No Jonny Wilkinson.....

Discussion in 'Off-Topic Chat' started by yr_epa, Apr 11, 2005.

  1. yr_epa

    yr_epa Member

    Hard to believe but Sir Clive has decided not to name Jonny in the original Lions Squad to tour NZ, however, he has indicated that if Jonny can prove 100% fit, then he will tour with the squad!

    Here is the full 44-man squad:-

    Lions squad:
    Backs: I Balshaw (England), G Murphy (Ireland), J Robinson (England), G Thomas (Wales), S Williams (Wales), J Lewsey (England), S Horgan (Ireland), D Hickie (Ireland), T Shanklin (Wales), B O'Driscoll (Ireland, capt), G Henson (Wales), O Smith (England), G D'Arcy (Ireland), W Greenwood (England), S Jones (Wales), R O'Gara (Ireland), C Hodgson (England), M Dawson (England), D Peel (Wales), G Cooper (Wales), C Cusiter (Scotland).
    Forwards: G Rowntree (England), A Sheridan (England), M Stevens (England), G Jenkins (Wales), J White (England), J Hayes (Ireland), G Bulloch (Scotland), S Thompson (England), A Titterrell (England), S Byrne (Ireland), D Grewcock (England), B Kay (England), M O'Kelly (Ireland), D O'Callaghan (Ireland), P O'Connell (Ireland), M Owen (Wales), R Hill (England), N Back (England), M Williams (Wales), L Moody (England), S Taylor (Scotland), M Corry (England), L Dallaglio (England).

    Looks like a super squad (minus JW), I'm sure that Colin Charvis will be a bit down that he is not selceted after an awesome Autumn Series. Ollie smith in front of Jamie Noon and Mathew Tait (might suprise a few aswell!).

    Pleased for Cusiter and Shanklin who weren't in my original squad, nice one!

    Any thoughts??
  2. PeterBale

    PeterBale Moderator Staff Member

    As I see it, the problem with taking Wilkinson with doubts over his fitness is that he could come to be seen as something of a talisman: I seem to remember something similar when England took Bryan Robson to a big competition despite fitness problems - there were high expectations, and morale crumpled somewhat when he broke down (as many had forecast would happen).
  3. SuperHorn

    SuperHorn Member

    Questions Marks over the following :

    Neil Back - too old - Colin Charvis or Simon Easterby or Jason White.
    Ian Balshaw - Should be Kevin Morgan
    Shane Bryne Gordon Bulloch - Should be Mefin Davies
    Will Greenwood ????????????????????????
    John Hayes - why not Adam Jones - there must be other number 3's in Britain.
    Charlie Hodgson - ??????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
    Lewis Moody - should be Joe Worsley - Dafydd Jones.
    Geordan Murphy - out of form totally.
    Donnacha O'Callaghan - why not Stuart Grimes or Cockbain or Sidoli
    Andy Sheridan - who is he ??????????
    Matt Stevens - Who is he??????
    Andy Titterell - who is he ??????

    Disgraceful selection of mainly English players that have not performed and not under achieved.
  4. Red Elvis

    Red Elvis Active Member

    Think that Sir Clive has taken the only realistic option open to him with Jonny - there is just no way that he can be relied upon for what promises to be a gruelling tour and had he gone , the chances would have been high that he would break down early on.

    Was interesting to note the backlash from england rugby following Wales's grand slam in some quarters over recent weeks - Jeremy Guscott on Saturday insisting that if the lions played like the welsh in NZ then they would be stuffed , and should go for a more pragmatic "English" style of play . I would not agree , and despite being a proud english fan , I am also surprised to see names in the squad that perhaps should not be there. The Ghosts of 2003 are still stalking the committee rooms at HQ obviously!!
  5. fitzy

    fitzy Active Member

    It would be great to see the Lions play an ANZAC (Australia and New Zealand) side though I doubt it would be any fun for the Lions surporters ;)
  6. tinytimp

    tinytimp Member

    Hmmmm....choice of squad nothing to do with the nationality of the coach? Methinks friends and I haven't even heard of some of the English players!! :eek:

    What hapened to Robin McBryde? If Woodward wants experience, as he says to justify the inclusion of Dallaglio and Back, then you can't have much better than that. Hey, why not just go after Quinnell and Neil Jenkins too?

    And why leave the options open for Wilkinson just in case he gets well in time? Surely he's not going to be fit enough, having not played international rugby since the World Cup or whenever it was. :mad:

    Grrrr!!! That's enough Welsh rugby patriotism for now, I'm going to go and lie down in a darkened room.......
  7. yr_epa

    yr_epa Member

    Even though i'm 110% welsh, McBryde might be hard as nails but cant hit his men in the line out! Dalladlio is quality (still) but not too sure about Back's inclusion to the squad!

    Can only think Back's inclusion to the squad is to help Williams in the test team!!!

