crosser/dead ball striker (right footed), if not anywhere. Madrid seem happy with him as he has been offered a new contract.

The way I see it, the fact that he's been offered a new contract is more down to the amount of shirts they've sold all over the world with his name on the back.

stevetrom

15.05.2006, 16:27

The way I see it, the fact that he's been offered a new contract is more down to the amount of shirts they've sold all over the world with his name on the back.

So No Ferdinand in your team (Englands most talented footballing defender)

No Beckham in your team (Englands Captain, most experienced midfielder, best distributor)

Do I sense a little bit of the ABU influence?

I'm only surprised that you did'nt select Hargreaves ahead of Gary Neville !

manx_yessir

15.05.2006, 16:29

Madrid seem happy with him as he has been offered a new contract.

I'm sorry....remind me again what they've won since Beckham's been at Madrid?;)

stevetrom

15.05.2006, 16:32

I'm sorry....remind me again what they've won since Beckham's been at Madrid?;)

are you really saying that if a side does'nt win anything ALL of the players are useless?

if you are any reasoned debate is not worth the effort!

manx_yessir

15.05.2006, 16:33

So No Ferdinand in your team (Englands most talented footballing defender)

No Beckham in your team (Englands Captain, most experienced midfielder, best distributor)

Do I sense a little bit of the ABU influence?

I'm only surprised that you did'nt select Hargreaves ahead of Gary Neville !

I'm not bothered who their club teams are. It's an ENGLAND Team, is it not? Do I sense a little bit of Man Ure bias in your choice? :rolleyes: ;) I think Gary Neville is the best option in that position. If Steve Finnan was eligible for England I'd pick Neville ahead of him every time. So no Bias here. For sure.

stevetrom

15.05.2006, 16:39

I'm not bothered who their club teams are . ..... Man Ure bias in your choice

well that goes to show just how un-biased your commenst are!

dyl

15.05.2006, 16:39

Do I sense a little bit of Man Ure bias in your choice?

I was going to say that................ ;)

Either way, I don't care what England do at the WC - I just want the Liverpool lads to come safe and injury free.

Viva Espana!!

manx_yessir

15.05.2006, 16:40

are you really saying that if a side does'nt win anything ALL of the players are useless?

if you are any reasoned debate is not worth the effort!

No that's not what I'm saying at all. You pointed to the fact that Real had given him a new contract. I pointed out the fact that they haven't won anything since he's been there. It seems that you were trying to say that 'the great Madrid think he's good, so England should.' I am saying that Madrid aren't that great anymore. I know what I mean anyway!:-? ;)

stevetrom

15.05.2006, 16:50

Totally biased, I would have taken Brown (Younger, quicker, more versatile than 'Camp'bell) and Richardson (fitter, quicker, better than Downing and can cover Cole at LB)

Thirteen Ball

15.05.2006, 17:23

Either way, I don't care what England do at the WC - I just want the Liverpool lads to come safe and injury free.

That's a great attitude, real "get behind the team" spirit there eh?

It's small wonder the players don't care about england if fans think like that.

Tell you what, let's sack off all the over-paid, over hyped primadonnas from the top-flight that usually fill their wallets with half-hearted displays (beckham, rio, owen, campbell etc) and pick a team from players who work had and actually WANT to play for england, rather than selling their world cup diaries in the tabloid press for the price of a hospital wing and whining about being asked to play a little out of position.

And how come every football thread on here winds up as a slagging match between Man U, Liverpool, Arsenal and Chelsea fans? Come on, this is england! It's far more important than any club!

GRRRRRRRRR!

Rant over.

dyl

15.05.2006, 17:29

That's a great attitude, real "get behind the team" spirit there eh?

It's small wonder the players don't care about england if fans think like that.
Hehe! Errrm - I'm Welsh mate! And therefore not an england fan as you called me! :cool:

Come on, this is england! It's far more important than any club!
Not for me I'm afraid!

Rant over.
Bit of a waste of time really wasn't it? ;)

Thirteen Ball

15.05.2006, 17:51

Bit of a waste of time really wasn't it? ;)

Not really. I just showed more passion and pride about the england team in a half dozen sentences than Sven's showin in the past two years! ;) (Although I do realise I look a bit silly now :oops: )

Not being previously aware of your Welshness, I can see why England might be a somewhat indifferent prospect. But surely the principle is the same? Like when Fergie told Ryan Giggs to pretend to be injured so he could rest up for united's games and not play for wales. Paul scholes used to get 'injured' a lot when england matches were coming up too.

Country should come before club - no question.

Anno Draconis

16.05.2006, 07:26

Not being previously aware of your Welshness,

With a name like Dylan Williams??

