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Andy_Euph
07.11.2005, 21:13
its called ANGLIAN DANCES! it also has Keel Row and a few other tunes running through it. And even though it "obvious a piece for lower level bands." There are 5 movements and the last movement id love to seea youth band unless it was someone like the national youth band! It has alot of difficult music in for those younger less experienced players! The only reason there is repetition is too make it more joyful for an audience and the band. And from a fourth section band with a lot of young players playing the test piece they are struggling with it because they are young, (youngest at 10). And a testpiece is set to challenge the section it is wrote for.

Actually the reason for repetition is more likely to be easier to play, if you are able to one phrase then by reason you should be able to play it over and over again. Plus repetition is a fundemental part of composition anyway.

My comments weren't negative just stating things as I know them, but I disagree with you that youth bands would struggle with this piece.

However if its picked for an area contest it obviously has challenges in relation to tuning, balance, ensemble etc

JR
07.11.2005, 23:43
[QUOTE=Andy_Euph]I

! and all the changes in time signatures I reckon will also foil some bands making it a bit easier for the adjudicator(s)!

How can it possibly foil the bands/conductors when all they have to do is copy the cd!!!
...cue my call for the "regionals" cd to be banned - fat chance one would presume...

john r

WoodenFlugel
16.12.2005, 16:25
We have noticed a number of errata requests and suggestions for the 2006 Area test pieces appearing on tMP over the last few weeks. We have decided to start a separate thread for each of the pieces so you can add any queries or suggestions for errata there. The threads are here:

Journey to the Centre of the Earth (http://www.themouthpiece.com/vb/showthread.php?t=18243)
Voyage of Discovery (http://www.themouthpiece.com/vb/showthread.php?t=18244)
Images of the Millenium (http://www.themouthpiece.com/vb/showthread.php?t=18245)
Entertainments (http://www.themouthpiece.com/vb/showthread.php?t=18246)
Anglian Dances (http://www.themouthpiece.com/vb/showthread.php?t=18248)

Please use this thread for general discussion about the pieces.

euphnut
18.12.2005, 01:25
Agree with Johnford, Semi's at the beginning and solos!!! but fantastic piece. I am spending at least 45 minutes a day practicing both the semi's and the solos!! I think that is the only way that it can be done. I just hope that all players think the same way. The VoD is one of the most musically pleasant pieces to have been chosen and should be great to rehearse. Good luck everyone and enjoy.

Ian

Vickitorious
18.12.2005, 23:11
Woooooo!! I'm looking forward to it so much!! Can't wait to get up there and play it!

Mums been going on about it tonight though... she's got the runs! :rolleyes:

Pythagoras
03.01.2006, 14:20
Looking forward to getting back into contest mode. Only had one brief play through Anglian Dances, looks a decent test (harder than the piece at Pontins, but still playable). Last movement looks fun for us basses.

HBB
03.01.2006, 14:54
Having not (being allowed) to play for the last month, Bring on Journey!! There's only 17 rips into the gods and enough C#s to loose my lip after one through, but, I can't wait, my first areas in the championship section! :d

Charmed
03.01.2006, 22:33
Having not (being allowed) to play for the last month, Bring on Journey!! There's only 17 rips into the gods and enough C#s to loose my lip after one through, but, I can't wait, my first areas in the championship section! :d

Yeh, I'm looking forward to all those top c#s too!! :icon_rolleyes:

HBB
03.01.2006, 22:39
Better than 3 figures! I tell thee!

Steve
04.01.2006, 00:06
I had a blow through the 1st section piece the other day and it really is quite nice. I was very sceptical as many will recall and I stick by some of my earlier comments but overall it is a good test and a good piece generally. The semis are still gonna hurt a lot of bands though and the soloists are gonna have to be on top of their game. All the best to the competing bands and I hope you enjoy it for weeks on end as much as I did for 1 rehearsal.

welshraz
04.01.2006, 15:06
I would just like to know.....are we the only band not to have started looking at our respective test piece yet? I am not sure we will even have our regular conductor available until February!!

stevetrom
06.01.2006, 17:56
I would just like to know.....are we the only band not to have started looking at our respective test piece yet? I am not sure we will even have our regular conductor available until February!!

the amount of time a band spends preparing for the areas is affected by so many variables

- section
- player ability/availability
- difficulty of piece
- likelihood of promotion (or relegation!)
- how 'serious' the band is about contesting

we will have our 1st proper look at it tonight (I think) although we had the parts handed out and a run through before christmas

WoodenFlugel
07.01.2006, 00:21
Ok having played Images a few times now I feel I have to ask the rest of you 2nd sectioners:

Don't you think its a little....well.....how do I put this?.....er......flippin' difficult??? :eek:

OK so the Flugel gets away with just a couple of tricky bars here and there, and its a big blow at the end, but even my part has stuff much more difficult than the pieces we were playing in the first section two years ago - as for the front row...and the Eb bass part...and the Euphs...in fact most of the band....

Now I have supported choosing tougher pieces for the areas in the past, as I feel a tough piece will make the result less of a lottery, however if the piece is too hard and no-one can play it on the day then the result suddenly becomes a lottery again. I've not spent a whole lot of time looking at Images, but I do feel on the time I have spent, it will be a huge ask, even for the very best 2nd section bands to produce a decent performace of it come contest day. Thoughts???

MickM
07.01.2006, 01:29
and the Eb bass part
WOW!
We were handed some parts for Images last night for a conductors masterclass with Dr Roy Newsome that we are doing in 8 days :eek:
flippin eck all right!
Best of luck to you guy's in the 2nd section. I'm listening to it at the moment and yes Ian, that is going to take some playing!

Good Luck!

Mick

Pav
07.01.2006, 16:58
Hi Ian, I've got to agree it could get ugly come March.

Not had much experience of 2nd section pieces in recent years but I would have thought it was the equal of Passacaglia or Coventry Variations in the 1st section, certainly in terms of stamina.

On the bright side it's a cracking piece of music, especially the 2nd mvmt.

Pav
Unity Brass

sniperjp
07.01.2006, 23:16
The Anglian Dances part was right

iancwilx
08.01.2006, 11:27
[QUOTE=WoodenFlugel]the ...and the Eb bass part... QUOTE]

You're not kidding - looks like I might have to triple tongue most of the 1st Movement and perhaps part of the last.
We have only blown through it once before Christmas but it is very much more technically difficult than say Royal Parks which I thought to be too easy for 1st Section. ( Though we did qualify on it !!)
In fact, Images is possibly harder than any 1st Section Area pieces that I have played in the past, so how 2nd Section bands will deal with it will be interesting to say the least !!!
- Wilky

Di
08.01.2006, 18:16
The Anglian Dances part was right

Our B Band should be getting this out to start on tomorrow. Anyone tell me what the kit part is like? If there's not much going on, I'm in for an ear bashing for the next two months from my little 'un.

stevetrom
09.01.2006, 09:59
...... much more difficult than the pieces we were playing in the first section two years ago - as for the front row...and the Eb bass part...and the Euphs...in fact most of the band....


but nor this years piece I would guess.

Everyone I have spoken too seems to think Voyage of Discovery is the hardest 1st Section piece for quite a while (probably since Ballet for Band), it is certainly a step up from Comedy, Coventry Variations, etc. (I can't remember what was before that)

WhatSharp?
09.01.2006, 20:12
Ok having played Images a few times now I feel I have to ask the rest of you 2nd sectioners:

Don't you think its a little....well.....how do I put this?.....er......flippin' difficult??? :eek:

OK so the Flugel gets away with just a couple of tricky bars here and there, and its a big blow at the end, but even my part has stuff much more difficult than the pieces we were playing in the first section two years ago - as for the front row...and the Eb bass part...and the Euphs...in fact most of the band....

Now I have supported choosing tougher pieces for the areas in the past, as I feel a tough piece will make the result less of a lottery, however if the piece is too hard and no-one can play it on the day then the result suddenly becomes a lottery again. I've not spent a whole lot of time looking at Images, but I do feel on the time I have spent, it will be a huge ask, even for the very best 2nd section bands to produce a decent performace of it come contest day. Thoughts???

Totally agree Ian, I thought last year was bad enough, but this is just plain daft.

HBB
09.01.2006, 20:17
Played through Journey to the Centre of the Earth last night. What an amazing piece, and isn't actually that difficult, just the putting together will be hard I think (oh, and the massive percussion parts!)

Bring on March :D

madandcrazytromboneguy
09.01.2006, 20:20
HIIIIIIII FOOOOOOOOOLKS, IMMMMMMMMM BAAAAAAAAACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

soz guys just had 2months off coz my pc broke but anyway, here we go

my band have had several go's at voyage, every part has something long and hard to do apart from trombones, their hard part is about 2lines long lol

ive also applied to conduct a 4th section band so i may be doing both playing and conducting for the area.

either way im looking forward to the yorkshire area, bradford is my favourite stage to play on. excellent stuff!

rutty
10.01.2006, 17:59
Totally agree Ian, I thought last year was bad enough, but this is just plain daft.

It's certainly tough but I think it is playable for most bands in the second section. I'm playing the 3/4 Solo cornet part and it's one hell of a test for me and I'm loving it! Last year's test piece was my favourite ever that I've played and I think that this year's may surpass it.

I think it'll sort them out at the contest for sure. Bring it on! :cool:

hellraiser
11.01.2006, 00:13
Voyage... after looking at the score I noticed that there's only 3 cornet lines going on for most of the piece. The top solo cornet part does get quite high in places, above top C a couple of times, so it was comforting to find that Sop has the same part as top solo cornet usually :-)

ScreamingSop
11.01.2006, 00:46
but nor this years piece I would guess.

Everyone I have spoken too seems to think Voyage of Discovery is the hardest 1st Section piece for quite a while (probably since Ballet for Band), it is certainly a step up from Comedy, Coventry Variations, etc. (I can't remember what was before that)

Nah not as hard as Coventry at all
Its tricky piece but having played it before, i would no way put it as one of the hardest area pieces for 1st section in the past few years,

persins
11.01.2006, 15:16
Played through Journey to the Centre of the Earth last night. What an amazing piece, and isn't actually that difficult, just the putting together will be hard I think (oh, and the massive percussion parts!)

Bring on March :D

I think the same thing actually. There are the odd few tricky bits though!! I was looking at the 2nd cornet part last night and have just about managed to get the sextuplets up to about half speed now!!
I'm not breaking out the spare pants just yet. Typical Peter Graham though with the compound times all over the place. I can't wait to get in amongst it properly.

