Sticking valves, Sov 928 cornet

Discussion in 'The Rehearsal Room' started by David Broad, Aug 27, 2017.

  1. David Broad

    David Broad Member

    We bought a couple of Besson Sovereign 928 large bore cornets for our principal players recently, great instruments, wonderfully responsive and above all easy to play, but while one has been trouble free the other has an infuriating tendency for the valves to stick in slow lyrical passages. The valves are fine on runs, scales etc waggle up and down faultlessly and then stick when you are playing slow melodies. Both our principal Cornet player who reverted to his JP 379(?) for this afternoon's performance and later this evening I myself had this issue despite cleaning the valves throughly and re oiling. Any suggestions gratefully received..
  2. 2nd tenor

    2nd tenor Well-Known Member

    As a first reply you might like to check out the keyways (all three faces) and key for being clear and smooth, sometimes a valve will rotate slightly and the key will drag against the side face of the keyway. I seem to remember a similar thread recently, or one that touched on the subject - worth a trawl back through recent months.

    I'm a Trombone player but I will play anything (or attempt to) that the MD asks me to. Sticky valves, particularly on instruments from long term storage, are the common - no Gov', it ain't my fingers what's slow it's 'em valves what's stickin.
  3. David Broad

    David Broad Member

    I did a search of sticking valves but there was nothing really relevant. The 928 has internally sprung valves with tiny springs and a single bar which slides in a slot right through the valve, I have never seen anything similar as my 920 has a brass collar and external springs and bands 927 have plastic collars and external springs. everything slides nicely until you play slowly and then the valves stick down.
  4. Jack E

    Jack E Well-Known Member

    David, if you bought the instruments from the manufacturer or from a musical instrument dealer, whether or not they were new, the legal fact is that you have a clear case for returning the faulty instrument to the shop and asking them to either fix it or refund your money. I'm sure you will do this politely, but if they dig their toes in, the law is definitely on your side.

    My sister went into this, checking it with the Trading Standards Office, when her son bought a faulty computer. The law says that, if someone is in the business of selling certain types of goods, then whatever they sell must be of 'merchantable quality' - in other words, fit for purpose. If a valved brass instrument has keys which stick, then - clearly - it is not fit for purpose, so you have every right to take it back. The same laws apply to a dealer, even if the goods that the dealer sold were second hand. So if, for example, you buy a used cornet from a musical instrument shop, it must still be in working order - even if it's 20 years old. It will obviously be worn, but it cannot be worn out, or have parts which don't work - unless the dealer clearly advertises it as "for spares or repair only".

    When my sister's son tried to return the computer, the dealer's first response was to say that my nephew would have to take it up with the makers. My sister (having checked) went to the shop and told the dealer that - legally - her son's contract was with the dealer, not with the manufacturer - and it was therefore the dealer's responsibility to sort it out with the customer, and for the dealer to get a refund for himself afterwards from the manufacturer.

    The dealer's next gambit was to say it was his store policy to only give a credit note in such cases - to which my sister responded by saying that the law said that if goods in such a case were faulty, then the dealer had only three options:
    1. Repair the faulty goods and put them in full working order;
    2. Replace the faulty goods with a new item;
    3. Refund the customer with the full purchase cost - in money, NOT with a credit note.

    Furthermore, that trading laws also said that the choice, as described above, was down to the customer, not the dealer! Needless to say, my nephew went for Option 3, and got his money back, in full.

    In contrast, if you bought the cornets privately, then the law says "Caveat Emptor" ('Let the buyer beware') - and the responsibility to check before the sale is down to the buyer, not the seller, whose only responsibility is to describe the goods honestly. So, if the seller sells it as "an ornament" or "for display purposes only", and it doesn't work, you have no comeback.

    The same applies if you buy something from someone who is not in the business of selling such articles - such as buying a cornet from a man who sells cars for a living, or buying from another band. If they are not "in the business of selling" articles such as the one you bought, they do not have the same legal responsibilities as a dealer selling goods in which he normally trades.

    If I found myself in the circumstances you describe, I would obviously try the polite approach first, but I'd have no hesitation in calling in the Trading Standards Officer if I felt I was being given the run around.

    HTH, and best regards,

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