The price of success!!!!

Discussion in 'The Adjudicators' Comments' started by peterg, Mar 26, 2011.

  1. peterg

    peterg Member

    It is strange that no one has yet commented on the vastly inflated entry fee for those bands who have flogged their respective test piece to death and produced a performance that has quailified them to enter the national finals.

    Last year, so i have been informed it was £85, this year £250, now thats what i call inflation. If you win your regional you only get £200 - not enough to pay for the entry.

    The band that i am involved with being one of the bands to gain this coveted invite were shocked at this figure. Obviously Kapitol seem to think that as they run the event, they can charge what they want irrespective of whether many of the lower section bands without sponsorship etc can afford it. Yep, i am sure many will simply dig deep into the band coffers and stump up the cash for the entry fee then begin the merry go round of raising the extra thousands of pounds to travel and stay overnight just to take part. I appreciate that not all bands will need to stay overnight but here won't be many who don't.

    It may well be the chance of a lifetime for some bands to play in the national championship finals but at what cost. Dundee cost my band just short of £8,000 in 2003.

    Any comments
  2. Accidental

    Accidental Supporting Member

    I agree it is very steep, but I would like to think it is Kapitol charging what they need to in order to fund the event, rather than just "charging what they like". Have you asked for an explanation?

    (The Spring Festival had a similar hike in entry fees last year, because the organisers needed to cover a massive increase in the cost of using the Winter Gardens)
  3. WoodenFlugel

    WoodenFlugel Moderator Staff Member

    I'm not denying its a big hike, but to be fair I'd guess a fair chunk of that cost goes towards the venue hire. Given that one of the reasons Kapitol moved away from Harrogate was due to the increase in the cost of hiring the International Centre it makes you wonder just how much it would've been if they'd stayed there.
  4. themusicalrentboy

    themusicalrentboy Active Member

    so from the 71 Lower Section Finalists, £17,750 will be raised....
  5. PlayerPete

    PlayerPete Member

    Just wondering what the entry fee is for the Championship section? Is it the same? £250?

    I would imagine running the finals at RAH is a little more expensive than Cheltenham or Harrogate. The lower sections will be raising over £20,000 through entry fees, over 80 bands at £250 each. Are we subsidising Top section finals?
  6. PeterBale

    PeterBale Moderator Staff Member

    I'm pretty certain that the income from ticket sales at the RAH will be considerably higher than any money coming in for the Lower Section Finals: yes, the costs are probably greater, but there is a greater chance of recouping expenses from the public.
  7. fartycat

    fartycat Member

    Yes, the fee for Championship section bands is also £250
  8. Chris Hicks

    Chris Hicks Member

    Important to point out that it's not just lower section bands that are sponsorless, many top section bands have to fund themselves as well!
  9. Bayerd

    Bayerd Active Member

    If you all feel it's too much, don't enter......
  10. davethehorny

    davethehorny Member

    I would quite happily pay the £250 myself so that my band could play at the finals.

    Missing out by one place two years in a row is quite hard to take.

    If one of the 4th Section bands from the West of England decides not to go, we would welcome the oportunity to represent our area for £250!!!
  11. Al

    Al Member

    Although it is not unknown, it is rare indeed for a band not to attend the Finals after qualification.
  12. Anno Draconis

    Anno Draconis Well-Known Member

    My sentiments exactly! My band has done exactly the same. So if Fodens, Faireys or Pem are feeling a bit strapped for cash...? Nah, didn't think so.

    £250 is LESS than £10 per player to attend the National Championships. Another symptom of bands wanting literally everything for cock-all. Sooner or later we're going to wake up to the fact that it's NOT a cheap hobby. It never was, it was just subsidised for us in the past by sponsors. Those days are gone, for all but a few lucky bands.

    It costs what it costs. If you don't like it, or can't pay it, decline your invitation in protest. That's your only weapon.
  13. I agreed playing in a brass band is an expensive commitment but then again so are many hobbies if you take them seriously.