HBB
11.01.2006, 15:30
Tell me about it!

123, 12 34, 123, 12, 345, 123, 123, 1234, 12 345, *rip up to the heavens*, 123, 1234, 12345!!!

iancwilx
11.01.2006, 16:53
Does anyone know anything about the rumours currently circulating about bands dropping out of the Yorkshire 2nd Section Area Contest due to the difficulty of the test piece ?
- Wilky

persins
11.01.2006, 17:20
Tell me about it!

123, 12 34, 123, 12, 345, 123, 123, 1234, 12 345, *rip up to the heavens*, 123, 1234, 12345!!!

That's even more confusing than trying to workout the meter changes!!

HBB
11.01.2006, 17:31
:P

(Back on Topic now.. before we get shouted at by les Gods)

welshraz
11.01.2006, 17:42
Still no sign of the test piece for us...its on order.....I am quite keen to see it. Does anyone know what the sop part is like for Anglian Dances?

Di
11.01.2006, 21:33
:P

(Back on Topic now.. before we get shouted at by les Gods)

Surprisingly Ben, you ARE still on topic. ;) You are after all, discussing the area test piece, which IS the title of this thread. :rolleyes:

But now, ^ post is another matter .... that one is "off topic". ;)

McEuphie
12.01.2006, 13:47
Glad to see a bit of interest in the 4th section.

Anglian dances is a good musical piece and the Sop part is quite good - a couple of little solo bits.

Hope you enjoy it.

Cheers

McEuphie
Barnton Silver Band

jonford
12.01.2006, 19:48
Nah not as hard as Coventry at all
Its tricky piece but having played it before, i would no way put it as one of the hardest area pieces for 1st section in the past few years,

I disagree :) I think that Voyage is equally as hard, if not harder than Coventry, but i suppose it varies from part to part. Good piece though, im getting into it now :clap:

welshraz
13.01.2006, 12:00
Glad to see a bit of interest in the 4th section.

Anglian dances is a good musical piece and the Sop part is quite good - a couple of little solo bits.

Hope you enjoy it.


Cheers! I love getting a new test piece, gives me something to focus on. Hopefully Anglian Dances will be here for our next rehearsal on Monday.

Baritonedeaf
13.01.2006, 21:00
Entertainments is superb - I am a real fan of the March - sounds great.

Some tricky bits in the 1st movement - but a great Baritone Solo - second year running as well :-)

I wonder if it will be as much fun to work on as Tam O'Shanter? On first playing it sounds like it will be. Nice one.

persins
13.01.2006, 21:42
played through Journey to the centre of the earth again last night!
I actually got the sextuplets in time and all present and correct:woo
Only the first ones though, at minim =63. still nowhere near the ones later on at crothet = 172! :frown:
I will get there though!

Cochyn
15.01.2006, 17:38
VOYAGE OF DISCOVERY - GOFF RICHARDS

A great piece, enjoying it very much. A nice easy part for the Flugel for a change! lol

A bit gutted the front row cornet part was not given to the Flugel also....

Looking forward to it!

vonny
16.01.2006, 14:00
I am really enjoying practicing 'Voyage of Discovery' I have to say that when i first saw it i didn't think i would be able to play it - especially the opening... I have found that it isn't that difficult really, but i am going to crack on with the practicing - hopefully i will play it to perfection on contest day.

Yvonne x

stevetrom
16.01.2006, 14:05
hopefully i will play it to perfection on contest day.


to perfection ! good luck :D

does anyone know who is in the box at midlands area 1st section ?

I hope we going to get someone who will 'appreciate' this kind of modern music !

Key2207
16.01.2006, 19:06
to perfection ! good luck :D

does anyone know who is in the box at midlands area 1st section ?

I hope we going to get someone who will 'appreciate' this kind of modern music !

Maybe not perfect - but i just want to play it right :D

Oh and just as an aside - didn't you say you would buy me a beverage when we met !!!!!;)
Ooops why have i replied through Keely's log in..
It's not Keely who wants a beverage it's me :)

Yvonne x

Baritonedeaf
16.01.2006, 19:42
It will be two people in the Midlands matey, or so i was led to believe - should be interesting?

WoodenFlugel
16.01.2006, 22:59
It will be two people in the Midlands matey, or so i was led to believe - should be interesting?

Yup. Correct. It is two adjudicators for all sections in the Midlands (who said "about time too"?) but they haven't announced who they are yet. Going on past years they normally leave it quite late to announce the names too.

stevetrom
17.01.2006, 09:29
good news about 2 adjudicators, but it would ne nice to know who.


as for playing to perfection, listen out for my version of the bass trom part in the trio, I'm sure it will be perfect (IMHO) :eek:

welshraz
17.01.2006, 13:01
Finally got to run through Anglian Dances last night. It's ok. Nowhere near as hard as last years 4th section choice or as difficult as some of the own choice pieces we have been playing. To be honest, I quite like it!

Bassintheballroom
17.01.2006, 13:47
Am getting into Images of the Millenium now. It's my first year in the 2nd section and I can see it being rather hard work ;)

Also, as an Eb player, that'll teach me for complaining about how much of a test some recent pieces (3rd section) have been for the Eb...

CubbRep
17.01.2006, 18:48
Had 1st practice on Friday and blew through Anglian Dances.It didn't sound too bad for a 1st rehearsal.To me it is a nice piece,but as you say it is nowhere near as hard as last years.But one thing I will say;It needs to be played and played in tune throughout the band.There are one or two exposed parts that will need to be played and well.

Richard...CubbRep

JulieSanderson
17.01.2006, 21:49
Entertainments is superb - I am a real fan of the March - sounds great.

Some tricky bits in the 1st movement - but a great Baritone Solo - second year running as well :-)

I wonder if it will be as much fun to work on as Tam O'Shanter? On first playing it sounds like it will be. Nice one.

I've really enjoyed playing Vizcaya/Tam the last couple of years - both had decent 1st Bari parts - but first impressions of Entertainments is that the 1st bari part is great - really interesting little bits all the way through, some lovely tunes (and shock, even a few nice wee solo lines) - and trickier than it looked, especially the 1st movement! So much better than the off beats in Northern Landscapes and St Austells!

Baritonedeaf
17.01.2006, 23:17
RE: Entertainments - 1st Bari part...

The fiendish bit is in the 1st movement - the semi quaver section with all the flats in it - the Cbs and Gbs just don't sit under the valves imo, getting there, but slowly. I am loving the Solo section of the though - a real chance to show off with all those rising passages.

Nice melody in the 2nd movement and the small ensemble to start and finish the movement is a realy nice part.

I still love the final theme of the march though the G down to G runnning up to a Super C and then the turn - sounds awesome at FF! Really looking forward to playing it on stage. I predict a poor Bari part in the 3rd Section next year - so we will have to get promoted! (Have had an influx of quality players though so its a possibility...)

JulieSanderson - have you heard the recording on the Regionals CD? Not very impressed with the playing there - the 1st top A of the Solo just isn't there... Good luck with it - sectionals for us tomorrow night - hoepfully to nail those flats!

Pythagoras
18.01.2006, 09:56
I've really enjoyed playing Vizcaya/Tam the last couple of years - both had decent 1st Bari parts - but first impressions of Entertainments is that the 1st bari part is great - really interesting little bits all the way through, some lovely tunes (and shock, even a few nice wee solo lines) - and trickier than it looked, especially the 1st movement! So much better than the off beats in Northern Landscapes and St Austells!

Aagh! St Austell. My first ever contest. Only started playing the Euph again 2 months before it, after not playing anything for 4 years. Probably no coincidence that we got relegated.

Pythagoras
18.01.2006, 09:59
Had 1st practice on Friday and blew through Anglian Dances.It didn't sound too bad for a 1st rehearsal.To me it is a nice piece,but as you say it is nowhere near as hard as last years.But one thing I will say;It needs to be played and played in tune throughout the band.There are one or two exposed parts that will need to be played and well.

Richard...CubbRep

Its got a hard act to follow. Divertimento was a cracking piece. Really tested the bands, but I thought that resulted in a pretty decent standard of play ( at least in the midlands 4th), certainly compared to the year before on the much easier Partita.

Bass part in last movement looks quite fun.

Andy_Euph
18.01.2006, 16:46
Anyone else think that the final movement of Anglian Dances sounds a bit like the theme music to Harry Enfield and Chums??

Every time I hear it I want to shout "The shows not over til the fat bloke sings" :biggrin:

JulieSanderson
18.01.2006, 17:59
Aagh! St Austell. My first ever contest. Only started playing the Euph again 2 months before it, after not playing anything for 4 years. Probably no coincidence that we got relegated.

Funny that - I wasn't too bothered one way or t'other about St Austells - but it did provide me with my only (to date!) trip to the Nationals - Shotts St Patricks (my last band) were the Scottish winners that year from a number 1 draw....

Baritonedeaf.....those 1st movement accidentals are EVIL!!!!! Sectional on Sat morning.....and I'm going out on Friday night...maybe my fingers will work better if they're still drunk?!?!?!?!?

Baritonedeaf
18.01.2006, 19:30
If i am still alive after tonights sectional i will share my secret Julie! :biggrin:

jonford
18.01.2006, 21:41
Anyone else think that the final movement of Anglian Dances sounds a bit like the theme music to Harry Enfield and Chums??

Every time I hear it I want to shout "The shows not over til the fat bloke sings" :biggrin:

Yes I thought the same! sounds like a good piece but lots of snippets from other works!

Baritonedeaf
18.01.2006, 23:49
No secret Jen - i am just going to practise!

bumperman
19.01.2006, 04:18
:confused:

:-?

Is there any truth to the rumour regarding the Yorkshire 2nd section this year? Does anyone know if any of the bands are dropping out of the contest?

Wakefield Metropolitan are definately going!

Lauradoll
19.01.2006, 11:23
We've not even got Journey out yet. Aargh!

iancwilx
19.01.2006, 15:34
:confused:

:-?

Is there any truth to the rumour regarding the Yorkshire 2nd section this year? Does anyone know if any of the bands are dropping out of the contest?

Wakefield Metropolitan are definately going!

Kippax are definately there.
- Wilky

stevetrom
19.01.2006, 16:51
:confused:

:-?

Is there any truth to the rumour regarding the Yorkshire 2nd section this year? Does anyone know if any of the bands are dropping out of the contest?

