Open result

Discussion in 'The Adjudicators' Comments' started by berkshire_baritone, Sep 10, 2017.

  1. the result of the 2017 British Open appears to have raised more eyebrows than usual. Cory third looked odd (many there thought they'd won by a mile), dyke in 17 given how well they apparently played is making a bit of a mockery of it.

    I'm not saying the adjudicators used a dartboard and a blindfold but perhaps the tent walls acted a bit like ear plugs?

    How much longer will it be before anything is actually changed? Or will next year be the same process again?
     
  2. Tom-King

    Tom-King Well-Known Member

    Sorry, I must be missing something, are you saying the result was wrong?

    Because as far as I can see there were three respected judges in the box (and several more in the audience) who gave an honest set of results...
    Maybe they were looking for different things to some in the audience, maybe they couldn't see one of the things the audience was looking for (;))?

    Honestly, it sounds like interpretation was the key criteria with the adjudicators this year - certainly one of the more subjective facets of performance, but still an incredibly important one - maybe this simply wasn't the year for stunning technical performances of slightly maverick interpretations certain conductor's favour at times (and are celebrated for)?
     
  3. tallyman

    tallyman Member

    Just out of curiosity what order did you have the bands in ? Cory played well as we have come to expect and as a result finished in the prizes, Dyke did not play well and as a result finished at the other end of the table. Although Valasia and Whitburn were perhaps not as accurate and detailed as Cory or Grimethorpe IMHO,they were very simular to each other and very different to everyone else and they played well.
     
  4. Hsop

    Hsop Member

    Unfortunately I was unable to be at the British open this year and instead followed the live comments given by 4barsrest.com. The results were surprising in comparison to what 4barsrest had predicted however musical performances are always open to various interpretations even by experienced adjudicators. I found that the marking criteria that Steven Mead uses seems to have it's benefits in assessing how a band has performed and makes end of contest placings perhaps easier to manage.

    Hopefully anyone that was at the contest in person can offer some feedback on the event and if they thought the results were accurate. It was very unexpected to see Black Dyke finish 2nd last. I heard them play at Gateshead in concert earlier this year and they were fantastic. However that's the nature of the twists and turns of contesting.
     
  5. tallyman

    tallyman Member

    If you take a look at the Bandsmans live coverage not one of their three " experts" mention Dyke in their top six predictions or the three adjudicators for that matter.
     
  6. damarocto

    damarocto Member

    I heard 17 bands yesterday, and the only change in the top 4 I would have suggested, was that I'd have put !grimethorpe in there rather than brighouse!!
    As for dyke, I personally thought that their positon was about right. No problem with the winners, although i thought it was a toss up between them and cory! Witburn deserved to be up there, for me just behind grimy.
    I thought the standard was excellent and thoroughly enjoyed some great performancies on a cracking piece!
     
  7. Fettler

    Fettler New Member

    Not in attendance either. Having read through the 4br comments and s mead marks, it would appearance either Messrs Thomas and Mead 'listened with their eyes' and favoured the 'big band's which is the justification for closed adjudication; or the adjudicators got it wrong big time.
    There is of course the possibility that in picking what they considered the best or most musicaly satisfying performance, they discounted the less satisfying performances by the 'best' bands.
    Once again, it raises the question of whether the purpose of a contest is to identify the best bands, or the best interpretation. If musicality is at the forefront of the judges minds, then maybe they will overlook many of the technical points on Mr meads list.
    Having said all that, you'd have to be bonkers to ever put Wingates above Dyke.
     
  8. damarocto

    damarocto Member

    How can you justify that statement when you didn't attend? I thought that wingates played very well, and unlike 4 bars rest, i didnt listen with my eyes! The comment dissing andy macdonald was pathetic! He nailed it!!
    I didn't know the piece at all before I went yesterday, but after listening dyke, I found myself looking for the score, thinking ! Are the other bands playing the end tune wrong , or is dykes ensemble playing as bad as it sounds!!
     
