When did bands get "Orchestralised"

Discussion in 'The Rehearsal Room' started by P_S_Price, Sep 10, 2012.

  1. P_S_Price

    P_S_Price Member

    Maybe its been happening gradually without my really noticing it, but at the Bridgewater hall festival this Saturday I became really aware of it.

    Basically all this poncing about with hugging, and clasping individual players, and individually welcoming the "Diva" cornet player in the same manner as the "Diva" viledinist in the orchestra!

    How did such a "working class" art form become so up its own behind? ;)

    **Puts tin hat on and retires to his trench**

  2. Space Cowboy

    Space Cowboy Member

    If only bands would now start to tune up on stage as well. ;-)
    Last edited: Sep 10, 2012
  3. :clap:
  4. P_S_Price

    P_S_Price Member

    True and lets ditch the militaristic uniforms and stick with the Penguin suits!
  5. James Yelland

    James Yelland Active Member

    It probably stems from the time that 'working class' bands started playing music from 'middle class' pursuits such as the opera and ballet - i.e around the mid-19th century, approximately. It gave the 'working class' something to aspire to. And a very good thing too.
  6. P_S_Price

    P_S_Price Member

    Perhaps a Monacle or too could be issued to the plebians, then we could really aspire to greater things
  7. johnflugel

    johnflugel Active Member

    I don't like over milking of applause or self congratulation but pigeon hole this to orchestras alone is breathtakingly ignorant and dare I say it maybe showing a bit of inverted snobbery. Look at any school show, theatre production, opera, sporting team etc etc and you will see the same thing.
  8. James Yelland

    James Yelland Active Member

    Yes, I think you dare.

    By the way, what instrument does a viledinist play on? The squeegee mop?
  9. johnflugel

    johnflugel Active Member

    He who dares wins James (or whoever you really are ;) ), or he who dares risks being publicly attacked by people on a forum
  10. P_S_Price

    P_S_Price Member

    Got some Bites then - but not as many as I expected!
  11. Anno Draconis

    Anno Draconis Well-Known Member

    How many decades is it since banding has been a "working class art form"? :confused:

    In fact, given the much-publicised demise of manufacturing industry to only 10% of the country's economic output, I'm curious how you even define "working class" these days?

    Welcoming the principal cornet on stage separately in the same way as an orchestra leader isn't new at all - I've been in bands that have did it many years ago.

    I've heard this "milking the applause" cobblers before, and I can't be doing with it. It's an amateur hobby, where to succeed and perform to the highest standards all the players in the best bands have to give up hours and hours of their free time in private practice and rehearsal. Granted, a few of them effectively play for a living but many don't. For a top flight band at a major contest there may well have been 20 hours rehearsal time put into a single 15 minute performance. Personally I think it's fine if that effort is acknowledged and everyone who's contributed gets stood up - assuming that the applause last long enough. When the audience have had enough, or if they weren't very impressed, they stop clapping. I know I do. Then any conductor who's over-egged it has to stand their band up and take a bow just as the clapping dies away, and risks looking stupid. What's the problem?
  12. P_S_Price

    P_S_Price Member

    Post performance "milking" has some justification, but the shmozzle of some conductor shaking the hand of the top solo cornet; before a note has even been played; and prior to that the occasional entry of the aforementioned cornetist after the rest of the band? Very orchestral!

    You dont see that at a school drama or theatre performance (Director comes on before the play and "swoons" all over the leading Hand!"

    Nahh - Lets see how good you are before you start self congratulating each other!

    Pretentious - Moi?
  13. P_S_Price

    P_S_Price Member

    (BTW let me actually emphasise this point, just in case the inflamatory "Diva" terms didnt switch you all on to the fact; This is a very much Tongue in cheek thread. I really did enjoy the whole day, and many many thanks to all the playes and conductors in :

    Carlton Main,


    School bands form Wardle/Little borough - (Loved that 118 children on the stage and they looked and played so smart and slick )

    National Youth Band

    And of course the final 3 (Briggus Dyke n Fodens) whcih sadly I never got to hear having been under a 3 line whip!
  14. Pauli Walnuts

    Pauli Walnuts Moderator Staff Member

    couldn't agree more!

    Once again, spot on.

    Anyway, for some bands, the hand shaking maybe because that's the first time the conductor has met him! ;)
  15. P_S_Price

    P_S_Price Member

    Ooohhh I like it - are you implying that conductor leading a band at a gig might not have reahearsed them? or that the player might be a "Ringer"
  16. KernowSop

    KernowSop Member

    Why is it that they say women gossip but men discuss? ;)
  17. Beesa

    Beesa Member

    All the self-congratulation and hand-shaking is cringewrothy and embarrassing. Like the footballers and sportspeople who cry and hug and hug and cry. The kids at school are doing the same now.

    In all my years, probably once after watching a championship band at the Areas did I join in the prolonged applause aftert a band gave an absolutely amazing performance.

    I then went into the Spanish Hall (yeah, Winter Gardens, North West) and a lower section band were doing the same thing, although it was to smatterings of 'golf applause'.

    Stop it. Stop it now. Earn your accolade at the end.
  18. its_jon

    its_jon Member


    Brass Bands play seated in an orchestral style circle...
    so.. the stagemanship deployed naturally lends itself to the orchestral model.

    and I would agree, a bit poncy at the best of times when 'over egged' ..its cringeworthy when the LSO does it.

    other than orchestral style stagemenship brass bands are lacking adventure in the stagemanship department.

    We do push the boat out a bit at entertainment contests but in general, our vision of good stagemanship is mearly dressing up everyone in a circus style outfit.
  19. P_S_Price

    P_S_Price Member

    aka poncing about?
  20. KernowSop

    KernowSop Member

    Our MD did it once, we took the **** on the coach trip home, he didn't do it again. :)

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