Rimmer Marches

Discussion in 'The Rehearsal Room' started by satchmo shaz, Mar 25, 2009.

  1. satchmo shaz

    satchmo shaz Active Member

    Hi experts, we have in our bandroom, handwritten scores of the Rimmer marches:-
    Dreadnaught, King of the Road, Salome, The Monarch and the Scindian. Does anyone know anything about them, are they good ones, are they still in print.
    any help appreciated. many thanks
  2. Frontman

    Frontman Member

    The people to contact are Wright and Round as they are the Wliiam Rimmer specialists when it comes to his music.
  3. satchmo shaz

    satchmo shaz Active Member

    Thanks, I checked their on line catalogue but cant find them so I have emailed them. In the mean time if anyone has old copies they could let me have sight of that would be great;)
  4. MoominDave

    MoominDave Well-Known Member

    I personally have never heard of any of these - so either I am ignorant or you could have something very interesting on your hands...

    AEHOWGATE Member

    Salome is a great march, I know John Maines brought a set to BT Band to play at Brass in Concert, so its tucked away in storage somewhere. I think John would also have his own set.
  6. Thirteen Ball

    Thirteen Ball Active Member

    Could be something very interesting indeed there, as Dave is one of the least ignorant people on here.

    I've not heard of any of them either, but generally speaking, you don't get duffers with Mr Rimmer's name on the top do you? I do recall hearing of a march called Dreadnought (with an O, rather than an A) but I don't remember it being a Rimmer.

    Could be something of a discovery....
  7. MoominDave

    MoominDave Well-Known Member

    I dunno; I could well be pretty ignorant on this one...
  8. James Yelland

    James Yelland Active Member

    Salome is reasonably well known - Fodens included it on their Rimmer CD of a few years ago, but like others here, that's the only one I recognise the name of.

    As for the handwritten scores - if they are the only record of some lost marches, then that is quite exciting. Although he did write quite a few. I've still got some ancient LPs with marches like Cross of Honour and Black Knight on them, and we rarely hear them any more.

    The question is, whose hand are the scores written in? Is there a signature somewhere? Are these Rimmer's originals, or are they (quite likely) something someone else scribbled out for rehearsal purposes? I only raise the issue because (assuming these are full scores), marches more often come with only condensed scores (or even 1st cornet parts with the bass solos included).

    Interesting stuff though.
  9. satchmo shaz

    satchmo shaz Active Member

    we have lots of handwritten scores, mainly done by a chap called Harry Evetts who conducted the band from 1908 till 1950, sometimes we have the music to go with the scores sometimes not.
    We also have some handwritten scores, obviously very old written by John Gladney one is Lucretia Borgia and the other escapes me at the moment
    BTW I have had a reply from W and R saying that they are all out of print:(
  10. MoominDave

    MoominDave Well-Known Member

    Then publish them! You could make a tidy profit and do the banding movement a valuable service at the same time...

    It does rather sound like you're got a treasury of things well worth bringing to wider attention...
  11. satchmo shaz

    satchmo shaz Active Member

    mmm might have to think about that, what would be the best way of doing it?:-?
  12. MoominDave

    MoominDave Well-Known Member

    I would have thought that there would be some band publishers that would be willing to take these on - I'm not sure who personally, but I'm sure others on here will have a better idea and good suggestions. One of the smaller places, maybe - somewhere where you could get the publisher excited about the prospect of resurrecting undeservedly lost music. Particularly if you Sibeliused up the scores for them in advance, I don't really see why they would object.

    Are the marches full score or just cornet/conductor? You might have to reconstruct them if not full score - but that should be doable.

    Copyright is a point [I seem to be posting an awful lot about it on here at the moment...].
    Rimmer died in 1936, so is no longer in copyright. John Gladney died in 1911, so ditto. You might need to investigate other authors.
  13. James Yelland

    James Yelland Active Member

    Now there's a famous name. You haven't got a copy of a piece called Orynthia by James Melling as well, have you? If so, treat it with respect - brass band historians will be very interested in it!

    If you really do have a bit of a treasure chest, perhaps you ought to compile a list and let someone like Paul Hindmarsh or Roy Newsome have a look at it - they are both interested in the history of brass bands (as am I, but lack the expertise of the two gents mentioned). Now that I think of it, Mr H is connected with the Brass Band Heritage Trust who might well be interested in your library.
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2009
  14. satchmo shaz