Come on Dyl, don't be such a Meldrew. I know Wales didn't qualify (and with Tosh in charge and virtually every decent player retired we won't for Euro 2008 either) but it wouldn't hurt to cheer on England a bit? Would it?

dyl

16.05.2006, 10:00

Come on Dyl, don't be such a Meldrew.
I don't belieeeeeeve it!

but it wouldn't hurt to cheer on England a bit? Would it?
Yes, it would.

Viva Espana!

stevetrom

16.05.2006, 10:06

Hehe! Errrm - I'm Welsh mate! And therefore not an england fan as you called me! :cool:

Not for me I'm afraid!

Bit of a waste of time really wasn't it? ;)

Why is a Welshman even discussing the World Cup ;)

My World Cup memory goes back to '74 and I can't recall any Welsh involvement.

Come On England !

dyl

16.05.2006, 10:16

Why is a Welshman even discussing the World Cup
I'm no weatherman either, doesn't stop me talking about the weather does it?

stevetrom

16.05.2006, 10:22

I'm no weatherman either, doesn't stop me talking about the weather does it?

and your World Cup thoughts are as valid as your weather predictions :D

dyl

16.05.2006, 10:25

and your World Cup thoughts are as valid as your weather predictions :D

Nope. They're not 'thoughts' - but 'opninions' - and as such, are every bit as valid as yours.

stevetrom

16.05.2006, 10:29

and your World Cup opinions are as valid as your weather predictions :D

p.s.

will it rain in Oxfordshire at the weekend?

will England win the World Cup?

we will see if you are a better weatherman than football pundit (or vice versa)

dyl

16.05.2006, 10:34

Did I say that I predicted the weather? No.

I will, however, predict that England won't win the World Cup.

Your turn.....

2nd man down

16.05.2006, 12:41

Steve (having just looked at the Liverpool thread too)...is it national pick a pointless argument day today? :biggrin: :rolleyes:

manx_yessir

16.05.2006, 13:17

Steve (having just looked at the Liverpool thread too)...is it national pick a pointless argument day today? :biggrin: :rolleyes:

No. He thinks it's pick a pointless argument WEEK! ;)

Thirteen Ball

16.05.2006, 17:57

With a name like Dylan Williams??

Clinton Morrison.

Need I say more? ;)

(Okay, maybe it was a bit more obvious than that!)

PS Dyl. I agree. England will not win the world cup. Brazil, Italy or Argentina. If we meet any of those three, we're out.

madandcrazytromboneguy

17.05.2006, 04:32

england wont win, most of the facts have already been pointed out, like steve i think said about all the 4 strikers, other players not being fully fit, people not knowing what weird and wacky moves sven will make throughout the cup!

heres what makes the brazilians more unbeatable than previously. THEY NOW HAVE A DECENT GK AND DEFENCE!

theyve always had the midfield and attacking flair, but now most of their backline is pretty solid too, we say it every year, but this year, its serious, BRAZIL ARE THE FAVOURITES!

Anno Draconis

17.05.2006, 09:09

Clinton Morrison.

Need I say more? ;)

Actually his full name is Llewelyn Clinton Gruffudd ap Morrison :D
I know 'cos my mate Robbie Iwan Iolo Geraint Savage told me.

BRAZIL ARE THE FAVOURITES!

Of course they are, but let's not forget that France, England and Portugal were hot favourites for Euro 2004 eventually won by those footballing giants, Greece. Brazil play an exhibition game when they are on song, but I wouldn't be surprised if they come a cropper against a less fancied team that's prepared to play scrappy, dirty, attritional football. Don't forget that all of their group opponents are a bit handy, and Australia have already beaten the great Brazilian bogey side, Uruguay. Argentina are in a nightmare group, and I wouldn't be surprised to see Ivory Coast make it through at the expense of Netherlands or Argentina.

It's become a cliche to say there are no easy games in international football, but at the World Cup, there aren't. A few upsets in the group stages could leave the most open finals for years, and I note nobody is tipping our great friends, the Germans. Don't bet against them scraping a lucky semi-final berth at home.

Thirteen Ball

17.05.2006, 17:13

Actually his full name is Llewelyn Clinton Gruffudd ap Morrison :D

Funny name for an Irishman that... ;)

I certainly won't bet against the Germans getting a semi-final spot. Home nation, traditionally very strong as a unit (regardless of the individual quality of some players) with a lot of organisation, physical strength and good technique about them. They'll be difficult to beat.