  9. tallyman

    tallyman Member

    To be fair Dyke were neither musical or technically proficient, yes the same could be said for Wingates but are we not just comparing different shades of the proverbial. If you don't play well you are likely to finish towards the bottom end of the table.
     
  10. tallyman

    tallyman Member

    Just to be clear I thought Wingates played better than Dyke.
     
  11. Tom-King

    Tom-King Well-Known Member

    To be honest, I think you'd have to be rather bonkers to think that any band is immune to the occasional off day... Or that any band at this level that really wants it isn't capable of putting in an especially long shift in order to boost its chances.

    As in any sporting event, there can always be unexpected results that are deserved (as we as some that are not).
     
  12. Fettler

    Fettler New Member

    Possibly slightly tactless to pick on Wingates when there are probably a handfull of bands there that have less capable players on every single chair than Dyke. Sorry for any offence caused. No idea who Andy macdonald is sorry - does he or his father own a farm?
    On a more serious point, looking through the live comments on 4br there does seem to be a correlation between the loudness and the top placings? Indeed the winners were described as a bit ott.
     
  13. damarocto

    damarocto Member

     
  14. damarocto

    damarocto Member

    I don't understand that! As the piece was written about a mining explosion! The winning band did have big sound, but not the loudest! However they were one of the few bands that actually sustained the big sound!!
     
  15. PeterBale

    PeterBale Moderator Staff Member

    One or two people have commented that a lot more detail is heard by those sitting near the front of the hall, whereas the box is at the back. Equally, that would probably have had an impact on the perception of bands overblowing, which was mentioned occasionally.

    Having heard all the bands apart from Whitburn and Wingates I felt Valaisia would run Cory very close, and I was also very impressed with Fodens and Bram Tovey's interpretation. Dyke did not somehow seem fully committed but I don't know that I would have placed them quite as low. It seemed strange to start before they had been announced. Fortunately they were a completely different kettle of fish in this afternoon's concert, when they and Cory were on top form.
     
  16. Fettler

    Fettler New Member

    Interesting to hear. It seems that the 4br presentation of this as a 'shock' result in the hall is not representative?
    I'd be interested to know where Chris Thomas and Steve mead sat. Clearly some of the overblowing/playing of loud dynamics and technical rough edges they perceived didn't make their way through the walls of the adjudicators box at the back?
    Not a pop at the musicianship or integrity of either the 4br pundits or the men in the box by the way - just an observation that circumstances colour perception.
     
  17. PeterBale

    PeterBale Moderator Staff Member

    The press seats are in the terrace seats on the left side facing the stage.
     
  18. ConnorGingell

    ConnorGingell New Member

    Why do people always find it necessary to mention Wingates... can I ask what Band you play for? And whether or not you have ever played at the open? We all know Wingates aren't Black Dyke, but who on earth are you to comment on Wingates when you didn't even attend?
     
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2017
  19. Fettler

    Fettler New Member

    I've never had the honour of performing at the open, but have been a,spectator on several occasions. I have already apologised for unfairly singling out Wingates, and only did so because after one cursory look at the results they were the only 'less fancied' outfit that I could recall that finished above Dyke. I'm sure Wingates are a fine band, and I also never said anything derogatory about Allan Macdonald as another poster seemed to suggest.
     
  20. Nuh Bell

    Nuh Bell New Member

    I thought the results were very fair, although like others, would have put Grimethorpe higher. I loved Valesia's interpretation. I heard things from their performance that no other band brought out, and I know several people who were moved to tears by their playing. It didn't contain any of the slips and clips that others had. Whitburn were superb. Again, loved their interpretation, and the playing was super. Cory had their usual amazing sound. An incredible top 3. Black Dyke seemed to be having an 'off-day', and it just didn't come off for them. That doesn't mean the adjudicators didn't know what they were doing. It was a fabulous test-piece, and I enjoyed listening to all the bands. A great day for band enthusiasts. It is a shame if people are going to say it is bad adjudicating every time the 'big names' don't win.
     

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