    I would like to see seme explination for the reason in prices, but am sure a basic answer will only be for the incresed costs of putting on the event.

    On the posative side - we'll just have to put on a deceent concert in September to raise the funds, so something else to look forward to there during the build up.:p
  14. James Yelland

    James Yelland Active Member

    If your figure of £250 is correct, then it's £10 per head for a band of 25 players. Seems reasonable for what most bandsmen consider to the the apex of their playing careers, to play at a National finals.

    And you're right. Kapitol can charge what they like. They run the event and they take the risks.
  15. James Yelland

    James Yelland Active Member

    Spot on, sir.
  16. Space Cowboy

    Space Cowboy Member

    Agree 100%.

    It has always amazed me how many banders expect everything to be provided for them to carry out THEIR hobby. Band instruments, uniforms etc etc. I play in quite few other musical groups and have yet to come across and amatuer big band that provides you with a sax etc or orchestra which has violins or bassoons.

    My kids do lots of other hobbies. Football, karate, amateur dramatics, scout and cubs - these all seem to cost at least £3 per meeting / training session + annual subscriptions (£28 each for scouts) + kit/uniform + league fees to be registered for football league matches + entry fees and travel expenses to get to competitions. These groups are all well attended.

    Yet if a band were to tell people it's £3 per rehearsal, you need to bring your own instrument, a uniform will set you back £x, the coach to contest is £x each. There would be uproar as we've got used to living in our closeted bubble for too long.
  17. Ianroberts

    Ianroberts Well-Known Member

    I agree with the main crux of your arguement fella, but you need to know most if not all bands (apart from Championship in my opinion) pay subs. From the way you are talking I can only assume you have allways been one of the lucky ones playing for top bands (to save that going to your head I will add or just rich ones).

    So what is it that your banding costs you per rehearsal / month ?
  18. PlayerPete

    PlayerPete Member

    Several issues.
    1. I dont believe the issue is with the entry fee, but partly the fact it has gone up from £85 to £250. How much is it to enter the areas?
    2. Nearly every band has other expenses to consider in taking part in the finals. If they are lucky enough, they only need a coach, most bands will need to organise and pay for accomodation as well.
    3. How much is the finals prize money for sections 1 - 4? How much for Championship section?
    4. Shall we drop the area championships as qualifying for the finals? Shall we just let in the bands who are willing to pay the most?
    5. £250 might just be £10 per player. This player already pays £10 each month for subs. With the recent rise in fuel prices it now costs me £10 every rehearsal as well. I own 2 instruments of my own which I insist on using in bands I play with. I am lucky to have a good job and an understanding family - not everyone else is as fortunate. I am sure there are many people who are as committed as I to this hobby, but I still object to being taken advantage of - and I'm not playing at the finals!!
  19. tubafran

    tubafran Active Member

    That does seem to be an excessive increase and presummably the move from Harrogate to Cheltenham is for financial reasons i.e. its cheaper for the venue or why else would it have moved?

    It does beg the question why such a substantial additional fee should be collected from the invited bands providing an extra £15,000 in the entry fee.

    Perhaps there should be some explanation of that?

    And who decides the level of entry fee for the 450 bands that will be competing at the areas next year? Is the increase for attendance at the Nationals a fore taste of whats to come next year?
  20. ophicliede

    ophicliede Member

    It is an interesting one. The band that I belong to has attended the National Finals three times in the last four years and oh boy am I glad it's in Cheltenham this year (We are situated about 35 miles from The Centuar). That makes it a more economic proposition for a band full of young teenagers who are not working. The band has only been formed five years and our uniforms are just a black shirt and we have very few instruments that belong to the band. However we never let this be an issue and interfere with our aims and ambitions but it is not easy and I do not envy those bands that have to travel a great distance and stay in hotels. Good luck to all that have qualified and attend.