Misplaced "joke"...

Discussion in 'The Rehearsal Room' started by Andy_Euph, Oct 8, 2012.

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  1. Ianroberts

    Ianroberts Well-Known Member

    I wasnt going to dignify you with any posts on here but you need to understand that I people do not need your views ramming down there throats, I have also said that in the main I agree with you. But as for saying exactly the same thing the dozens of times you have done on this thread is very boring to most of us. I realise that you like the sound of your own keyboard, but not every one does ! In short you are starting to come across as some form of maniac !
     
  2. MoominDave

    MoominDave Well-Known Member

    So Ian, if one person posts something, then somebody else posts a reply that has an obvious hole in it, and then the first person responds, pointing out the obvious hole... If then a whole group of new people turn up in succession, each posting the same obviously holey reply, then are you saying that it is general bad manners to reply to these new people pointing out the hole? Surely not? That would just be giving in to mob rule.

    The problem is that this mode of communication is something akin to a whole lot of one-on-one conversations going on at once. If it was threaded so that posts branched off from those they reply to as a tree with many branches, you would see a lot of short conversations that looked very similar rather than the same conversation over and over again in a straight line.
     
  3. Sonorous

    Sonorous New Member

    Hi Ian, it's a good job my phone logged me out, otherwise I wouldn't have seen this post from you.

    And I'm glad I did because it's polite, constructive (in the main) and isn't just some attempt to ridicule, dismiss or goad someone. I have had to re-evalute you on this basis (and subsequently I've take you off ignore) Your points in this post are mostly valid. I don't think I'm a maniac, but I guess if someone's is genuinely bonkers, would they realise it?!! So I'm probably the wrong person to judge :)

    It does beg the question why you persisted in such a childish and unconstructive campagin during the thread though!! To be honest, if people like yourself and dannycolin had posted more in the nature you've just posted, this would have been a much more constructive (and probably shorter) discussion thread.

    I don't want to go round in circles (genuinely, as much as you may not believe me). And I'm not out to 'get' stan. My repeated discussions on this have been purely about the apparant inability to see why it's a problem (ie it appears to be more important in people's adgenda to condem the people who disagree with it, than to support the fact that we need to learn from it). And to be honest, much of the debate has gone off on interesting tangents rather than just be a rehash of the same thing over and over again. Unfortunately by it's very nature it keeps getting referred back to the original point, it wouldn't make any contextual sense if it didn't.

    Anyway, I'm delighted to be talking in this way with you Ian. Thank you :)
     
  4. The Godfather

    The Godfather Member

    And on, and on, and on---------------- Yawn---------.
     
  5. DannyCollin

    DannyCollin Member

    his conducting's a bit manic an all ;)
     
  6. Sonorous

    Sonorous New Member

    Finally I agree with you!! ;-)
     
  7. flug_gal

    flug_gal Member

    I firmly believe there are two different issues being confused in this thread, which, whilst they are linked, are not the same thing.

    The first is that of the tasteless and offensive performance given at Bolsover by Hatfield Colliery Band - this is an individual mistake, they apologised and punishments have been given, or are being discussed and action is being taken. Whether the individuals are racist or not is not the discussion, it is the offence caused by their performance and the damage to the reputation of the movement generally which needs addressing.

    The second issue is the lack of diversity in banding generally. I can only speak from my own experiences here, but as recently as a year ago I was in a rehearsal when we had a guest conductor in to wag, during the course of the rehearsal he was sexist and used the term 'p*ki' this conductor is well known in banding and has played at the highest levels, however thought this was appropriate language to use. It seems to me that casual racism in banding is still rife, and it's wrong. I'm not a member of the uber PC brigade or whatever else this post may trigger in response, however there are many people who seem to believe that describing someone as old-school is an acceptable way of glossing over what is simply unacceptable behaviour in the twenty-first century. I would not play under this MD again, and when asked to recently by the band he now conducts I have said no and explained my reasons why to the band chairman.

    Whilst these attitudes are still deemed acceptable in the movement it is another block to increasing the diversity of our players, not the only problem - other people in this thread more knowing than I have already identified other barriers, probably not even the main problem, but still a significant barrier.
     
  8. mikelyons

    mikelyons Supporting Member

    As far as I'm concerned, the only thing you are at all guilty of, perhaps, is a tendency towards hectoring and a doggedness in pursuit of a point that, TBH, had already been made. Several times. (But then we are all not stone proof!)

    Also, I never made this debate personal, nor was I ever offended or upset by any of your arguments. AFAIAC you are just as entitled to your opinions and your understanding as I am of mine and just as entitled to say what is on your mind. I sometimes cringed at the responses of other people, which were childish, petulant and as ill-conceived as the event that brought this thread about in the first place. I wonder the mods let this thread continue, given some of the things that were said, but at the same time I am glad they did. Racism, sexism and genderism are abhorrent in all their forms and it is important that people discuss these things. When incidents happen - as they will - people need to have their awareness raised. However, people on both sides (or all 3 or 4 or many) need to be prepared to listen to other points of view, not simply attack and ridicule them because they happen to know the parties involved or because they disagree.

    The original item was badly judged. Stan and the band should have been publicly reprimanded, but in view of his (and their) previous exemplary record, he should not have had to fall on his sword. For a first offence that was far too severe. Proportionality needs to be observed and I don't think it has been.

    Let's learn from this and put it to bed now. It has run its course.
     
  9. Sonorous

    Sonorous New Member

    And that pretty much somes it up nicely. I'm pretty much 100% in agreement with you on this.

    Nice chatting with you Mike
     
  10. PeterBale

    PeterBale Moderator Staff Member

    We would agree with that: this thread is now going round in circles, with nothing to add tothe argument - time to close it and move on.
     
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