What's the betting the Dutch will push the self-destruct button again? If they could ever sort the rowing in the camp out, they'd be a hot tip for the final, if not the overall winners.

jingleram

17.05.2006, 17:29

So No Ferdinand in your team (Englands most talented footballing defender)

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahaha. :clap: Good one!

brassneck

20.05.2006, 15:36

I see that there is now a chance that Rooney might be fit to start England's campaign ...

http://www.iol.co.za/index.php?click_id=19&art_id=qw114811614093S163&set_id=

Bigenglandfan

20.05.2006, 18:26

So No Ferdinand in your team (Englands most talented footballing defender)

HeHeHe Steve..... surely you mean "Englands most overpaid defender'!! Either you are having a laugh, you havn't seen John Terry play or you are a blinkered Man U fan!!

I quite like Rio, but based on current form he will surely be on the subs bench behind terry and cambell come the start of the world cup campaign.

Jan H

27.05.2006, 10:24

I've moved this existing thread from Random to the new FIFA World Cup subforum

Cornishwomble

27.05.2006, 14:04

After Wednesday night's performance Owen Hargreaves should not be going. I don 't care about the "he plays in Germany so we never see him" mantra.

On Wednesday he was pony and I'd rather see someone else in his place. Stick Defoe in the squad instead.

madandcrazytromboneguy

27.05.2006, 15:18

OK!, its about time 1 of us pulled out ALL the stops and started doing some proper predicting!, im quite happy to do so, so heres the final placings of the 1st group stage:

A
1.Germany (I should point out tho that this group is really tight, not much in it)
2.Poland
3.Ecuador
4.Costa Rica

B
1.Paraquay (Par. have some good players, Swe.+T+T both know the english game)
2.Sweden
3.England
4.Trinidad & Tobago

C
1.Argentina (Serbs have an ageing squad, really tough group this 1!)
2.Holland
3.Ivory Coast
4.Serbia & Montenegro

D
1.Mexico (Could be the most clear cut group, Mex.+ Por. should have no problems)
2.Portugal
3.Iran
4.Angola

E
1.Italy (USA could beat the Czechs if their ageing stars dont perform, but unlikely)
2.Czech Republic
3.USA
4.Ghana

F
1.Brazil (Cro. will probably come 2nd but i'd like to see Jap. + Aus. do well)
2.Japan
3.Australia
4.Croatia

G
1.France (Fra. should have no trouble, Swiss will struggle, S.K. + Togo will be close)
2.South Korea
3.Togo
4.Switzerland

H
1.Spain (Probably the 2nd most clear cut group, top 2 should have no problems)
2.Ukraine
3.Tunisia
4.Saudi Arabia

So hows about that for a contravertial prediction. I can't wait for all the reaction on this 1, most of you will probably disagree with almost all of it, but thats the beauty of predicting, ITS ONLY 1 PERSONS OPINION! :D

LeDragon

28.05.2006, 21:55

madandcrazytromboneguy

29.05.2006, 20:28

You think England will flop in the 1st group stage aswell then?

does you being welsh have any influence on that 1?, or do you just want England to lose terribly? lol

madandcrazytromboneguy

29.05.2006, 20:49

Just out of interest, has anyone entered a fantasty world cup team competition?

I did 1 last night but its really difficult coz of what price range they give you and the price each player is priced at, i dont really think mine will do too well but im more worried about whether the players ive picked will actually play, this is my lineup anyway:

MANAGER - BLOKHIN - UKRAINE
GOAL KEEPER - SHOVKOVSKY - UKRAINE
RIGHT BACK - SALGADO - SPAIN
LEFT BACK - FEDOROV - UKRAINE
CENTRE BACK - MARQUEZ - MEXICO
CENTRE BACK - GALLAS - FRANCE
RIGHT WINGER - MALOUDA - FRANCE
LEFT WINGER - RIBERY - FRANCE
CENTRE MIDFIELDER - ZINHA - MEXICO
CENTRE MIDFIELDER - XAVI - SPAIN
STRIKER - BORGETTI - MEXICO
STRIKER - VILLA - SPAIN

BA Baritone

29.05.2006, 22:16

Just had a quick look through some of your teams, and alot of you are playing Rooney. The chances of him making it a very slim, so who would you play if he doesn't recover?
Although I can't see England winning as Sven does not have the guts to take off his big players if they are not playing well, which Beckham manages to do quite a lot.

And lets hope we can talk about the Scottish line up in four years!!!!

madandcrazytromboneguy

29.05.2006, 23:08

Mr BA

I have to agree with some of your points here, 2 inparticular

Why do England persist in playing players who are

A - UNFIT! or havnt played many competitive matches recently

or B - OUT OF FORM BIG NAMES!

it infuriates me because other players who deserve the chance just arent getting the chance they need to prove themselves. SCREW the friendlies, they arent competitve enough to see what players are like, as that wales vs T+T match proved!

England need to take some chances at the world and euro cups coz its the only way these other good players will get their chances, coz 1 day, they will pay off.

