Triple Tonguing Question

Discussion in 'The Rehearsal Room' started by jo_g, Nov 18, 2008.

  1. jo_g

    jo_g New Member

    Is there a general consensus as to which triple tonguing method is best?

    Is it te-te-ke or te-ke-te?

    And there's also the alternative option of de-ge that I've seen suggested.

    So, which do people think is best? Is one easier to accomplish, but not necessarily the one with the best results? Or is it all a matter of which suits the player best?

    I need to improve my skills in this area and want to make sure I concentrate on the best method right from the start.

    Thanks! :)
     
  2. Hells Bones

    Hells Bones Active Member

    In my opinion, (Watch now, I will get insulted again for this) it is what best suits both you and the music.

    I tend to use Tuh-Tuh-Kuh, but when am faced with lines like the infamous muted section of the Imperial March, I find Tuh-Kuh-Tuh works better for me.

    Might not do for you

    Ho Hum

    Roll on the insults.
     
  3. HornMaster

    HornMaster Member

    The method I've always been taught is tu-tu-ku and I'm sure most people would be the same. The tu-ku-tu variation doesn't really work so well as rythmically it can place incorrect emphasis on certain notes. A series of triple tongued triplets played this way can end up with the third note of the triplet sounding like it is the first of the next one (hope that makes sense!!).

    I would suggest playing slow (short) quaver triplets with tu-tu-ku repeatedly to try and get a strong 'ku' as this is obviously the most difficult part. Once you feel comfortable with this, then start to speed it up gradually and only move up a notch tempo-wise when you're happy with it.

    The exercises in the Arban are good starting point for triple tonguing as well.

    Hope this helps

    Kevin
     
  4. lynchie

    lynchie Active Member

    Why you utter mor... actually, I'd agree.
     
  5. MoominDave

    MoominDave Well-Known Member

    Any version, if practised enough, will do a good job. I've heard some pretty uneven t-k-ts from people who hadn't practised them enough, a danger that t-t-k seems to avoid.

    d-g is just the same as t-k, but with a slightly different tongue shape/position. This will work fine too, if you work at it, in either d-d-g or d-g-d guise. It will sound a bit less 'brilliant' than using t-k.

    Alternatively, fastest and smoothest results can often be had by splitting double-tonguing syllables across two triplet groups:
    t-k-t k-t-k
    It's hard to coordinate, though...
     
  6. Mike Saville

    Mike Saville Member

    I can speak from experience on this one - I was hopeless at both triple and double tonguing when I entered the Royal College. Now I think I am better than most :eek: (all down to practice and not talent!! :)

    A couple of tips which I worked out for myself and which work very well for everyone that I have taught.

    First, whatever syllable you choose make sure you play both the t and k very short, and I mean very short. If they are too long you will end up with a muddy, unclear sound when you build the speed up.

    Second you need to make sure that your k is at least as good as your t. If it isn't your notes will be unbalanced and speed will suffer. Spend lots of time playing with k tongue only (try it at band tonight - do the whole rehearsal with k tongue - it'll be much better by the end of the evening and you'll have saved yourself a load of time in the practice room :). When k is as good as t start putting them together. Slowly at first and don't ever neglect clarity for speed.

    That should do it!

    Enjoy your practice!
     
  7. Will the Sec

    Will the Sec Active Member

    As others have said, try 'em all and use what's best for you.
     
  8. davidquinlan

    davidquinlan Member

    Both are equally valid and useful and should be mastered.

    Which to use depends entirely on what the music demands, i.e. what fits best.

    A useful exercies to help improve this area is to slow everything down, go back to tune a day book 1 (or any study book) and start again with the K articulation (as mentioned by Mike Saville above) for every note, focusing on getting this articulation clean. Then move on to T K , T T K, T K T, K T K , and any other combinations you can think of (replace the T's with D's and K's with G's if you are from that school... :)). The key point being start slow and work up the pace...
     
  9. Jan H

    Jan H Moderator Staff Member

    I ws taught to use t-k and t-t-k when the notes have to be short, like staccato and d-g and d-d-g when they have to be a litle broader, more flowing...
    The other advice I got from my teacher was (like other people already mentioned) to start doing it slowly and make sure that the different notes have the same length and the rhytm is very strict. Then progressively increase the speed
     
  10. brassneck

    brassneck Active Member

    The emphasis should be on control (of speed) and making sure the kick from the throat is strong to match tongue action. Saying that, any phonetic combination should be practised for the sake of style.
     
  11. theMouthPiece Visitor Guide

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  12. COOL CORNET CAVE

    COOL CORNET CAVE New Member

    I learnt triple tounging by saying
    Da-de-ge Da-de-ge up
    An other words: daddy get, daddy get up
    All thanks to my teacher Andy Mitchell
     
  13. mikelyons

    mikelyons Supporting Member

    Absolutely - control of the speed and balance of the three parts of the tongue action are the essential parts of triple tonguing - and practice, practice, practice...
     
  14. AEHOWGATE

    AEHOWGATE Member

    da-da-ga for speed, da-ga-da for evenness
     

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