Wakefield Metropolitan are definately going!

why would a band not go to the Areas? (apart from the obvious of a serious lack of players)

iancwilx
19.01.2006, 17:04
why would a band not go to the Areas? (apart from the obvious of a serious lack of players)


There are some who are of the opinion that the difficulties of the test piece are beyond the technical abilities of a lot of 2nd Section Bands - in short - they can't play it !!
- Wilky

starperformer
19.01.2006, 17:07
why would a band not go to the Areas? (apart from the obvious of a serious lack of players)
if you can't/don't want to play it, and know a few other like-minded bands, you can all not go, save the hassle, and not do too badly in the grading tables.

stevetrom
19.01.2006, 17:14
There are some who are of the opinion that the difficulties of the test piece are beyond the technical abilities of a lot of 2nd Section Bands - in short - they can't play it !!
- Wilky

I don't know the piece, is it really that hard?

Surely if every band is playing the same piece it is just as difficult for everyone. If you take part in a running race where the course was so difficult you felt you had to walk some of it would you not take part?

Is this just an issue in Yorkshire? I thought that Yorkshire was one of the strongest areas, are other areas having the same problems?

WoodenFlugel
19.01.2006, 18:00
It is a hard piece - technically much harder than the Vaughan Williams of last year (which 4BarsRest thought was too hard too, although I thought it was about right) and I think harder than Coventry Variations for more people in the band. But I don't understand why that would cause a mass exodus of bands from the section. One or two might not fancy it, but it is a level playing field for all and, if anything, I feel a piece that all but the very best bands in the section (ie effectively 1st section anyway) will struggle with is more likely to throw up a few surprises when the results are given out. If I were making the decisions in a "borderline" band that thought alone would persuade me to have a go - even if you come last you're still one place better off than not going at all - and in the Midlands sections at least one place can be quite significant.

As player with given this piece to play, I'm enjoying the challenge of Images so far - I do think its a huge ask for most 2nd section bands though. For instance, I would think there are a number of 2nd section bands who have 3rd cornets / 2nd Baritones / 2nd horns who can't triple tongue at all, let alone triple tongue neatly at pp, at the required speed, whilst changing notes. Personally it took me more than 3 months to learn that technique properlys (some might say I never have learnt it), so I think its a little unrealistic to pick a piece with a limited deadline to play and expect payers to learn new techniques to be able to play it. There's nothing wrong with pushing the standard, but it must be done in a sensible and sympathetic way IMO.

starperformer
19.01.2006, 18:08
It could just be fatigue at getting rubbish pieces year after year - particularly if you are unlucky (in hindsight) with promotion or relegation. Think of all the other things you could be doing while not learning to play a hard testpiece badly at the areas - do some concerts, make a recording, kick back with your family and friends, etc. etc.

At the end of the day if a number of bands were to collaborate in not going, they would all be better off for that fact - manipulating the rules effectively and voting with their feet.

WoodenFlugel
19.01.2006, 18:29
It could just be fatigue at getting rubbish pieces year after year - particularly if you are unlucky (in hindsight) with promotion or relegation. Think of all the other things you could be doing while not learning to play a hard testpiece badly at the areas - do some concerts, make a recording, kick back with your family and friends, etc. etc.

At the end of the day if a number of bands were to collaborate in not going, they would all be better off for that fact - manipulating the rules effectively and voting with their feet.

I can sympathise and agree with your first point, there is noting worse than bashing through a piece for weeks on end and making no impression on it. But I'm not so sure about the collaborated withdrawal - all I can see is that it would screw all of the withdrawing bands for at least the following 2 years. If [say] ten bands withdraw then they will all get one place after last place, but it will also affect the average grading in the sections, meaning the relegated and promoted bands will still be in the same position in the section in relation to the withdrawing bands.

I can only speak in the Midlands case here, but generally, if you've got a placing much lower than the average in the section, until you have got rid of that placing you will not be promoted out of the section, unless you win and are very fortunate with the other results. In fact it works the other way - that placeing tends to drag you into relegation problems. I personally would risk a bands future on a point of principle about one test piece selection.

ruthatron
19.01.2006, 22:49
As player with given this piece to play, I'm enjoying the challenge of Images so far - I do think its a huge ask for most 2nd section bands though. For instance, I would think there are a number of 2nd section bands who have 3rd cornets / 2nd Baritones / 2nd horns who can't triple tongue at all, let alone triple tongue neatly at pp, at the required speed, whilst changing notes. Personally it took me more than 3 months to learn that technique properlys (some might say I never have learnt it), so I think its a little unrealistic to pick a piece with a limited deadline to play and expect payers to learn new techniques to be able to play it. There's nothing wrong with pushing the standard, but it must be done in a sensible and sympathetic way IMO.

i know it will be a tough piece, with some very tricky moments (including the opening, getting that clean and tidy could be tricky for many bands). there is nothing wrong with pushing the standard on, but if you push too hard, how many bands (especially in the lower sections) won't want promotion, because the challenge would be too difficult.

starperformer
20.01.2006, 12:23
Depends partly what you consider to be more of a risk to your bands future
* no chance of promotion/possibility of going down a section
* weeks/months of boring rehearsals on a piece that everyone hates; poor quality end product

Mass withdrawal would make a much stronger statement to the selectors of next year's pieces than turning up and playing badly.

WoodenFlugel
20.01.2006, 12:31
OK we're going to have to agree to differ here, but I will ask one thing. How many times have you spoken to a player from another band to be told "we're not going to such and such a contest" only to find yourself competing against them on the day? I would rather not risk relegation - however important or otherwise that may be to you - on the word of someone who is just trying to get rid of some competition.

Pythagoras
20.01.2006, 14:23
Would never pull out of the area just because I didn't like the piece. You would get about 20 points in midlands 4th and never get promoted.

iancwilx
20.01.2006, 16:28
Would never pull out of the area just because I didn't like the piece. You would get about 20 points in midlands 4th and never get promoted.

I don't think it's a case of not liking the piece.
It's more a case of the technicalities of the piece being beyond some bands talents, and they don't want to go on stage and give an embarrassing shambles of a performance after weeks of banging their heads against the bandroom wall in frustration.
I don't blame them !!
- Wilky

Tuba Miriam
20.01.2006, 16:36
Irrespective of the level playing field argument, the prospect of having to almost-endlessly rehearse a piece that many are saying is just too difficult for the section, must be a de-moralising prospect. However, good idea though it may be, a mass boycott will never happen: bands rarely show such collective organisation in their thinking!

It raises the issue again of test piece selection: just what are the criteria that the selection panel use and why is it such a secret process? Test piece selection seems to be something of a dark art. After the regional contests do the panel receive official reports from adjudicators, which include their learned comments on the general standard of playing and apparent suitably of the pieces chosen for each section? Probably not. How are the test piece selectors supposed to know how suitable their choices for the Areas were if there is no official feedback? This would would have an impact on future decisions. If one were to ask a member of the selection panel what the assumed standard of a Second Section Principal Euphonium or Second Cornet is, for example, would they be able to answer the question? Would all the panel agree? Maybe the question is irrelevant ...

Once again, why is the whole process such a dark art? Why were the selectors so keen to use Images, which required re-scoring from the original two-band version when there must be plenty of original new stuff written at the required standard?

stevetrom
20.01.2006, 16:50
the prospect of having to almost-endlessly rehearse a piece that many are saying is just too difficult for the section, must be a de-moralising prospect

if a band really does find the area piece that daunting maybe they are in the wrong section?

surely the ides of a contest is to stretch all the bands to (or maybe beyond) their limits and find the best band.

Tuba Miriam
20.01.2006, 17:38
if a band really does find the area piece that daunting maybe they are in the wrong section?

surely the ides of a contest is to stretch all the bands to (or maybe beyond) their limits and find the best band.

That assumes that the 'correct' pieces are chosen in the first place, i.e. pieces providing a suitable test for the section. I'd say the bass part for Images is every bit as hard as that in Coventry Variations a couple of years ago, in some respects harder; a lot of First Section bands found that a very tough test and Images has been set for a section lower. So my point is also about the criteria behind test piece selection: what is a suitable test piece? An easy question to ask and very difficult to answer, I realise, but I struggle to see the consistency in test piece selection for the Areas. Is Images a fair ask for the Second Section? I'm glad I won't be playing it.

Owen S
23.01.2006, 16:28
if a band really does find the area piece that daunting maybe they are in the wrong section?

surely the ides of a contest is to stretch all the bands to (or maybe beyond) their limits and find the best band.
I guess this inadvertently makes the point I was about to make in a different way: If the chosen test piece makes most of the bands question whether they are in the the right section, then surely it's the choice of music that is at fault, not the bands themselves?

stevetrom
23.01.2006, 16:45
If the chosen test piece makes most of the bands question whether they are in the the right section, then surely it's the choice of music that is at fault, not the bands themselves?

I think this has been mentioned previously but the pieces for the Area contests are the same for all regions but, if we are all honest, not all regions have the same depth of quality bands.

With the restriction of 12 bands for the Championship section and the vagueies of promotion.relegation, it has meant that in some regions there are bands in 'lower' sections who are of a very high standard.

Personally I would prefer a very difficult pice as at least the adjudication should be easier (and therefore hopefully fairer). If only e few bands can comfortably play the piece they are demonstrably of a higher standard than the others and the results should reflect that.

If a test piece is of a standard that all the bands can play it the results can become a lottery .

Owen S
23.01.2006, 17:17
I think this has been mentioned previously but the pieces for the Area contests are the same for all regions but, if we are all honest, not all regions have the same depth of quality bands.

With the restriction of 12 bands for the Championship section and the vagueies of promotion.relegation, it has meant that in some regions there are bands in 'lower' sections who are of a very high standard.

Personally I would prefer a very difficult pice as at least the adjudication should be easier (and therefore hopefully fairer). If only e few bands can comfortably play the piece they are demonstrably of a higher standard than the others and the results should reflect that.

If a test piece is of a standard that all the bands can play it the results can become a lottery .
I don't think anyone's going to pretend that each section is of equal strength in every area. However, two things make it pretty clear that complaints about Images are not just southern bands whinging because it exposes their weaknesses - firstly, the rumours of Yorkshire bands considering pulling out, and secondly, the fact that we didn't play a harder piece in our previous six years of first section qualifiers.

stevetrom
23.01.2006, 17:47
Is all this discussion around the feelings that the piece is too difficult going to affect the bands/players involved?

I knwo from bitter experience that over (or under) estimating a piece can be very detrimental to the performance/result !

Craigsav83
23.01.2006, 19:08
I think the pieces this year are an excellent choice, sure none of them are easy but thats the point of a test piece, isn't it? All the bands are going to find the same problems, so its a level playing field. I dont want this to sound nippy, but if there are parts that cant be played, its a perfect excuse to do some individual practice at home. Bands have 6 months or so to hand the parts out, and players have ample hime to learn the parts before the conductor starts serious rehearsal on the piece.