How many big name players played for greece?, not many, but they were on form, and thats why they won!

If Lampard and Gerrard CAN work as the centre pairing for England then great, but IF they can't, then we have to start considering other players, Cole and Carrick, Dyer and Jenas, just to name a couple of alternatives.

The wings are another problem! Shaun Wright Phillips, Aaron lennon, and James Milner are ALL good right wingers, all young, and when they both get the experience, they will all be very good players for club and country, but coz they wont dislodge the big name of beckham, they wont get their chance for another 2 to 4 years, depending on how long beckham lasts. Some have been totally forgotten too, Pennant still knows how to be a good right winger, he just played with a team not on form thats all.

So we have plenty of cover on the right, how about the left, in 2 words, STEWART DOWNING!. He's the ONLY natural left winger england have, although if both were fit, i think cole and bridge could compliment each other on the left, both exchanging position at times between left back and left wing. That could be so effective for england, but they'll never use it!, Joe Cole is a centre attacking midfielder, not a left winger.

Strikers and I know ive mentioned this already, but here it is again, DARREN BENT, 20 PREM. GOALS. not forgetting that the season before that, he scored 20 in the championship aswell. and thinking of that in reverse, ANDY JOHNSON, 20 in the championship this season, and 20 in the premiership last season. 2 strikers with 40 goals in 2 seasons between them, SURRRRRRRELY this should have been considered by S.G.E, they both scored them with average service behind them aswell, think what they could so with some decent midfield backing them up. Then theres other proven goalscorers, Defoe, Ashton, just to name a couple.

And a quick word about the other GB teams, i'd like Englands group to have been against all the other GB teams, Scotland, Wales, Rep Ire., and N.Ire. Then we really would see who the best team in our area is, and I wouldn't be convinced that England would win that, certainly not comfortably anyway.

BA Baritone

30.05.2006, 15:42

Another reason why I feel England will not win is because they do not have enough quality in depth. England are not going to score many goals especially without wonderboy and who knows how many they will let in if Sven carrys on picking the wrong players. Unlike Brazil or Italy who can score against any team and normally they look like they are playing for fun. You always feel that they will score more than they will let in and can you honestly say this about England?

Andy Moore

30.05.2006, 16:05

Just had a quick look through some of your teams, and alot of you are playing Rooney. The chances of him making it a very slim, so who would you play if he doesn't recover?

Bent. It's an absolute crime he's not in the team.

madandcrazytromboneguy

30.05.2006, 16:06

If England had a replacement for gary neville like giving experience to nicky hunt or if danny mills was to get fitter and stop bein a stresshead or if frazer richardson at leeds ever shows the promise that he showed as a youth then england would actually be very strong defensivly, but with rio being too inconsistant, sol having a bad time mentally of recent months, and woody not being fit enough, we are reduced to only 1 world class centre back who is actually fully fit, and fully reliable, john terry. i feel though that if those 4 were all fully fit, fully concentrated, and right in the head, then we would have 4 world class centre backs, and i think that if ash cole and wayne bridge were both fit and on form then with robinson in goal, potentially, its 1 of the strongest backline plus gk's in the world, and i aint holding back on that, but the laughable thing is, is that theres too much **** going on preventing this from being full fact!

Edit * Could we please refrain from the obvious expletives, there really isn't any need.

BA Baritone

30.05.2006, 16:13

I have to agree that it is potentially one of the best back lines in the game, but Sol and Reo (Svens fav option I think) really shouldn't be out by them selfs at the moment as I think neither have had a good season and are loose cannons.

But for me and the rest of the world I suppose we must hope he plays them.

Ross

LeDragon

30.05.2006, 16:28

You think England will flop in the 1st group stage aswell then?

does you being welsh have any influence on that 1?, or do you just want England to lose terribly? lol

Lol - for once me being Welsh has nothing to do with it! I just genuinly don't think England will perform. Sven is likely to play Gerrard, Lampard and Beckham and I don't see how that can work - three great players but I don't think they can all play in the same team.

Also the strikeforce is potentially very weak - Rooney will prob miss the first three games and Owen, despite being fit now is likely to pull a hamstring at any time. That would leave them with just Crouch and Walcott up front - not world class in my opinion.

BA Baritone

30.05.2006, 16:38

Lol - for once me being Welsh has nothing to do with it! I just genuinly don't think England will perform. Sven is likely to play Gerrard, Lampard and Beckham and I don't see how that can work - three great players but I don't think they can all play in the same team.

Also the strikeforce is potentially very weak - Rooney will prob miss the first three games and Owen, despite being fit now is likely to pull a hamstring at any time. That would leave them with just Crouch and Walcott up front - not world class in my opinion.

