Senior Trophy

Discussion in 'The Adjudicators' Comments' started by mozart, Mar 31, 2010.

  1. mozart

    mozart Member

    I know that this subject has been raised before but with no satisfactory conclusion. I was of the opinion that the last four bands in the competition would be relegated to make way for bands on the waiting list.It now seems that at least one band in that position has been invited back to take part in this years competition.The reason given was that some bands that DID qualify for this years contest have withdrawn,thus the reason for the re-invitation, which appears to be fine. Except , there are Championship Section bands on the waiting list who have applied for a place that have not been contacted or recieved an invitation.On the face of it ,this dosn,t appear to be fair or rational. can anyone give a definitive reason or answer??
  2. Paddy Flower

    Paddy Flower Active Member

    Do you know who's in and who's not?
  3. Di B

    Di B Member

    It is the final six bands I believe, not four.

    That said, I don't know how they pick the bands to invite...
  4. DeafeningRoar

    DeafeningRoar Member

    They don`t need to be fair or rational, it`s a privately owned contest is the Senior Trophy!
  5. mozart

    mozart Member

    Thankyou that explains everything.
  6. tuba1974

    tuba1974 Member

    what bands are waiting, are they in the brass bands top 200 rankings, its privately run contest they invite who they want, over the moon were going, Ist time for 40 odd years, cant wait
  7. Accidental

    Accidental Supporting Member

    On paper, the bottom six bands get 'relegated' each year and six new bands are invited the next. Invitations are extended to Championship section bands, and they usually seem to go to the bands that 'put themselves out there', doing more than just a couple of contests a year and competing outside their own area, and moving up the rankings. Once a band is in the Spring Festival/Open system they stay there until they drop out of the bottom of the Trophy - if they drop a section (or more!) Nationally it doesn't matter as long as they keep earning their place at Blackpool. That's why there are several 1st section bands in the system.

    Last year a couple of spaces opened up in the Shield due to bands folding, so bands were moved up from the Cup and Trophy to fill the gaps and the two highest placed bands from the previous year's relegated six were invited back. Some other bands may have thought that was unfair, but its what the contest organisers chose to do. Their contests, their rules - DeafeningRoar was spot on!

    If your band is interested the best thing they can do is keep asking for an invite, and then enter more ranking and non-local contests (Brass at the Guild/Pontins/Butlins/Yeovil etc etc) to show them what you can do and get more ranking points.
    Last edited: Apr 5, 2010
  8. mozart

    mozart Member

    Congratulations and well done.Your band have been doing well lately and I am sure that they thoroughly deserve their invitation.I dont want to mention bands names specifically as it sounds like "sour grapes" but to answer your question one band in particular are ranked well into the top 200.
  9. MoominDave

    MoominDave Well-Known Member

    We couldn't get an invite even when we were briefly ranked something like 60th. Sure you're not talking about us as we are barely in the top 200 these days (198 I think at the mo), but we are another example.

    No point whinging as it is the organiser's prerogative to invite whoever they wish... Frustrating though.
  10. Frontman

    Frontman Member

    Have you never thought of actually writing to the organisers and requesting an invite or at least ask to be added to the list for the future. I wrote directly to Martin Mortimer regarding a band and they where invited two years later.
  11. MoominDave

    MoominDave Well-Known Member

    It's been done on more than one occasion.
  12. mozart

    mozart Member

    Ditto! didnt even get a reply!
  13. daitom

    daitom New Member

    Does that mean that in theory, although very unlikley to happen, a 4th section band could win the Grand Shield? or even the Open? If that band was promoted within the system over several years, whilst not competing in any other contest they would be relegated to the 4th section nationally .... Interesting!
  14. flash harry

    flash harry Member

    The thing is, the ranking system is nonsensical. If someone can explain that to me, I would be very interested to listen.

    If a contest is to invite bands based on ranking, the system must be fair and transparent. I do not think that it is and wait to be convinced otherwise.
  15. Accidental

    Accidental Supporting Member

    Yes, it does!
    You can bet a heck of a lot more than 6 bands apply every year, and its up to the organisers how they distinguish between them all...

    The invites aren't technically made based on ranking, its just that several bands have found that entering more contests outside their own regions, and moving up the rankings, has made them more noticeable to the organisers and arguably got them invited sooner than bands that don't put themselves out there so much.
  16. Di B

    Di B Member

    Just a thought.....

    I know of one band that applied SEVEN times on the trot before they got an invite!
    They were happy when they got that golden ticket though!

    Keep trying - so many bands want to be part of it and with a maximum of just 6 new places up for grabs each year you are competing against a lot of bands....
  17. Bass Man

    Bass Man Active Member

    I assume that this thread is directed at the Felling and RMT Easington Colliery Bands, given that both came in the bottom 6 last year and both have been invited back this year (please correct me if I'm wrong). Although I (admittedly) don't know how the invitation process works, along with many others; I am certain that both bands deserve another crack at the Trophy this year.

    1. Felling

    The band came 15th last year, fair enough, but the performance on the stand was of an extremely high quality, Unfortunately it did not find favour in the box. The band then went on to compete in the Championship Section at Pontins; they were placed a very creditable 4th, defeating 2 Grand Shield bands, 4 Senior Cup bands and 1 Senior Trophy band from this years line-up. After Christmas the band competed in the North of England area, and gained another creditable result.

    IMO I don't think there is any question about the bands invitation this year, I'm sure that they will give yet another high quality performance that will hopefully be given the credit it is due with some silverware, or at least a promotion into the Senior Cup for next years contest.

    2. Easington

    Another competent performance last year, which on another day could have found itself in the mix for the prizes. The band then went on to compete at the Land O Burns entertainment contest, being placed 5th in a relatively strong field of bands. The band then produced a CD with excellent tracks on it, played at the highest quality.

    Next came the Scottish Open, which I have already made my thoughts perfectly open about on another thread. The band produced a tight, lyrical account of Tristan Encounters with a fine interpretation from MD Roy Curran. There were few technical errors on stand and the band had a full rich sound about it. Several bands on the day (yes I heard every single one) did not fill any of these criteria, and I feel that last place was nothing short of an incompetent placing for the band.

    Easington are a fine band and, as with Felling, I am sure that they will deliver a fine performance of Le Roi d'Ys. I will be there on the day to cheer both bands on. They both work very hard and deserve this oppurtunity.

  18. mozart

    mozart Member

    The thread is not directed at any individual band or bands but rather to the system itself. The arguments that you put forward although very worthy are purely subjective .It has alresdy been stated that the selection process must be fair and transparent to be credible and I would add to that,it must also be objective. That said, best of luck to both bands in the contest.
  19. Anno Draconis

    Anno Draconis Well-Known Member

    Why? It's a privately owned and run contest. They can invite who the hell they like. Let's face it, it's not like bands are going to boycott the Open and its qualifying contests because the selection process isn't "transparent", "credible" or "objective".
  20. mozart

    mozart Member

    No one has suggested that they should or would but it does make the expression British OPEN a misnomer!