    He must be thinking


    Can't wait.................COME ON!!!
  8. stephen2001

    stephen2001 Member

    Wilkinson is not in the squad yet, but if he proves his fitness, then he may make the trip. Just because his name has not been announced today doesn't mean he'll be spending Summer in blighty.
    It is a very shrewd move by Sir Clive because if you think about it, it will really push Wilkinson, and other notable absentees such as Richard Hill during the rest of the league season to show they are hungry to go to New Zealand as players.
  9. lewis

    lewis Member

    Woodward will take Wilkinson I'm sure. It's to put off eveyone saying it's silly naming an injured player. Woodward's been round the block now he knows how to handle the press, and by not naming Johnny it gives the team more press!
  10. lynchie

    lynchie Active Member

    nice to see mr woodward as predictable as ever... england have been playing rubbish and yet 19 english players in the squad already... and some very average english players at that! And I don't think Wilkinson deserves to be in the Lion's squad. He hasn't played properly in a year and a half, and needs a lot more recovery time before he's going to be anywhere near the standard. I wouldn't trust him to be able to kick better than O'Gara or the welsh lad who was kicking very nicely in the 6 nations. I'd rather see Colin Charvis added to the squad.
  11. carlwoodman

    carlwoodman Member

    I raised my eyebrows at some of the fringe English players getting in, people like Sheridan, Stevens and Titterell. Sheridan is very strong apparently (can out-benchpress anyone) but I'm not sure about his credibility as a prop. Titterell is very quick for a hooker be won't it be winter in NZ and the pitches full of mud?
    I can see why Woodward has gone for Back and Dallaglio. I'm sure his thinking is that these guys have actually won a test in NZ (2003) and there aren't many players from the British Isles that can say that. Having said that, I'm still a little surprised that Back is included and perhaps goes to show the lack of world-class open-siders from the 4 home nations.
  12. Lauradoll

    Lauradoll Active Member

    Jonny Wilkinson goes to my gym. He looks fit enough there when I see him ;-)
  13. geordiecolin

    geordiecolin Active Member

    I'm surprised Wilkinson goes to a public gym, I was present when he was granted planning permission to convert some dis-used kennels at his house in Slaley to a private gym of some size. He's got a very nice house! (Albeit in the middle of nowhere)
  14. Chunky

    Chunky Active Member

    I can understand why Woodward has taken some more experienced older players, especially the English ones.

    What you have to remember is that basically you need 2 sides out there, one for mid week and one for the weekend test matches. You will need people who have been there, seen it and in the case of the English players done it.

    A lot of the form players from Wales and Ireland have not had the experience of playing against New Zealanders or being on a Lions tour or in some cases even playing in the World Cup.

    Woodward is a winner, his preparations are meticulous and rest assured he would not take people out of sentiment he is there to win.
  15. postie

    postie Member

    This has nothing to do with Rugby but a couple of years England Cricket took Gough to Australia wasn't fit stupid idea. The moral of that is always take players that are 100% fit nothing else will do especially against the All Blacks.
  16. choirmaster

    choirmaster Member

    I think woodward has insulted a lot of players with his selection. Wales have been playing consistently well since the autumn at least, not just during the 6 nations. I can't remember the last time england did play well, but it's been some time . They blame the lack of form on the injuries they have, but hey, all the other nations have had similar, and with the playing population england have ( I belive the 2nd highest in the world) they should theoretically be able to put out a fifth choice team and still win.
    Yes,england did win the world cup, however, that was due only to the power of the boot, and now that isn't there you can see how much wilkinson has been relied on and also shows that the england team isn't as good as they believe. Therefore, the idea of putting players on the tour that have 'done it before' isn't quite credible.
    Another point, why should Larry Dayglo and Neil Back be allowed to tour if they can't be a**ed to play for their own country? It has to be a point of principle.
    I'd be happy to give 100% support to the Lions even if they were all english as long as the selection was deemed fair. However, the make up of woodward's party leaves a slightly bitter taste. Can anyone attempt to justify woody's selections 100%? :mad:
  17. Lauradoll

    Lauradoll Active Member

    The whole of the Newcastle Falcons use my gym. It's a private members only one like. Very easy on the eye when you're working out like! And extremely treatworthy.
  18. Jasonp

    Jasonp Member

    Very well said.

    I'm very dissapointed with the selection. I hope I'm proved wrong, but I dont think this squad will produce the goods. :(
  19. geordiecolin

    geordiecolin Active Member

    Alas (from a female point of view) the only sports "stars" who use the Sheffield Uni Gym are from Sheffield Weds and they're all charvas with nationwide league haircuts. They're really lazy, I do more running than them!! Can tell you've been in the North East a while now - "It's a private members only one like"!!! :biggrin:

    With regards to the Lions squad - surprised Cueto missed out. I don't the squad's too unfair, a good mix of English Forwards and Welsh Backs imho.
  20. Lauradoll

    Lauradoll Active Member

    "like" is also a Scottish thing like. Haway haway why aye haway gannin doon tha toon haway.

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