Its mostly psycological, "ooh lots of black notes its hard" and this often sticks right from the first blow through to the performance. On the other hand, underestimating is just as bad. A recent example is Lorenzo at Pontins - I hears several performences thet were ropey to say the least.

madandcrazytromboneguy
24.01.2006, 02:44
easy trombone parts in voyage, any other trombone players playing that piece agree with me?

barrytone
24.01.2006, 17:01
If trombone parts are too easy for you madandcrazytromboneguy, try becoming madandcrazybaritoneguy! Both baritone parts have some very difficult bits, especially from bar 7 onwards to figure A. Any baritone players agree with me?

Di
24.01.2006, 17:47
Both baritone parts have some very difficult bits, especially from bar 7 onwards to figure A. Any baritone players agree with me?

Me! :cry:

madandcrazytromboneguy
24.01.2006, 18:45
ermmmmmmmmmm, NO!

lol, ive played on the lower valved a few times, and as much as i enjoyed it, i would prolly only get a 2nd seat in 4th section, i can't twiddle the correct valves fast enough! lol

if you dont believe me though, ask rick, i was the temporary 2nd baritone for hebden bridge until jenny signed for us, rick was solo baritone at the time :)

Smiffy
24.01.2006, 19:54
If trombone parts are too easy for you madandcrazytromboneguy, try becoming madandcrazybaritoneguy! Both baritone parts have some very difficult bits, especially from bar 7 onwards to figure A. Any baritone players agree with me?

Definitely!!...agree those runs have me with dislocated fingers!!

plenty of other places that even if the notes themselves are not supposed to be that difficult....playing them in ensemble (is it letter G or H ...1st bari with Euphs)...and letter R with what I understand is supposed to be unison at pp!!

plenty still to rehearse here

best of luck to all!!

Cornishwomble
24.01.2006, 19:58
If trombone parts are too easy for you madandcrazytromboneguy, try becoming madandcrazybaritoneguy! Both baritone parts have some very difficult bits, especially from bar 7 onwards to figure A. Any baritone players agree with me?

I can vouch for this, I can hear 'er inddors practicing the opening bars of Voyage and the air is blue :eek:

DiG that cornet
24.01.2006, 21:22
:-? Blimey you "****-end" of the band skivers - try playing "Voyage" on cornet. Those groups of things are called semiquavers.
(The mods censored this post not me, by the way)

DiG that cornet
24.01.2006, 21:24
easy trombone parts in voyage, any other trombone players playing that piece agree with me?
Anyway, NEVER underestimate a test piece, it will come back to haunt you if you don't respect it enough. You should know that.:frown:

bassarse
24.01.2006, 21:43
You should concentrate about playing in tune 'madandcrazytromboneguy', a good teacher would focus on the basics, a symphony can be crated with one note, as the great john fletcher once said, 'play simple things well,' p.s. the bass part rocks !!!!!!

bassarse
24.01.2006, 23:19
The 1st section piece is dire, nice 1 Goff

try the bass, dirty or is it sanchez;)

barrytone
24.01.2006, 23:39
All joking aside, we are joking aren't we folks?, I don't believe I would ever make a statement saying that I had an easy part in any test piece. The clue is in the title:- test piece, it's just that, a piece that tests. It's not just playing the notes, it's getting them in the right place, fitting in with the band and it's sound, making music. As bassarse says, tuning, intonation - the basics. Every test piece, however easy you think it is, will improve some aspect of your playing, IF you play it correctly.

Endeavour to find a weakness in your playing that the piece chosen highlights and improve upon it. Voyage of Discovery is a fantastic piece of music, an excellent modern test piece and a credit to it's composer. I'm sure it will highlight many weaknesses of individuals and bands, we'll all become better players because of the many challenges it poses. Just my opinion.

ratley
25.01.2006, 00:28
I can vouch for this, I can hear 'er inddors practicing the opening bars of Voyage and the air is blue :eek:

Have you been listening to me too then????? :biggrin:

FlugelD
25.01.2006, 01:41
Agreeing with other posts (above or elsewhere!), the Flugel part to 'Images' is relatively easy - until the erratta(sp?) and new score shows up....:confused:

Pythagoras
25.01.2006, 09:32
Anglian dances seems a really good piece. Will be a good test.

bassarse
25.01.2006, 22:38
All joking aside, we are joking aren't we folks?, I don't believe I would ever make a statement saying that I had an easy part in any test piece. The clue is in the title:- test piece, it's just that, a piece that tests. It's not just playing the notes, it's getting them in the right place, fitting in with the band and it's sound, making music. As bassarse says, tuning, intonation - the basics. Every test piece, however easy you think it is, will improve some aspect of your playing, IF you play it correctly.

Endeavour to find a weakness in your playing that the piece chosen highlights and improve upon it. Voyage of Discovery is a fantastic piece of music, an excellent modern test piece and a credit to it's composer. I'm sure it will highlight many weaknesses of individuals and bands, we'll all become better players because of the many challenges it poses. Just my opinion.

Rightly as DiG that cornet said and Barrytone, you should never underestimate your test piece speaking as a relatively accomplished EEb B ass player the bass part is the best part i have played in years, no more just playing beat notes.
When you listen to the fine Cory performance the whole piece is heavily reliant on the bass section and their ability to be musical and creative. Unheard of in many test pieces, right on Goff !!!!!!! :clap:

wewizrobbed
25.01.2006, 22:55
For instance, I would think there are a number of 2nd section bands who have 3rd cornets / 2nd Baritones / 2nd horns who can't triple tongue at all, let alone triple tongue neatly at pp, at the required speed,

:confused: don't be lazy! you can single it

WoodenFlugel
25.01.2006, 23:11
:confused: don't be lazy! you can single it

What??? At dotted minium (ie a bar) equals 86? maybe for a bar or so but I certainly can't keep singling at that speed for the best part of 30 bars. If you can single it then good luck, but if I tried I would end up with my music and everyone sitting around me covered in spit. ;)

madandcrazytromboneguy
25.01.2006, 23:21
:confused: don't be lazy! you can single it



all the stuff about tongueing, mendip celebration had flutter tongueing in it and i can't flutter tongue, and that was a 4th section part.

by the way everyone

get your digs in at me all you can, it doesnt change anythin, i dont think that my part indivudually is difficult, simple as, gettin it in tune with the solo and bass troms fair enough, but theres nowt technically difficult on my part.

come on all you other 2nd trombone players doin voyage, give us your views on the part in question here!

wewizrobbed
25.01.2006, 23:48
What??? At dotted minium (ie a bar) equals 86? maybe for a bar or so but I certainly can't keep singling at that speed for the best part of 30 bars. If you can single it then good luck, but if I tried I would end up with my music and everyone sitting around me covered in spit. ;)

fair doos! I'd triple if I were you then :D

ruthatron
25.01.2006, 23:53
fair doos! I'd triple if I were you then :D

for some people, that's easier said than done!

bassarse
26.01.2006, 20:56
Triple Tonguing???

bassarse
26.01.2006, 20:58
by the way everyone

get your digs in at me all you can, it doesnt change anythin, i dont think that my part indivudually is difficult, simple as, gettin it in tune with the solo and bass troms fair enough, but theres nowt technically difficult on my part.

As far as I can tell, no one is having a dig at you, all that's been said is that there's more to a piece than technical difficulty. There's tuning, intonation, dynamics, phrasing; making music. If the test piece doesn't challenge you, maybe your basic practice routine can involve parts in other pieces the band is practising that you can't play.

Age and experience would stop me making the statement you have, if you can play your part perfectly, fair enough; but if you make the slightest error when performing the piece, your statement will come back to haunt you. I am not trying to get a dig in at you, just giving you some advice from someone who is older and wiser, it's up to you whether you take it.

Now, back on topic, Area Test Pieces 2006, first section, Voyage of Discovery. Great band piece, love playing it, band are enjoying it, challenging for most players, bits for everyone - even basses and bass trombone have features, what's not to like? Can't wait to perform it!

Steve
27.01.2006, 00:40
Maybe the test is thinking your part is easy. Weeks of rehearsals already knowing you can do it is very trying and the art of keeping your frustration hidden from fellow band members is exceedingly hard. Thats like a conductor saying well I can conduct all the time signatures in it so obviously I will be fine.

Charmed
27.01.2006, 07:29
Is there anyone else out there who is playing Journey? What do you think to it? Fantastic piece to listen to but what do we think about playing it? Personally it's going to drive me mad! As a horn player I was very disappointed with the horn parts. Okay, it is still technical and will challenge some, myself included, in some bars. But I've got to say, I am very disappointed with this choice as it is our first attempt in the Championship Section (again, I am only speaking from a horn's point of view). I just know I'm going to be driven mad, mad, mad over the next 8 or so weeks rehearsing this! :eek:

Roll on Spring Festival, if I can survive that long!

Pav
27.01.2006, 20:07
What??? At dotted minium (ie a bar) equals 86? maybe for a bar or so but I certainly can't keep singling at that speed for the best part of 30 bars. If you can single it then good luck, but if I tried I would end up with my music and everyone sitting around me covered in spit. ;)

It's particularly effective if half the people are singling and half are tripling! The words bag and spanners spring to mind.

Tell you what though, I'm glad I'm on cornet - some of that unison bass end stuff sounds a mite tricky at speed.


Pav

WoodenFlugel
27.01.2006, 23:26
Tell you what though, I'm glad I'm on cornet - some of that unison bass end stuff sounds a mite tricky at speed.


Pav

Well I'm glad I'm on flugel - I can sit gently playing syncopated crotchets for bars on end while the front row screech away (trust me that is the right terminology) on top B's and C's for bar after bar after bar. :p (beginning of 3rd movement...)

mikelyons
28.01.2006, 21:37
get your digs in at me all you can, it doesnt change anythin, i dont think that my part indivudually is difficult, simple as, gettin it in tune with the solo and bass troms fair enough, but theres nowt technically difficult on my part.

come on all you other 2nd trombone players doin voyage, give us your views on the part in question here!

I know you're a trombone player - you've made that quite obvious, but you'd be much less of a target if you would use a reasonable facsimile of the English language and didn't constantly make such an ass of yourself with sweeping generalisations.