I have to totally agree with this and Sven is never going to make big changes to win a game( you might notice I am not his biggest fan). I think this might stem from when Scotland had a German manager and that was disastrous!!!!!!!

Ross

madandcrazytromboneguy

30.05.2006, 19:48

ive gone on about all the good players that sven has left out and i stand by it, coz the squad he's picked aint gonna win the world cup.

I actually reckon England will DRAW all 3 games!

That should leave the door open for Paraguay and Sweden to go through, and who knows, TnT might just get a dynomite result and blast england into 4th place, MWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

BA Baritone

30.05.2006, 20:08

Not the best team line up but you never know Sven might just get it right. Of course playing Owen who is injured is a masterstroke. It's a very defensive line up, looks set up to counter attack.

MRSH

30.05.2006, 22:14

madandcrazytromboneguy

30.05.2006, 23:51

nope, im a proud west yorkshireman, west yorkshire is my home nation

anyway the points ive made are that i dont think deserve to win the tournament until they prove they are the best in the world, that means showing consistancy, and that the so called big names live up to their so called high reputations and expectations, coz for what they earn, they should be bringing back the big trophies and cups etc.

we shall all see anyway

ironic that hungarys goal was the best of the 4 isnt it, and that everyone whos put crouch down has been answered by a fair good shot aswell, baring in mind, kiraly aint a bad goalie, had a good season in the premiership with a team who got relegated lol

MRSH

31.05.2006, 00:28

nope, im a proud west yorkshireman, west yorkshire is my home nationOK - so you're English. So why on earth don't you just get behind your home nation and take the rough with the smooth. With all the the little inadequacies, inconsistancies and high expectations that are sometimes dashed - support England your home nation and stop putting them down all the time.

anyway the points ive made are that i dont think deserve to win the tournament until they prove they are the best in the world, that means showing consistancy, and that the so called big names live up to their so called high reputations and expectations, coz for what they earn, they should be bringing back the big trophies and cups etc.I'm sorry but I really cannot see, nor understand, what anyone earns has got anything whatsoever to do with whether anyone "deserves" to win anything. They only earn what they earn because there are football clubs willing to pay what they pay.

ironic that hungarys goal was the best of the 4 isnt it, Why is it ironic? Hungary's goal was an absolute cracker, yes. But England scored 3 and Hungary scored 1. End of story.

and that everyone whos put crouch down has been answered by a fair good shot aswell, And why do you think that scoring a goal (yes, a very well taken goal) has answered all his critics. I still think he runs around like a headless chicken most of the time. His form for Liverpool has been sketchy to say the least but I do sincerely hope that, if he does play any part in the World Cup for England, he comes good and performs well.

baring in mind, kiraly aint a bad goalie, had a good season in the premiership with a team who got relegated lolWhat season was that then? Last season (04/05) yes. He is a good goalie and performed very well for Palace throughout the season but he was found wanting on all three goals tonight.

It's very easy to knock individuals and teams when they don't perform very well but it shows faith and loyalty to keep supporting when they aren't doing so well. Look at me - I'm a Palace supporter. I have been since I was six and always will be. I am also English and will support the English through good times and bad times. I just wish other so-called supporters would do the same.

And, by the way, I must just add that if Wales, Scotland and/or Ireland were in the World Cup I would want all home nations to do well. But ultimately, I am English and will support the England team.

Apologies, if this appears to have turned in to a rant. Didn't start off that way - honest :D;)

lynchie

31.05.2006, 11:19

and that everyone whos put crouch down has been answered by a fair good shot aswell

Interesting you say that but don't mention that Beckham, who you've been slating, set up 4 clear cut scoring opportunities with brilliant crosses, and showed again that he's the best passer England have got, and with a fit Michael Owen running off the defenders, he would have set up a whole lot more.

Anno Draconis

31.05.2006, 11:38

What I really enjoyed last night was watching the increasingly bitter Ian Wright, who desperately wanted to rip into Eriksson because he hasn't picked his lad, having to bite his tongue at the end because England won 3-1. Pick holes all you like, but if England play **** football all tournament and win the final 3-1 with scrappy, scrambled goals in the area, I bet nobody will complain.

stevetrom

31.05.2006, 11:43

Much as it pains me to say so but, based on last nights performance, Crouch should play ahead of Owen as a lone striker with support from Gerrard, Cole & Lampard. Hopefully Sven will try Carrick as holding the player, Carragher did OK but he is a naturally defensive player and looked lost and confused when he had the ball.

stevetrom

31.05.2006, 11:46

and more...

why is Hargreaves in the squad?

I just can't see where he would be if use

2nd man down

31.05.2006, 12:37

I thought that considering the cobbled together front line thay didn't play all that bad last night, they certainly deserved the margin of victory.

