Sop players???

Discussion in 'The Rehearsal Room' started by Kjata, Sep 23, 2009.

  1. Kjata

    Kjata Member

    Hey all,

    I've been playing sop again and am helping a band out in the 1st section finals on Sunday, but am unsure about tuning. My middle D's Eb's and E's are incredibly flat but over the rest of my range tuning is pretty much perfect, any ideas from anyone about correction or why this is happening would be appreciated?

    Ps I play on a cortois
  2. hunting_high

    hunting_high Member

    Use alternative fingering:

    1-3 for D
    -23 for Eb
    12- for E

    All the best,

  3. Kjata

    Kjata Member

    Yes that's what I've been doing but it's only a short term solution.
    Have you got any advice for solving the problem?
  4. towse1972

    towse1972 Active Member

  5. Jack

    Jack Member

    i think its just the way courtois are... i play both courtois cornet and sop... i find that top g on a cornet is flat for me and i find that middle A B and C are sharp on sop as well as below bottom e.... and anyway there is no instrument that has perfect tuning on everynote. You could just make a conscious effort to lip up these notes and then soon u will do it without realising and it will just feel like normal
  6. trombone-john

    trombone-john Member

    The only long term solution is to use your ears, and lip up those notes, or if they are covered on front row, leave them out!!
    4th harmonics will always be flat on any brass instrument, the shorter the instrument, the harder it is to keep them in tune.
    Everyone knows that sop is the hardest instrument in the band!

    Good luck at the finals
  7. hunting_high

    hunting_high Member

    I have been playing the Courtois for four-five years and am very satisfied.

    I have earlier played Schilke and have tried the Xeno but must admit I prefer the sound of the Courtois.

    It is (in my opinion anyway) easier to blend with the Bb-flat-cornets tone on a Courtois and to find a sop that is perfectly in tune on every note... I gave that up 15 years ago. :eek:) As Trombone-John says: The only long term solution is to use your ears. :eek:)

    All the best,

  8. steve butler

    steve butler Active Member

    No, you just make it sound hard John.

    Only joking mate :biggrin:
  9. Hells Bones

    Hells Bones Active Member

    Why do people see the use of alternate positions/valves on trombones/valved ins. as a cop out?

    Seriously, if it's better in tune on an alternate then use the alternate.

    Sure it's easier to split at first but you will get used to it and it will become second nature eventually.

    Did no one ever notice that Pete Roberts and Bert Van Theinen did/do all their top As on 3rd?

    Alternates all the way.
  10. johnsop

    johnsop Member

    I agree with hunting_high - 1/3 on D; 2-3 on Eb; 1-2 on E.

    I also use a Courtois, and like hunting_high I have tested Schilke and Yamaha Xeno. of those two I like the Xeno best (prefer the response in the high range), however, I prefer my Courois to both because of it's sound, it has a more exciting "zing" in the top range. However, the intontation on this instrument has a number of weaknesses, as have been previousy discussed.

    Good luck though, playing soprano is the best (though definitely the most difficult yet rewarding) seat in the whole band!

    John Atkinson,
    Soprano - Pemberton Old Wigan DW Band
  11. Vegasbound

    Vegasbound Active Member

    I would suggest seeking out a good pro trumpet player and having a consultation with them, get them to blow your instrument and then you will know if it's the horn or you!

    £30+ on a lesson may save you spending £100's on a new cornet to find the problem is you!!
  12. Ipswich trom

    Ipswich trom Member

    You could have fooled me!
  13. TommySop

    TommySop New Member

    As I am in the same contest this Sunday my advice to you would be to sell your "tortoise" and get a old Besson class A sop from in high pitch of course, push your tuning slide all the way in then blow like hell all the way through the piece.
    See ya there.
    Best of luck
  14. chill

    chill Member

    How do you play with your ears anyway ???
    Is there a special attachment for the mouthpiece !!!! ?:biggrin:
  15. GJG

    GJG Well-Known Member

    Indeed. And for that matter, £40-£50 on a new mouthpiece may also save you spending £100's on a new instrument.

    A change of mouthpiece cup profile/depth can often correct intonation issues; however I would avoid making any such change so close to a contest ...
  16. Kjata

    Kjata Member

    Whatya trying to say ian??
  17. Kjata

    Kjata Member

    My only problem with alternate valves is that I don't use them on Bb. However sometimes my tuning is so flat that even with me liping it up it is still flat!! But sometimes it's not too bad and a little adjustment it's fine?! Suggestions??

    Ps to those in the finals on Sunday come and say hello, I'll be playing with GT Group band! ;)
  18. Ipswich trom

    Ipswich trom Member

    Take up guitar?
  19. Bryan_sop

    Bryan_sop Active Member

    Bb cornet is that much longer, so you don't need to use so many alternative fingerings. It ver much depends on the instrument and the context of the music. I can find a certain note will be in tune in one context, then in another I have to use alternate fingerings with a bit of trigger. You have to just use your ears. Then you add mutes, which complicates things no end..... Try playing picc trumpet, then sop will seem comparitively easy!
  20. KMJ Recordings

    KMJ Recordings Supporting Member

    I'm with Hells Bones.

    Search Youtube for the videos of Pete and watch (and listen) to what he does....the Flowerdale recording is particularly nice....

    My production team are forever telling people over the talkback to use alternative fingerings. Every now and again I wonder why people have never bothered to do it before ;)

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