I agree with you that, compared to both 1st and bass trom the 2nd is much easier at K and the other prominent trom bits. However, what's your point? Some of my parts are easier than others. I have to admit that I'm dreading the first section up to letter A. Those semis don't always fall into regular patterns and my bass doesn't seem willing to have its valves pressed at that speed. I'm finding it really heavy going at the moment.

Has anybody discovered an easier fingering (or fudging) for that really awkward bar? I'm struggling and it's starting to take over my life.:eek:

PHA161
29.01.2006, 12:54
Oh dear, we have just had our first rehearsal on Images of the Millennium, as regards all the previous posts, yes you are right, completely the wrong choice of music for an Area Second Section test piece.
How fortunate the bands were at Butlins to have a decent piece of music (Prometheus Unbound), one that you could go home after rehearsal humming/whistling the odd bar or two.

I personally feel sorry for the MD's with weeks of note bashing ahead and trying to make music of it. At least Mr. Snell did do the adjudicator a favour, that being a very loud finish just in case the poor chap fell asleep in the dirge of a second movement.
But fear not, sleep well knowing that Mr. Snell might be able to change his car this year with the possible proceeds of the sales of this music, but rejoice in the fact that (hopefully) this will never come out of the library again after the Areas.

With regard to who was responsible for this choice, well I hope he has the 'bottle' to sit through every band in whatever area he comes from ! That way, next year we might be lucky to have the odd tune !

iancwilx
29.01.2006, 13:02
[QUOTE=PHA161] rejoice in the fact that (hopefully) this will never come out of the library again after the Areas.

QUOTE]

Perhaps only in an emergency when we run short of a certain hygene commodity - it would be the ideal choice for that application !
- Wilky

jonford
29.01.2006, 13:05
Has anybody discovered an easier fingering (or fudging) for that really awkward bar? I'm struggling and it's starting to take over my life.:eek:

Well I still can't play it either! It's obviously gonna be slightly different on Eb Bass as well but I discovered on my euph you can play a lot of it with the 4th valve down which makes it so much easier!

ian perks
29.01.2006, 13:34
Well I still can't play it either! It's obviously gonna be slightly different on Eb Bass as well but I discovered on my euph you can play a lot of it with the 4th valve down which makes it so much easier!

Yep good point same for us Baritones as well.
We have got a sectional next Sunday to nail a few things in it also our Bass section as well have before us for 2 hours 2-4 we are 4-6 and whave already sorted out to do another with the basses as well who are well up for it.
I have got to say on here i thought that 2003 test piece was hard for 1st section we qualified in 2003 but its Chicken Food compared with Voyage of Discovery, but never the less its a super piece of music.
Our section and the Basses have already said :ranting2: a good number of unprintable words about some of the bars, but i wont post them on here:biggrin: , but i am sure that all the bands have said the same words (You know what i mean) in practise but we have said sorry straight away, but everyone knows we want to get it right:clap:
I just hope all the 1st section bands who are practising it at the moment think the same.
Lets hear it for Goff Richards:woo

Steve
29.01.2006, 13:53
4th valve in and read it up a 4th, may help

mikelyons
29.01.2006, 15:45
Was that a general piece of advice, Steve? The cornets and horns might have a slight problem, though :)

I'll give it a try today. We are having an extra rehearsal in about an hour so I'll see if it works.

...more bleedin' writin' on the part... (mutters off)...


:biggrin:

Steve
29.01.2006, 16:55
Cornets are technique kings of the band remember and dont need a 4th valve, I cant count how many times that pearler of a statement passes their lips so they can clearly do without.

I cant remember the notes as I only had one go at the piece but i remember it being awkward, especially when it gets towards the bottom of the stave so up a 4th should help.

Pythagoras
30.01.2006, 09:36
Anglian Dances is a cracking piece. We've been quite lucky in 4th section recently, by the sounds of what people in iother sections are saying. Last 3 areas Partita, Divertimento and Anglian Dances have all been good.

iancwilx
31.01.2006, 20:54
It's obviously gonna be slightly different on Eb Bass as well

Speaking of which !! - Any comments from my fellow EEb Bass playing Brothers (and perhaps Sisters) about "Images" ?
How's home practice going ?
- Wilky

WoodenFlugel
01.02.2006, 01:00
Well we still haven't received the promised new score and 1st Trombone part - or the errata sheet (officially). This was announced on the 16th of Jan (according to Tabby's post) so that was just over two weeks ago - plenty of time for it to get to us even with our rubbish postal service. Its now 6 weeks - 12 scheduled rehearsals until our area. We have sectionals booked in a few weeks - I wonder if we'll have it by then?

Should anyone from the "powers that be" or Rakeway music happen to be reading this, I ask one question: Don't you think Images is a big enough ask without restricting the competing bands access to a (mostly) correct score?

Not happy in the slightest. We paid 70 quid for this. For that money I would expect a) parts to be correct and b) if not, at least replacememts to be sent 1st class and in plenty of time to sort out the differences before the contest. Shocking. :mad:

rutty
01.02.2006, 08:02
We're playing this at NEMBBA in less than three weeks. Having the right score and parts would be nice please!

WoodenFlugel
01.02.2006, 10:26
We're playing this at NEMBBA in less than three weeks. Having the right score and parts would be nice please!

I'd forgotten about the NEMBBA contest....

Have you recieved any official notification of an errata or new score etc? I was saying last night, had it not been for my involvement with this site, we wouldn't have known anything was being sent to us - even the errata sheet, let alone a new score. AFAIK we have recieved nothing by way of official notification either from the contest organisers or the publishers. After paying a good amount for the score and parts, I really don't see why we should be chasing around after whoever to sort out issues which are not the doing of us, or any other 2nd section band in the country.

As for the quality of parts etc....well, the phase "should be of sufficient saleable quality" springs to mind.

PHA161
01.02.2006, 11:59
..........Have you recieved any official notification of an errata or new score etc?

There is a good chance that the adjudicator has not received the new score either, which then raises the question ~ Will he notice anyway ?

Bassintheballroom
01.02.2006, 14:33
Speaking of which !! - Any comments from my fellow EEb Bass playing Brothers (and perhaps Sisters) about "Images" ?
How's home practice going ?
- Wilky

Home practice is going. That should tell you all you need to know.

ignore me
01.02.2006, 15:38
just out of interest, are bands at the NEMBBA playing the cut in images?

PHA161
01.02.2006, 15:53
Speaking of which !! - Any comments from my fellow EEb Bass playing Brothers (and perhaps Sisters) about "Images" ? Wilky

We are fortunate enough to have a new young lady on EEb bass who so far is having no problems with Images and before I receive an 'edit' from the moderators for being sexist or going off the subject, she is good looking too (!!) and I am fortunate enough to sit next to her.

HBB
01.02.2006, 16:22
Ever the lady-killer eh PHA161 ;)

PHA161
01.02.2006, 18:51
Ever the lady-killer eh PHA161 ;)

Whilst trying to keep on the subject HBB, so I do not upset the moderators again, good looking young ladies in bands are always an asset especially when 'one' might be able to pass the odd note or bar over to her.

I can assure you that with Images she might be getting more notes/bars than she is expecting especially when quavers come into play at dotted minim = 144 + (mind you, that is subject to the errata that we have not yet received - it might be slower).
As for being the 'Lady Killer' ~ I'm just to old for that lark ! ~ I'll leave it up to you lads !!

Pav
01.02.2006, 19:37
Hi Ian

From what I understand, the Midlands Committee waited until the deadline for entries had been reached before giving the publishers a list of who needed the errata, score, new parts, cuddly toy etc.

Would imagine it will be soon.

Hopefully they'll realise some of the front row parts have been inadvertantly written an octave too high as well (nothing like a bit of wild optimism)!


Pav

HBB
01.02.2006, 19:52
Whilst trying to keep on the subject HBB, so I do not upset the moderators again, good looking young ladies in bands are always an asset especially when 'one' might be able to pass the odd note or bar over to her.

I can assure you that with Images she might be getting more notes/bars than she is expecting especially when quavers come into play at dotted minim = 144 + (mind you, that is subject to the errata that we have not yet received - it might be slower).
As for being the 'Lady Killer' ~ I'm just to old for that lark ! ~ I'll leave it up to you lads !!
You're too old for most things aren't you, PHA ;)

WoodenFlugel
01.02.2006, 23:09
Hi Ian

From what I understand, the Midlands Committee waited until the deadline for entries had been reached before giving the publishers a list of who needed the errata, score, new parts, cuddly toy etc.

Would imagine it will be soon.

Hey mate,

Well that would explain it then, although my comments about the time left and getting it right in the first place still stand. From what I understand to be the entry in our section the Midlands Regional Committee may have the publishers a few quid by delaying...;)


Hopefully they'll realise some of the front row parts have been inadvertantly written an octave too high as well (nothing like a bit of wild optimism)!


Pav

As I say flugel is the future! None of that screechy stuff in the 3rd movement, none of those, frankly, stupid sextuplets at Q, just a couple of tricky bars here and there. No problem. :p

(You watch I'll probably make a right pigs ear of it come the day now I've said that).

rutty
02.02.2006, 09:32
just out of interest, are bands at the NEMBBA playing the cut in images?

We will be making the cut

Stan Van Der Lager
02.02.2006, 13:30
Hey mate,

Well that would explain it then, although my comments about the time left and getting it right in the first place still stand. From what I understand to be the entry in our section the Midlands Regional Committee may have the publishers a few quid by delaying...;)



As I say flugel is the future! None of that screechy stuff in the 3rd movement, none of those, frankly, stupid sextuplets at Q, just a couple of tricky bars here and there. No problem. :p

(You watch I'll probably make a right pigs ear of it come the day now I've said that).

Ian

I certainly hope you don't... See you tonight. By the way are we going to have a few beers after the funeral gig on Saturday??

lucretia
02.02.2006, 19:45
No - you're not the only ones. We've been given our parts but not played together yet.

WoodenFlugel
03.02.2006, 01:10
Ian

I certainly hope you don't... See you tonight.

Yeah me too, although on my recent contest form its far from a foregone conclusion...:oops:


By the way are we going to have a few beers after the funeral gig on Saturday??

Well as it's Pat's memorial service, and knowing Pat as I did I think it might be a little rude, and out of keeping if we didn't. Hope we play alright, and make it a fitting trubute to a superb person.