They certainly had more drive and fluidity once they got going than I expected them to have. Crouch's goal was very well taken, say what you like, that was pure strikers instinct. He didn't need to look up, he knew where he was putting it before he turned.

Did anyone see Roy and Linda Taylor in the crowd? I was trying to get one of them to streak so we could see them...but they weren't having any of it.

Thirteen Ball

31.05.2006, 16:09

Beckham's just signed his own death warrant as a central midfielder for me. Ever since he got this duff Idea of coming inside and running throuhg the middle, he's been rubbish, as he was for the forst forty minutes. (although being fair, all 20 outfield players were pretty awful for those forty minutes!)

As soon as he dropped wide and started swinging crosses in, it was like england were a team again. Come on Sven! The crossed ball is one of our greatest strengths as a footballing nation, so let's play to it. As Beckham proved again last night, there's no-one in the world hits a sweeter cross than him.

Now we've got him back out on the wing where he belongs, let's try and keep him there eh Mr Eriksson? Let the boy do what he does best.

Carragher in midfield and Gerrard up front? Both did very well considering how far out of position they played, but neither fully got to Grips with the differences, and it really was asking a lot that they would. Neither made a howler though.

PS - Re Theo Walcott. Does anyone know if any other player has made a full england international appearance without a single top division appearance under his belt?

stevetrom

31.05.2006, 16:34

Carragher in midfield and Gerrard up front? Both did very well considering how far out of position they played, but neither fully got to Grips with the differences, and it really was asking a lot that they would. Neither made a howler though.

Carragher did OK, but he is a central defender and played like one, fine defensively but was severely lacking when in possetion. I could see him as an option either against a really good team or if we were under pressure but if we are trying to actuallly win a game we must have a more positive player in that position - just don't ask me who?

PS - Re Theo Walcott. Does anyone know if any other player has made a full england international appearance without a single top division appearance under his belt?

if Darren Bent or Jermaine Defoe had come on and made the same, very limited, impression what would the reaction have been?

Just because someone is very young and inexperienced they should NOT be treated any differently to any other player, he has been picked in an England squad and therefore should be expected to perform like an international player, otherwise what is he doing there?

Cornishwomble

31.05.2006, 16:44

Well i was at the game last night and got to finally make up my mind about a couple of players.

I've never liked Owen Hargreaves in the side, I never see him do anything positive. I've heard all the stuff about him playing well for Bayern but I don't think it translates well into international football. I watched him "live" last night so got to watch him when the cameras wouldn't normally be on him. I still think he's no use for England. He never set up any attacks as you would expect from a holding midfielder like Makele or Hamann and only seemed to pass the ball sideways or backwards. I think Carrick would have done a better job.
He gave the ball away that caused Sol Campbell to commit to the tackle that got him the yellow card and when Hargreaves wasn't on the ball his positioning was rubbish. I think the fact that he's never played in the premiership or in any league with English players in means that he doesn't seem to have a notion of what the England style of play is.

I was in 2 minds before this game about Crouch and whether he should be in the squad and I'm happy to say that I'm now a convert. I think 5-4-1 is not right for England but Crouch and Owen together will be a good combination i na 4-4-2 (just my personal opinion). I also feel that Walcott is an excellent addition to the squad and will defintately be a good "secret" weapon to bring on for the last 20 minutes or so.

We played really well last night and I think people forget that these games are the equivalent of pre-season friendlies for our club sides. The team is gelling together and no-body is going to play with blood and thunder and risk injury. At times last night our team play was excellent at times it wasn't there at all, but that's what these warm up games are for, to get a group of players who don't play together week in and week out to gell and towards the end of the game last night it was showing signs of coming together.

As for people like madandcrazyclive, please change your nationality cos I really get embarrassed about English supporters like you. You never see Scottish , Welsh and Irish fans slagging of their team before games. It's so lazy to say England won't win the World Cup. The odds say we are more likely not to win it. But what about getting behind the team and dreaming, that's what football is about. Showing obvious signs of glee about the thought of coming 4th is outrageous. I daresay when we get knocked out you'll be on here "crowing" about how right you were.

I think we'll win our group, we've got the better team in it and even if we draw against Sweden who are our nearest rivals i think we'll still top the group. I think we can beat either Poland or Germany in the 2nd round, becasue Poland aren't anything special and Germany haven't got a good team and will be under too much pressure from the home fans.

After that we'll be in the quarter finals and only 2 games away from the final, who knows what will happen then. Maybe we'll get thumped and go out but the football romantic in me will always want to believe we'll go further. I'd rather think this way and look a mug if we go out early than to come on here and slag off my country!

P.S. I would have flashed for you Crawf but I was too busy doing the Mexican wave!