    satchmo shaz Active Member

    well here is the list

    A) Scores that we do not have separate band parts for

    Alexander's Feast Michael Laurent Printed Score
    The Amber Witch W. V. Wallace Selection Handwritten Score (H. Evetts)
    Attila Verdi Selection Handwritten Score (H. Evetts)
    Belisario/Gems of Evergreen Melody Donizetti/(Unknown) Handwritten Score
    A Bouquet of Ballads E. Newton Selection Handwritten Score
    Britannia's Crown of Song H. Round Fantasia Handwritten Score (H. Evetts)
    Britannia's Pride Ed. Powell Patriotic Fantasia Handwritten Score
    Cinq Mass Gounod Grand Selection Handwritten Score
    Concert Suite Cesar Cui Printed Score
    Crispino Ricci W. Rimmer Selection Printed Score
    Crispino Ricci H. Round Selection Handwritten Score
    Crown Diamonds Auber H. Round Selection Handwritten Score
    Der Wildschutz Lortzing Selection Printed Score
    Don Carlo Verdi Selection Handwritten Score (H. Evetts)
    Dreadnaught W. Rimmer March (Contest) Handwritten Score (H. Evetts)
    Echoes of the Opera W. Rimmer Selection Printed Score
    Elisees of Love/Bellini (Unknown)/H.Round Handwritten Score (H. Evetts)
    Emilia Donizetti W. Rimmer Selection Printed Score
    Euryanthe Weber H. Round Handwritten Score
    Faust Gounod Selection Handwritten Score (not F18 or F75)
    Faust Gounod Shipley Douglas Grand Selection Handwritten Score (not F18 or F75)
    The Folk Songs of Old England E. Newton Selection Handwritten Score
    A Garland of Classics W. Rimmer Selection Printed Score
    Great Britain H. Round Handwritten Score
    I due Foscari Verdi Selection Printed Score
    Intermezzo Mascagni Handwritten Score
    Irresistable/ Prelude W. Rimmer/Rachmaninov n.a./W. Rimmer Quick March Handwritten Score (H. Evetts)
    Jessonda Spohr Selection Printed Score
    King of the Road W. Rimmer Handwritten Score
    Kyrie and Gloria (12th Mass) Mozart Handwritten Score (H. Evetts)
    L'Africaine Meyerbeer Grand Selection Printed Score
    La Favorita Donizetti Selection Printed Score
    Lalome W. Rimmer Quick March Handwritten Score (H. Evetts)
    La Russe/Sons of Victory/Echoes of the Ocean W. Rimmer/W. Rimmer/H. Round Quick March Handwritten Score (H. Evetts)
    La Traviata Verdi H. Round Selection Handwritten Score (H. Evetts) (not L20)
    Leider ohne Worte (Songs without Words) Mendelssohn Handwritten Score (H. Evetts)
    The Lily of Killarney Sir J. Benedict Selection Handwritten Score
    Lohengrin Richard Wagner Grand Selection Printed Score
    Love's Triumph W. V. Wallace Round Selection Handwritten Score
    Melodies of the Past W. Leddon Handwritten Score
    Mignonne Beethoven Suite Printed Score
    Minnett [Minuet?] Boccerini G. Hawkins Handwritten Score (H. Evetts)
    Monarch W. Rimmer Quick March Handwritten Score (H. Evetts)
    Moses in Egypt/Dawn of Freedom Rossini/W. Rimmer Selection/Quick March Handwritten Score (H. Evetts)
    Nibelungen March on Themes from Die Ring des Nibelungen Richard Wagner Gregor J. Grant Handwritten Score (H. Evetts)
    Oberon/Betly Weber/Donizetti (Unknown)/H.Round Selection Handwritten Score
    Old Favourites (Unknown) Handwritten Score
    Parsifal Wagner Selection Printed Score
    Raymond Ambroise Thomas W. Rimmer Overture Handwritten Score
    The Scindian W. Rimmer Contest March Handwritten Score (H. Evetts)
    Song Echoes W. Rimmer Selection Printed Score
    Songs of Scotland H. Round Handwritten Score
    Songs of Sentiment H. Round Selection Handwritten Score
    Sons of the Sea W. Rimmer Fantasia Handwritten Score
    Tutti in Maschera Pedrotti W. Rimmer Grand Selection Printed Score
    William Tell Rossini Ballet Music Handwritten Score (H. Evetts) "First Prize. Section A. Belle Vue Gardens Manchester May 16th 1942"
    Zampa Herold W. Rimmer Overture Handwritten Score (H. Evetts) (not Z3 or Z4)
    Zar und Zimmermann (Tsar and Carpenter) G. A. Lortzing Selection Handwritten Score

    I havent heard of a lot of this stuff!
  15. MoominDave

    MoominDave Well-Known Member

    Some of this looks potentially very interesting indeed... I've noted after the line where I've spotted titles that match those of test-pieces for major contests of many years past... I don't know how many original copies of these pieces have survived - anyone else?

    1881 Open

    1863 Open

    1866 Open

    1886 Open

    1916 Open. Is it arr. C.G. Godfrey? Did H. Evetts maybe simply copy it out or rearrange for different forces?

    1919 Open. Is it arr. C.G. Godfrey?

    1922 Open. Is it arr. M. Johnstone?

    Matches 1860 Open - but can't be, as Rimmer wasn't born then...

    I had a bit of a look at the LESPB website - it says it was founded about 100 years ago by members of a previous band in Long Eaton. I'm wondering what library ancient Open test pieces might have come from?
  16. MoominDave

    MoominDave Well-Known Member

    Looking at the bands listed by 4BR as competing at some of those contests, one name jumps out at me:

    South Notts, conducted by John Gladney, unplaced in 1886, the year one of these pieces ('La Favorita') was used.

    Could this hint at the source of some of your scores?
  17. Di B

    Di B Member

    Think Stanton Ironworks band was around before LE? I know some music came from there and it would have been local too.... Apart from that I am clueless as usual :)
  18. satchmo shaz

    satchmo shaz Active Member

    there was also Long Eaton Town band and Long Eaton temperence band too as well as Sawley Brotherhood and Sawley Excelsior
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2009
  19. Oodle Bugler

    Oodle Bugler Member

    Maybe this needs more looking at.

    I know one or two bands who have in their libraries some obscure hand-written works. Not necessarily hand-written by the composer or MD at the time, I think hand-written stuff was the byword before photocopiers came along and may not necessarily be a link to anyone in particular.

    But, nonetheless, it would be interesting for all bands to have a rummage in the archives and see what they could find.
  20. satchmo shaz

    satchmo shaz Active Member

    I have an expert coming to look at all the music tomorrow so should have an update soon
    Hope its worth loads of money cos our club could do with some major repairwork! ;)

Share This Page