*cough* anyway back on topic....:rolleyes:

I think its only fair to say that the new score and an errata sheet arrived for tonight's rehearsal. I hope now this will be the end of the negativity - as understandable as it is - after all the set of parts was hardly cheap. Anyway, lets concentrate on the music now eh? I'll see you all in about five weeks time :)

Steve
03.02.2006, 01:24
Just had my first rehearsal on Journey and I have to ask........... Is Peter Graham accepting invoices for damage to my trombone?? After sitting there doing nothing but looking forward to my off beats I suddenly have to rip a mute out, stick it where I really dont want to be sticking anything, turn the page, get another mute from behind my ear and get it in the bell without taking huge chunks out of it while trying to start playing again. Not a happy bunny im afraid, if the hardest thing in a test piece is the mute changes (sorry, maybe 4 bars towards the end) then something is seriously wrong.

Grrrrrr

<rant over for now>

Charmed
03.02.2006, 07:46
Just had my first rehearsal on Journey and I have to ask........... Is Peter Graham accepting invoices for damage to my trombone?? After sitting there doing nothing but looking forward to my off beats I suddenly have to rip a mute out, stick it where I really dont want to be sticking anything, turn the page, get another mute from behind my ear and get it in the bell without taking huge chunks out of it while trying to start playing again. Not a happy bunny im afraid, if the hardest thing in a test piece is the mute changes (sorry, maybe 4 bars towards the end) then something is seriously wrong.

Grrrrrr

<rant over for now>

Yep! Same here, try trilling for 40 + beats with no break, then in 2 n a bit beats at tempo 172, removing the mute from horn ready for semiquavor runs. I need a PA. :biggrin:

Owen S
03.02.2006, 13:12
Bah. You lot have it easy.

Towards the end of the second section in Images, all four solo cornets are expected to put in a straight mute in the space of zero crotchets. Having two playing before the mute change and two after is impossible, as there are two or three separate notes being played before the change and four (with two different rhythms) afterwards. Howard Snell insists this is perfectly easy to do.

piston
03.02.2006, 13:33
Have the mute on your knee then, cornet players should not consider themselves beneath such tactics. Sometimes I find that folks try to be too rigid and military i.e. putting the mute down on the floor as soon the magical "senza sordini" is printed, even if they are marked sordini in only a matter of few lines. Trying too hard for a look of neatness can kill the music, which lets face it is the important bit.

But that is just me

Steve
03.02.2006, 14:20
at least you guys can play the instruments one handed!!!!!!!! Thus being the problem with these slide things. I am honestly thinking of seeing if I can take a non player on stage to do it for me

Stan Van Der Lager
03.02.2006, 14:47
at least you guys can play the instruments one handed!!!!!!!! Thus being the problem with these slide things. I am honestly thinking of seeing if I can take a non player on stage to do it for me

Correct.. we can and due to my latest sporting injury have been for a couple of weeks at the start of this year... Just waiting patiently for the next one.

blueandwhiteforever
03.02.2006, 15:42
Speaking of which !! - Any comments from my fellow EEb Bass playing Brothers (and perhaps Sisters) about "Images" ?
How's home practice going ?
- Wilky

What? Can you not manage the top D and the wonderful quavers running about above the stave. A delightful Eb BAss part. Unfortunately my sarcasm doesn't come over very well when written down. It is certainly a challenge but far more fun than sitting for weeks playing minims and semibrieves like we usually have to do. It'll certainly make the bass sectional different.

I'm finding the first page of the third movement worse than anything. Any ideas on how to stay awake during that part.

So far though, no good looking ladies in the bass section to help.

Tuba Miriam
03.02.2006, 15:54
Have the mute on your knee then, cornet players should not consider themselves beneath such tactics. Sometimes I find that folks try to be too rigid and military i.e. putting the mute down on the floor as soon the magical "senza sordini" is printed, even if they are marked sordini in only a matter of few lines. Trying too hard for a look of neatness can kill the music, which lets face it is the important bit.

But that is just me

In this instance having the mute on your knee, or anywhere else, is not of much help; with zero beats to insert it the best place for the mute is in the end of the bell. However, until instructed to do so that's not really an option either ...

Thankfully, this is rarely an issue on the bass.

Owen S
03.02.2006, 16:14
Have the mute on your knee then, cornet players should not consider themselves beneath such tactics. Sometimes I find that folks try to be too rigid and military i.e. putting the mute down on the floor as soon the magical "senza sordini" is printed, even if they are marked sordini in only a matter of few lines. Trying too hard for a look of neatness can kill the music, which lets face it is the important bit.

But that is just me
It doesn't bother me either, and with the mute in my left hand, I can just about get it in and play in the space of a crotchet at that speed. Unfortunately, as David says, it's a crotchet we just don't have.

Bassintheballroom
03.02.2006, 16:53
I'm finding the first page of the third movement worse than anything. Any ideas on how to stay awake during that part.

I recommend making the most of 'not being at N yet'.



So far though, no good looking ladies in the bass section to help.

Interestingly, I've never played in a band which hasn't had a lady EEb player, more than none of which were good looking.

DaveR
03.02.2006, 16:57
Interestingly, I've never played in a band which hasn't had a lady EEb player, more than none of which were good looking.

That's got to be a candidate for the quote of the year next time the tMP awards come round! I'm still trying to translate it.....;)

Bass Trumpet
03.02.2006, 17:47
at least you guys can play the instruments one handed!!!!!!!! Thus being the problem with these slide things. I am honestly thinking of seeing if I can take a non player on stage to do it for me

That'll be me, then!

Seriously, though. I think that all three of us GUSbones struggled last night. It defies logic that an established composer should have such little foresight to write a piece with so many barely possible mute changes. I am quite happy to tackle a difficult piece of music (I can play the trombone a bit, I almost passed my Grade 3), but for the composer to make it awkward for the sake of it just shows contempt for the poor players who have to play the damn thing. I am quite certain that we won't be playing it after the 11th March.

Steve
03.02.2006, 18:44
I am quite certain that we won't be playing it after the 11th March.

Might give it one run through on the 12th though Duncan, just a thought :p

Charmed
04.02.2006, 10:00
Might give it one run through on the 12th though Duncan, just a thought :p

We have a ritual - All test pieces to be handed in straight after playing, never to be seen again :clap: -

until it's a test piece again! :eek:

Accidental
06.02.2006, 12:01
at least you guys can play the instruments one handed!!!!!!!!
Not trilling we can't :(
I still haven't figured out how we're gonna do that change without maiming either our instruments, each other, or ourselves!

Steve
06.02.2006, 12:27
We have a ritual - All test pieces to be handed in straight after playing, never to be seen again :clap: -

until it's a test piece again! :eek:

The only reason I suggested the run through on the 12th is thats the day of the contest. Dont think the MD would be too pleased if we all burnt our parts on the 11th and went on stage with a bag of ashes each

Baritonedeaf
06.02.2006, 13:11
Surely you will all have memorised the parts by then though?! ;)

I know thats how we do things in the 3rd Section! ...Cough,cough...

Anno Draconis
06.02.2006, 13:11
Dont think the MD would be too pleased if we all burnt our parts on the 11th and went on stage with a bag of ashes each

Yes, but would the adjuducator notice?;)

Baritonedeaf
06.02.2006, 13:15
Not on his own - but now there are two in the box, all adjudications will be perfect won' they?!

BigHorn
06.02.2006, 14:14
So - is there any truth in these rumours flying around that bands are pulling out of the 2nd section Areas due to the demands of Images.
I've heard this rumour about Yorkshire and Midland regions although there are never any actual bands names mentioned.
I can't see why bands won't compete even if they can't play it - lets face it, even the very best of the 2nd section are to some extent going to be on a damage limitation exercise.
If you don't turn up you come last. If you do turn up it may be embarrasing but you will at least finish above those that don't which could ensure survival in the section.

Anybody not going?

Tracey
06.02.2006, 15:00
There is one band in the Yorkshire area that has officially withdrawn in the second section!

stevetrom
06.02.2006, 15:02
There is one band in the Yorkshire area that has officially withdrawn in the second section!

and the band is?

or is it not the done thing, unless it's your own band?

Tracey
06.02.2006, 15:10
Info came for regional secretary and was announced on 4barsrest; it is Stanley Newmarket Band.

Charmed
07.02.2006, 08:33
I can't see why bands won't compete even if they can't play it - lets face it, even the very best of the 2nd section are to some extent going to be on a damage limitation exercise.
If you don't turn up you come last. If you do turn up it may be embarrasing but you will at least finish above those that don't which could ensure survival in the section.

Anybody not going?

Not being able to play the parts may not be the issue! In this day and age, as you all know, player availability is a big problem! You can't always go onto a contest stage if you're missing players. And I mean NO OFFENSE here, but often in lower section test pieces you may be able to cover certain parts that are missing, but if you are missing key players then this is not always possible, and certainly, in the higher section it gets more difficult to cover any parts. So maybe bands are withdrawing because of the lack of players. You only have to look on the recruitment thread on tmp and classifieds on 4barsrest to see how many bands are still wanting players to perform at the areas.

We too have our area contest in just over 4 weeks, and we still need a solo player! So to all us bands out there that are still looking for players, GOOD LUCK TO US :clap:

Tracey
07.02.2006, 23:07
Charmed I hope you mean area contest in just under 4 weeks and not just over 4 weeks cause its 3 weeks on Sunday :confused:

Charmed
08.02.2006, 08:24
Charmed I hope you mean area contest in just under 4 weeks and not just over 4 weeks cause its 3 weeks on Sunday :confused:

OMG! :redface: So it is. Help!!!!!!!

PHA161
14.02.2006, 15:58
Well we have at last started work on Images of the Millennium, what an 'amazing' composition, I now know why I retired from contesting back in the early nineties. After the note bashing, what a drag, I feel mainly sorry for the MD's ~ how on earth are they going to keep the interest going in most bands, it will pure note bashing from now until the contest for most bands I expect.
However, if there are other bass trombone players out there reading this you might be interested to know that I showed the part to an old friend who for many years was in one of the top London orchestras on bass trombone, on reading Movement 1, section G bar 9 to figure H his precise words were, 'That's Snell getting his own back on bass trombone players'. (for those not privy to seeing the part it is written from top F (above stave) to pedal B= at the speed dotted minim equals 86 (Vivace) in quavers, all over seven bars, Oh and I forgot to mention at FFF moltissimo giocoso.

I hope that no rewriting or doctoring of the parts will be taking place as has been mentioned in previous posts !!

iancwilx
14.02.2006, 20:01
[QUOTE=PHA161].[/I] (for those not privy to seeing the part it is written from top F (above stave) to pedal B= at the speed dotted minim equals 86 (Vivace) in quavers, all over seven bars, Oh and I forgot to mention at FFF moltissimo giocoso.
IQUOTE]

The Eb Bass part is the same, with accidentals flashing past your eyes faster than you can get your brain and fingers to co-ordinate and operate the valves.
It must be harder on Bass Bone, but it still isn't easy on Bass at Fortefortissimo !!
The question is, where do you breathe to sustain the volume ?
And what about the quavers at "N" ?
- Wilky (Breathless !)