2nd man down

31.05.2006, 16:45

Just because someone is very young and inexperienced they should NOT be treated any differently to any other player, he has been picked in an England squad and therefore should be expected to perform like an international player, otherwise what is he doing there?

Exactly. It all boils down to the reasoning behind his selection. Lets hope he's there for his potential greatness rather than his scapegoatability.

Thirteen Ball

31.05.2006, 16:50

if Darren Bent or Jermaine Defoe had come on and made the same, very limited, impression what would the reaction have been?

Just because someone is very young and inexperienced they should NOT be treated any differently to any other player, he has been picked in an England squad and therefore should be expected to perform like an international player, otherwise what is he doing there?

Oh, my sentiments exactly sir! Don't get me wrong, he'd have been a way down in my list, simply because he's unproven against quality opposition. I'd have taken Ameobi myself because he's had a pretty fine season while owen's been 'injured.' Shades of Darren Anderton methinks?

I wasn't trying to big the lad up or anything. All I was wondering (in a John Motson statistical kinda way) Is who was the last full england international who'd not made a top-level appearance at club level?

Cornishwomble

31.05.2006, 16:52

Oh, my sentiments exactly sir! Don't get me wrong, he'd have been a way down in my list, simply because he's unproven against quality opposition. I'd have taken Ameobi myself because he's had a pretty fine season while owen's been 'injured.' Shades of Darren Anderton methinks?

I wasn't trying to big the lad up or anything. All I was wondering (in a John Motson statistical kinda way) Is who was the last full england international who'd not made a top-level appearance at club level?

Steve Bull (Wolves)

2nd man down

31.05.2006, 16:55

Steve Bull (Wolves)

*coughs* BOC!! :biggrin:

IYOUNG

31.05.2006, 17:04

I'd have taken Ameobi myself because he's had a pretty fine season while owen's been 'injured.

Give me strength!!!!!!! Ameobi....................................you aren't serious I hope

Thirteen Ball

31.05.2006, 17:12

Steve Bull (Wolves)

May 1989 against scotland, so could well have been the last one to do it. Any adcance on Steve Bull?

Just noticed....At the time he was playing in the old division 2, but he, and wolves, had been in div 3 and 4 the years before! :shock: What are the chances of an england coach even watching those divisions today?

madandcrazytromboneguy

31.05.2006, 21:51

heres a question for ya all

the most complete:

central defence partnership
defensive and attackin midfield pairing
strikeforce

Italy's nesta and cannavaro defence is still the best i reckon, might only have 1 more euro to go though after the w.c. before italy start trying other central defenders

France's makelele/vieira and zidane partnership is still really formidable, again, age should be against them though, another euro after this w.c. before they need others

Brazil's adriano and robinho, whether they will play together in this w.c. is debatable coz of their other quality strikers but theres goals galore in these 2

which 3 pairs will you all come up with?

will anyone risk an england 1-2-3 of terry/rio, gerrard/lampard, owen/rooney?, i persoanlly would not go with it, mine are listed above ;)

ps just so you know, it has to be players picked in the squads for this years world cup, baring in mind fitness, form, and how many games they are likely to play etc.

Bungle

16.06.2006, 09:31

Well we're through, but not very convincing. Hope Lampard improves in front of goal. With three players on yellow cards and a possible suspsension if they get another in the Sweden game, it will be interesting to see the team selection.

Delbert

16.06.2006, 09:48

Bungle,

All yellow cards are wiped out after the group stage, so everyone starts with a 'clean slate' in the knockout stages.

Bungle

16.06.2006, 10:03

Bungle,

All yellow cards are wiped out after the group stage, so everyone starts with a 'clean slate' in the knockout stages.

Partly correct Delbert. From what I heard on the TV, if one of the three on a yellow card gets another one in the Sweden game, they will miss the first game of the next stage. So we might see Gerrard and Crouch only play part of the game.

Anno Draconis

16.06.2006, 10:26

Yellow cards are wiped out at the end of the group stages but suspensions are not, so anyone who gets a second yellow in the last match will still be suspended for the 2nd round.

However, in contrast to the gloomy whining in my office this morning, I'm fairly upbeat. Played 2, won 2, no major injuries, no red cards, 6 points, qualification sorted, job done. England can go into the Sweden match under no pressure and are free to leave out the yellow carded players. I suspect we'll see Owen/Rooney start with Crouch "rested" and Walcott may even get a game.

OK it wasn't pretty, classy football, but England haven't won their opening 2 matches since 1982; in 1990 the playing was dreadful in the opening stages and England scraped through, then toiled against Belgium. Nonetheless we eventually got to the semi final.

The only teams to look good so far are Argentina and Spain. The common factor there is that both teams were playing tough opposition. Teams that have played so-called "easy" teams have struggled, because the lesser teams raise their games and the better teams are trying to do just enough without sweating blood.