PHA161
15.02.2006, 13:39
The Eb Bass part is the same, with accidentals flashing past your eyes faster than you can get your brain and fingers to co-ordinate and operate the valves.

I can only assume that Mr. Snell did not like tuba players either !


The question is, where do you breathe to sustain the volume ?

As for breathing, well you do have another E= bass player who could assist, I am fortunate enough to have a good second trombone alongside who can play anything ~ well almost ! And like all second trombone players, counts, puts up the stands and gets the mutes in place.


And what about the quavers at "N" ?

Sorry, all trombones just on dotted minims !

ed_the_euph
22.02.2006, 19:20
aww you say the nicest things... you forgot to mention turning the music up-side down!..

GJacko
23.02.2006, 00:28
So - is there any truth in these rumours flying around that bands are pulling out of the 2nd section Areas due to the demands of Images.
I've heard this rumour about Yorkshire and Midland regions although there are never any actual bands names mentioned.
I can't see why bands won't compete even if they can't play it - lets face it, even the very best of the 2nd section are to some extent going to be on a damage limitation exercise.
If you don't turn up you come last. If you do turn up it may be embarrasing but you will at least finish above those that don't which could ensure survival in the section.

Anybody not going?
I've heard bands are pulling out as well. Not so sure if it's due to the pieces though. I think more likely player availability. It's happening right up and down the sections now.

In our Midlands third section contest there are two less bands than last year!!! I think it's a sign of the times unfortunately. It's only the championship section that seems stable in terms of numbers and it's the lower sections that are feeding them.

Charmed
23.02.2006, 07:49
It's only the championship section that seems stable in terms of numbers and it's the lower sections that are feeding them.

Not sure that statement is correct!

Even in the Yorkshire Area where we are, we've heard lots of bands in the Championship Section that are struggling to put out a full team! I know quite a few that have had to pull out all the stops to get players signed just in time for the Area contest. Ourselves included :eek:

Val
23.02.2006, 12:00
We've had to pull out of 2nd Section (Wales) due to numbers - had 8 vacancies and, though we could probably have filled 4 or 5 of them with players signing just for the areas, these players helping us out would not have been able to make many rehearsals and, with a piece like Images, it was felt that it was not feasible for the rest of the band to work up the piece. It would have been very frustrating as well, with parts missing during the lead up, and not quite knowing how everything would gel. Maybe if the piece wasn't so demanding we may have given it a go - we have always supported the Areas and often gone under strength - but I must admit a certain sense of relief when we made the decision not to enter.

However, a lot of players still wanted to take part in the Areas so we have given them free rein in signing for other local bands who needed seats filling - hopefully this has made everyone happy and means that some other bands who may have had to withdraw can now compete. I just hope all our players return to us after the Areas and are not 'poached' by the Bands we are helping out - also hope we get some reciprocal assistance for our summer jobs!!

GJacko
23.02.2006, 12:24
We've had to pull out of 2nd Section (Wales) due to numbers - had 8 vacancies and, though we could probably have filled 4 or 5 of them with players signing just for the areas, these players helping us out would not have been able to make many rehearsals and, with a piece like Images, it was felt that it was not feasible for the rest of the band to work up the piece. It would have been very frustrating as well, with parts missing during the lead up, and not quite knowing how everything would gel. Maybe if the piece wasn't so demanding we may have given it a go - we have always supported the Areas and often gone under strength - but I must admit a certain sense of relief when we made the decision not to enter.

However, a lot of players still wanted to take part in the Areas so we have given them free rein in signing for other local bands who needed seats filling - hopefully this has made everyone happy and means that some other bands who may have had to withdraw can now compete. I just hope all our players return to us after the Areas and are not 'poached' by the Bands we are helping out - also hope we get some reciprocal assistance for our summer jobs!!
Sorry to hear your band has had to pull out this year. I hope you can pull things back into shape for next year.

You make a good point though. It is easy for players to sign up to a band for the area contest (or finals...) only. The transfer rules are pretty lax these days, making it easy for an individual to float between bands. It allows bands to draft in players at a moments notice and leads to the best players being paid for making appearances for a single event. This means that bands who have good sponsorship (ie, loadsa money) can fill their vacant chairs by offering 'expenses' and the like. (I think there's another discussion going on about this subject). However, the result is, the 'real' bands of the brass band movement will continue to struggle for players as they always have done.

But all is not always lost. We recently won the third section contest at NEMBBA with four players short (TP Entertainments). I know this is a relatively light weight piece compared with Images & Voyage etc, but it does show it can be done.

Good luck with whoever you may decide to play for this year.

Thirteen Ball
23.02.2006, 13:43
I can only assume that Mr. Snell did not like tuba players either !

I can assure you , based on some of the parts he's written that I've had to play over the years, he certainly does NOT like Tuba players!

Pines of Rome: ppp entry, on a pedal C-Sharp, slurring up to a bottom G. Repeat until dizzy with eventual crescendo to fff, then collapse on bandroom floor. Cheers Howard!!

I must say I'm not overly impressed with voyage of discovery. Most of the BB part is the Eb bass part with bits left out. I feel a bit surplus to requirements for large parts of it. Plus Mr Richards has completely failed to use the low register of a BB, preferring in stead to give us a bass quartet that is properly psychadelic and mind-bending, and sounds ear-hurting even when played correctly.

Flugel players might as well bring their sandwiches and knitting to the contest too. There's absolutely nothing in it for them. Conversely, large parts are a euphonium solo with band accompanying.

Shame really, I was hoping for so much more with a batch of fresh pieces all round.

stevetrom
23.02.2006, 13:47
a bass quartet that is properly psychadelic and mind-bending, and sounds ear-hurting even when played correctly.

thats's good news, maybe our basses are playingt corectly :)

Cornishwomble
23.02.2006, 16:49
Flugel players might as well bring their sandwiches and knitting to the contest too. There's absolutely nothing in it for them. Conversely, large parts are a euphonium solo with band accompanying.


Of course there's stuff to do, I get to watch the rest of the band knit their fingers together at the opening and not having it myself I can probably wizz round after it and untangle any fingers that are stuck. I can also sit back and enjoy the Euph and horn solos whilst making myself a sandwich a pouring a coffee.

I just know I'm going to get hammered at some stage later in the year with a test-piece that has a git of a part!

However I do quite like Voyage.

Jughead
23.02.2006, 17:00
Of course there's stuff to do, I get to watch the rest of the band knit their fingers together at the opening and not having it myself I can probably wizz round after it and untangle any fingers that are stuck. I can also sit back and enjoy the Euph and horn solos whilst making myself a sandwich a pouring a coffee.

I just know I'm going to get hammered at some stage later in the year with a test-piece that has a git of a part!

However I do quite like Voyage. dont watch the 3rd cornets one of them once knitted me a hat with five sleeves !

Thirteen Ball
23.02.2006, 17:02
...I get to watch the rest of the band knit their fingers together at the opening and not having it myself I can probably wizz round after it and untangle any fingers that are stuck....

Don't bother with the basses. It might make our li'l quartet feature part sound better if we tied our fingers in knots. Not that it's that hard, compared with the opening, for example, but it's truly brain-hurtingly unlistenable.

We're sending Rambochick, our Flugel player off to the bar halfway through to get the first round in! :biggrin:

MRSH
23.02.2006, 23:08
Journey to the Centre of the Earth

London and Southern Counties

Anyone know how many timps are being provided, please? Not been to a rehearsal yet so haven't spoken to the secretary ;)

Cheers

(P.S. Why DOES the bleeper asterisk out r-e-h-e-a-r-s-e-d??)

super_sop
23.02.2006, 23:11
Journey to the Centre of the Earth

London and Southern Counties

Anyone know how many timps are being provided, please? Not been to a rehearsal yet so haven't spoken to the secretary ;)

Cheers

(P.S. Why DOES the bleeper asterisk out r-e-h-e-a-r-s-e-d??)

never been ***** to find out;)

MRSH
23.02.2006, 23:19
never been ***** to find out;) Hee-hee Craig :sup

I can SEE why it does it I just wondered WHY it does it.

Topic.....................*cough*

Why don't they list it on their website - is it some big secret!!!!!!!! Although the website does seem to be a copy and paste from the letter that appears to have sent.

Anyway, number of timps anyone...................:D

HBB
23.02.2006, 23:30
Isn't it 4?

MRSH
23.02.2006, 23:35
Isn't it 4? Is it? Final answer?

WhatSharp?
23.02.2006, 23:40
Is it? Final answer?
or would you like to phone a friend?

HBB
23.02.2006, 23:41
I'll ring my mum! :P

Well, all I know is that at WGC we needed to get 4 timps, so I'm guessing that's how many they'd provide?

sugarandspice
23.02.2006, 23:43
Hee-hee Craig :sup

I can SEE why it does it I just wondered WHY it does it.

Topic.....................*cough*

Why don't they list it on their website - is it some big secret!!!!!!!! Although the website does seem to be a copy and paste from the letter that appears to have sent.

Anyway, number of timps anyone...................:D

because it spells a r s e ?? (am i allowed to say that>!) Sorry if im not!

HBB
23.02.2006, 23:44
How old are you?! :p

WhatSharp?
23.02.2006, 23:45
because it spells a r s e ?? (am i allowed to say that>!) Sorry if im not!
no but you can spell it :D (my dogs can't spell WALKIES but they know it when they hear it! :biggrin:)

MRSH
23.02.2006, 23:45
or would you like to phone a friend? 50/50 - 4 or 5?

Well - you can't ask the audience 'cos there won't be any at their prices :D
The bar'll be jam-packed though :tup

Anyway, have had it confirmed that it is 4 timps being provided. (I'll take the money, thanks Chris :D)

MRSH
23.02.2006, 23:47
because it spells a r s e ?? (am i allowed to say that>!) Sorry if im not! No it doesn't, doh!!!!

It spells r-e-h-e-a-r-s-e-d :rolleyes:

sugarandspice
24.02.2006, 00:26
How old are you?! :p

19 next wednesday! Send me a card!!

dyl
24.02.2006, 01:24
Ok - enough about birthdays and the spelling of certain words.

We'll look into the bleeper, and while we do, you'll all get back to the topic.

Thanks.

Chris Kirk
05.03.2006, 08:36
Okay I'll start it off.

How many bands have had as much fun as us trying to secure FOUR percussionists for journey?

Whats the choice are you doing the whispers yourselves or using the CD? We will be whispering away.

I quite like it, should be some interesting performances and I may go and listen to a few rather than help drinking the bar dry.

Charmed
06.03.2006, 09:56
Okay I'll start it off.
Whats the choice are you doing the whispers yourselves or using the CD? We will be whispering away.

We used the CD recording yesterday. I didn't hear the bands that whispered themselves, but was told it was not as effective.

starperformer
06.03.2006, 16:31
We used the CD recording yesterday. I didn't hear the bands that whispered themselves, but was told it was not as effective.

I thought the CD was slightly less effective than the better whisperers, although I can't imagine that it was taken into account either way? Hepworth band did not appear to use either method?! What happened there?

tsawyer
06.03.2006, 16:54
I thought the CD was slightly less effective than the better whisperers, although I can't imagine that it was taken into account either way? Hepworth band did not appear to use either method?! What happened there?

As far as I could see, Hepworth's Timp player played the CD but it was quite quiet. I think a handful of people whispered too, but I'm not sure.

We whispered, we thought it sounded more effective than the CD did.

Tim.

Jughead
06.03.2006, 17:06
I thought the CD was slightly less effective than the better whisperers, although I can't imagine that it was taken into account either way? Hepworth band did not appear to use either method?! What happened there? I heard Hepworth and the whispering sounded fine from where i was sat, another very good performance from a band that just keeps getting better and better, a little unlucky not to qualify but more than showed they can produce a very fine performance amongst some very fine company.:clap:

HBB
06.03.2006, 17:14
We used the CD recording yesterday. I didn't hear the bands that whispered themselves, but was told it was not as effective.
We're whispering properly.. I wish the euphonium players would stop whispering that they want a bag of chips!!!!!!

Cornishwomble
06.03.2006, 17:41
I'm intrigued to know, did the whispering in Latin that was not done by CD but "live" come across with a Yorkshire accent or not? I just keep getting visions of all the areas sounding different with the Latin being done in regional accents

tinytimp
06.03.2006, 18:31
I'm intrigued to know, did the whispering in Latin that was not done by CD but "live" come across with a Yorkshire accent or not? I just keep getting visions of all the areas sounding different with the Latin being done in regional accents

I obviously can't comment on the Yorkshire performances as I wasn't there, but it's interesting to listen to our band at practice, there's a definite West Wales tinge to the Latin! A friend who played for Ammanford band said they had a comment at a contest where the piece required speaking: "try not to chant in Welsh accents." !

I think the live whispers will tend to sound more effective as you get slight descrepancies/variations between bands, as well as the unpredictability of a live performance rather than all the bands being uniform.

Whether the adjudicator(s) would be able to tell or not is an entirely different matter!

starperformer
06.03.2006, 18:39
I'm intrigued to know, did the whispering in Latin that was not done by CD but "live" come across with a Yorkshire accent or not? I just keep getting visions of all the areas sounding different with the Latin being done in regional accents

It was impossible to make out the words or accent in any case, although there was a definite discernible difference in quality of effect between enthusiastic whisperers (Brighouse were good at this) and unenthusiastic what-am-i-doing-on-stage-whispering-in-latin-how-embarassing whisperers (who shall remain nameless). Unfortunately this is probably a trade-off because doing it loud implies that you're trying to cover up the quality of your quiet playing at that point.

If the choice is completely open, then I think it would be ridiculous to mark bands up or down based on their decision here.

sevenhelz
07.03.2006, 00:55
Question about the area test pieces: would a two year old enjoy hearing them? Or at least, not wail loudly throughout?
;) </scheming>
xx

madandcrazytromboneguy
15.03.2006, 22:07
this years area test pieces have been a mixed bag, although i have to say 1 or 2 pleasantly surprized me in different ways.

i really liked JTTCOTE, a piece with some nice solo's, a crackin percussion part, a great mix of quiet smooth playing, to moments of huge attacking music and its a piece which has definately got in my all time favourites list.

VOD for me was a piece which was much better to listen to than it was to play, but that was due to the trombone parts not having to much to challenge the better trombone players in the 1st section, but with this aside, the piece provided all other sections of the band with plenty to do, section D was a lovely bit of music and the tenor horn cadenza definately got the solo horn players to play with some quality.

IOTM did not interest me at all, and in terms of interesting music, it came right at the bottom of the 5 pieces this year, in my own humble and simple opinion of course. despite this, it seemed to provide the most difficult of tests for the 2nd section bands, and it was even capable of getting a band or 2 to drop out completely.

E again, like IOTM was a huge test for the 3rd section bands, and maybe should have been the piece for the 2nd section to tackle, rather than 3rd. some very difficult cornet and euphonium parts in the 1st and 3rd movements, and to get the real music out of the slow movement was a real test, as most people told me that it was 1 of brass bandings true musical movements. an interesting piece to listen to in the audience.

4th section were provided with a very playable piece in AD and yet it was a very listenable piece with some typical alan fernie moments appearing throughout. i think it was a nice idea to give the 4th section a more playable piece, 1 which they could enjoy rehearsing, considering that the previous 2 or 3 tests, especially the divertimento, have been more challenging for them, i think AD was a very good choice, especially for the new bands who have contested this year aswell.

so heres my big question, WILL THESE PIECES BE CONTINUED TO BE PLAYED IN THE NEAR FUTURE?!

so many good regional pieces have been used in recent years, just for the regionals and then never to be used again, this seems like a huge waste of some really good music.

does anyone agree with me here, and do you think this years pieces will avoid catching the dust of the filing cabinets of bandrooms all over the country?

Ipswich trom
15.03.2006, 22:45
does anyone agree with me here, and do you think this years pieces will avoid catching the dust of the filing cabinets of bandrooms all over the country?

We used Journey in our last two concerts and it went down really well with the audience, especially after they were told about the different sections and what they were representing.

Have also used Anglian Dances in a concert a couple of years ago.

DaveB
15.03.2006, 23:18
We used Journey in our last two concerts and it went down really well with the audience, especially after they were told about the different sections and what they were representing.

Have also used Anglian Dances in a concert a couple of years ago.
I can quite honestly say that if I ever see IOTM again the little men in white coats will have to take me away in a straight jacket.......
I know we have certainly cosigned it to the the darkest depths of our libary.

six pints
16.03.2006, 01:23
I can quite honestly say that if I ever see IOTM again the little men in white coats will have to take me away in a straight jacket.......
I know we have certainly cosigned it to the the darkest depths of our libary.

I think all 2nd section bands should be referred for post traumatic stress counselling. Perhaps a good session down the pub will work too mind!

DaveB
16.03.2006, 13:12
I think all 2nd section bands should be referred for post traumatic stress counselling. Perhaps a good session down the pub will work too mind!

Been there, Seen it, done it, got the hangoooovvveeerrrr....:tongue:
And yes , it did work.

Andy_Euph
16.03.2006, 14:03
so heres my big question, WILL THESE PIECES BE CONTINUED TO BE PLAYED IN THE NEAR FUTURE?!

Tamesides next week, wouldn't be surprised if the majority of bands play the area pieces, so in answer to your question... yes they will

Bayerd
16.03.2006, 14:34
Tamesides next week, wouldn't be surprised if the majority of bands play the area pieces, so in answer to your question... yes they will

You're probably right there Andy, however for how many is that neccessity rather than choice?

I think MaCTG's question was refering to whether the pieces would get an airing purely because of their merits as a standalone piece.

As a band we played the 2nd movement of Entertainments at a couple of concerts last year. It works well alone, and was well received by the audiences.

BTW, we're going on VoD next week, but that's more due to time constraints than anything else.

BbBill
17.03.2006, 00:40
Dont think we'll play Entertainments again, all the parts will have to go back to the conductors other band cos we got a loan of them!!

Then again, when are the bookies taking bets on when it will be used for the 4th section in coming years, if the current trend continues of reusing test pieces and that the standard keep improving...!!! :rolleyes: ;)

HBB
17.03.2006, 00:51
As far as I could see, Hepworth's Timp player played the CD but it was quite quiet. I think a handful of people whispered too, but I'm not sure.

We whispered, we thought it sounded more effective than the CD did.

Tim.
We're doign both now, we listened to the effects CD (where they sound like they're whispering on a bridge over the motorway) and it sounds really cool!

six pints
17.03.2006, 01:42
Been there, Seen it, done it, got the hangoooovvveeerrrr....:tongue:
And yes , it did work.

Excellent, no prizes ofr guessing where i will be saturday afternoon then!

madandcrazytromboneguy
17.03.2006, 04:19
as said in my last post, i didnt rate images and i dont think any bands who have had to play it at the areas will use it again, the other pieces tho could all potentially be used again, in my opinion

DaveB
17.03.2006, 13:20
Excellent, no prizes ofr guessing where i will be saturday afternoon then!

Lucky you, I've got an OAPs tea to play at, might not even make it to the pub till gone 6.
Have a beer for me to flush away any final memories of Images.:D

GJG
17.03.2006, 13:31
as said in my last post, i didnt rate images and i dont think any bands who have had to play it at the areas will use it again, the other pieces tho could all potentially be used again, in my opinion

Oddly enough, although I have no plans at present to programme it again, we did play "Images" at a concert a few weeks back as part of our preparations. As I usually do, I prepared a little "spiel" for the audience (fairly typical non-specialist, general-public, brass-band-in-the-park-type audience, fairly small(!)) outlining the background of the piece and explaining in non-technical terms what it was all about. After the concert I was quite surprised (scared, possibly!) by the number of people who came up and said how much they'd enjoyed it.

And although I guess the general consensus within the band is against it, I have had a number of members admitting (albeit surreptitiously) that the piece had grown on them ...

Bayerd
17.03.2006, 14:08
Oddly enough, although I have no plans at present to programme it again, we did play "Images" at a concert a few weeks back as part of our preparations. As I usually do, I prepared a little "spiel" for the audience (fairly typical non-specialist, general-public, brass-band-in-the-park-type audience, fairly small(!)) outlining the background of the piece and explaining in non-technical terms what it was all about. After the concert I was quite surprised (scared, possibly!) by the number of people who came up and said how much they'd enjoyed it.

And although I guess the general consensus within the band is against it, I have had a number of members admitting (albeit surreptitiously) that the piece had grown on them ...

My guess is that the fact you 'sold' the piece to the audience prior to performance went a long way to helping them appreciate it. Nice one!