Bring on Germany in the second round, 'cos they look seriuosly beatable. Like England they will get better towards the latter stages so let's get rid of them now!

nickjones

16.06.2006, 10:27

May 1989 against scotland, so could well have been the last one to do it. Any adcance on Steve Bull?

Just noticed....At the time he was playing in the old division 2, but he, and wolves, had been in div 3 and 4 the years before! :shock: What are the chances of an england coach even watching those divisions today?

Steve Bull MBE
Steve Bull was born in Tipton on the 28th March, 1965. He was to become the greatest goalscorer in the long and eventful history of Wolverhampton Wanderers. Steve first played football for his school teams, Ocker Hill infants and then Willingsworth High School, as well as for two local junior teams, Red Lion and Newey Goodman.

He joined Tipton Town after leaving school and his goal scoring exploits for them were noted by one of West Bromwich's scouts and he signed professional forms for the Albion in August, 1985. In nine games for them he scored 3 goals before, on the 20th November, 1986, he came to Molineux along with Andy Thompson in a deal set up by Graham Turner.

Steve made his debut against Wrexham just 2 days later in a Wolves side that was struggling in the mid-table region of the 4th division and a crowd of just over 5,000 at Molineux saw them go down 3-0 in a dismal and depressing game. Worse was to come on the following Monday evening as the cup-tied Bull was forced to watch from the stand as Wolves suffered the worst humiliation in their history as they crashed out of the FA Cup to non-League Chorley.

He came straight back into the team and scored his first goal for Wolves in early December in a Freight Rover Trophy game at Cardiff. Then, 11 days later, he got his first League goal in a 1-0 away win at Hartlepool.

He got another 5 goals in 11 matches before the game at the beginning of February, 1987, against Stockport at Molineux, which many people saw as the turning point for the club.

Wolves were one down with less than 15 minutes to go when they suddenly clicked into gear and scored three, Steve Bull one of the goalgetters. Wanderers then only lost three of the 22 games they played in the remainder of the season. They just missed out on promotion and then lost the play-off final to Aldershot. Bull scored 11 goals in those games giving him a total of 19 in his first season at Molineux. In the final league game he got his first hat trick for the club in a 4-1 Molineux victory over Hartlepool.

Steve had started to win many admirers amongst the Wolves support, but in season 1987/88 he was to become a hero. Wolves stormed to the Fourth Division Championship and also enjoyed a trip to Wembley where they beat Burnley to win the Sherpa Van Trophy. Bull scored 34 league goals, three in the FA Cup, three in the Littlewoods Cup and 12 in the Sherpa Van Trophy giving him an incredible total of 52.

He was the first player to score 50 league and cup goals in an English season since Peterborough's Terry Bly almost 30 years earlier. The following season saw him score four hat tricks and two four goal hauls as Wolves swept to the Third Division title and came within a whisker of a Wembley return. This time he ended the term with 50 goals. The last time any player had scored 50 in two consecutive seasons was Middlesbrough's George Camsell in the mid 1920's.

His goalscoring exploits led to him being chosen to play for his country, firstly at Under 21 level, then, in May 1989, at full level when he came on a substitute at Hampden Park and smashed in a goal against the Scots to help silence the critics who had claimed that he could only score in the lower leagues. In April, 1990, he scored two against Czechoslovakia at Wembley to clinch a place on the plane to Italy for the World Cup Finals. In all he won 13 full caps, eight of them after coming on as substitute, and he scored four goals. He also made several appearances for the England B team.

In 1992, Bull broke the Wolves goalscoring record set by former Molineux idol, John Richards, when he netted his 195th goal for the club that he always remained loyal to after resisting the temptation to join clubs in the Premiership on several occasions. In February, 1998, he scored his 300th goal for Wolves, and six months later he notched his 18th hat-trick for the side in a game against Barnet.

But a knee injury failed to respond to surgery and he was forced to hang up his boots in the summer of 1999 at the age of 35. He returned to the field of play to make several appearances for Conference League Hereford United the following season before quitting again and concentrating on his work at Molineux in a PR capacity. He still turns out for the former players team in charity matches.

His loyalty to Wolves, his goal scoring exploits and charity work contributed to Bully, as he is still affectionately known by the fans, being awarded the MBE in the Millennium New Year's honours list.

WOLVES PLAYING CAREER 1986-1999
League Appearances 461(13) Goals 250
FA Cup Appearances 18(2) Goals 7
League Cup Appearances 32(1) Goals 18
Other Appearances 34 Goals 31
13 full England Caps 4 goals ( 1 voted in top 50 England goals of all time)
TOTAL APPEARANCES 545(16)GOALS 306