Kapitol Promotions To Run European Championchips

Discussion in 'The Rehearsal Room' started by nickjones, Oct 27, 2004.

  1. nickjones

    nickjones Active Member

    Just seen 4 bars rest "newsflash".
    The EBBA have not had the contract to run the European championchips renewed...Kapital promotions to run the European , however the EBBA could run a competition as the EBBA European championchips...
  2. Keppler

    Keppler Moderator Staff Member


    I think it's a pity that this particular "partnership" has been broken. The European Championships (as it was known) certainly has been a flagship event promoting some of the best playing going, and a marvellous festival of banding.

    I hope that this decision won't hurt Besson in the long run, as the festival is a growing event, and not a declining one.

    Will look forward to seeing what comes out of this.
  3. Highnote

    Highnote New Member

    Here we go again - Another contest in turmoil!

    Looks like we are going to have two European contests, one run by EBBA and the other by Kapitol. EBBA have run a superb contest over the years and I can't for the life in me think why Besson have withdrawn and decided to support Kapitol.
    Will this split competing bands into two camps - looks on the cards.

    Perhaps YBS will play in them both and make it 8 wins in 7 years.

    We could even end up like boxing with three or four different titles for the same event.

    All in all, its very sad!!
  4. brasscrest

    brasscrest Active Member

  5. Mikey Boy

    Mikey Boy New Member

    If this change is fixed and final and the EBBA run another Championship, as I understand it wants to, which is the 'official' European Brass band Championships, to which the Country Champions are to be invited?

    Further to that, what criteria will be used to gain an invitation to the 'other' European Brass Band Championships?

    Will bands go to both, neither or will they choose the easier or harder contest?

    What about existing contractual arrangements which must have already been put in place by EBBA to cover contests over the next couple of years? Surely they have commitments 'out there' already.

    Are Boosey putting too many eggs in one Kapitol basket?

    It all seems a bit sudden to me. Hope that it has all be thought through before making the tough decisions.

    As another reply stated 'very sad' for EBBA and the Championships. They do not appear to have done anything wrong, but what do I know!

  6. Jan H

    Jan H Moderator Staff Member

    According to the EBBA's press release, next year's contest in Groningen and the contest of the year after in Belfast will go ahead as planned, under the name "EBBA European Brass band Contest"
  7. DublinBass

    DublinBass Supporting Member

    This all on the tail end of the Master's change trying to be more international. Now there are three contests vying to be the best European competitions. :roll:
  8. PeterBale

    PeterBale Moderator Staff Member

    I wonder whether Besson may have shot themselves in the foot on this one. It's hard to comment properly until the forthcoming press release from Besson comes through, but it strikes me that the bands on the continent have a very strong allegiance to the EBBA, which is a properly democratic organisation, as has been mentioned in recent discussions elsewhere. Unless Besson and Kapitol are going to come up with very enticing prize money and/or perks for competing bands, I would have thought they are more likely to want to support the EBBA version, rather than one that is seen as a usurper.
  9. Keppler

    Keppler Moderator Staff Member

    a great point Pat. As always, it's the old mirrored pyramid effect.

    Attached Files:

  10. Jan H

    Jan H Moderator Staff Member

    And don't forget about the "World Championships" next year in Kerkrade...
    (which are also organised by the EBBA, together with the WMC...)
  11. DublinBass

    DublinBass Supporting Member

    With all of these competitions it might be nice if they worked together. For, instance it appears only National Champions get invited to the Europeans. What if the Masters had all the English bands it normally has and then all the runner ups from various European countries the winner of which got a 'wild card' to the Europeans? (I think that the Open winner should get a free pass to the Europeans too!!)

    If that sounds like to many bands at the Europeans than just trim it down to the top 6 (from day 1) to compete at day 2.
  12. TheMusicMan

    TheMusicMan tMP Founder Staff Member

    ... as I mentioned recently in another thread... most if not all of the organisations involved in our movement; including bands, contest promotion companies and organisers, band associations, ABBA et al are far too insular to be beneficial to the movement as a whole. I am sure that Kapitol will do a great job (as will all those organisations referred to) and it is totally understandable that these organisations need to look out for and protect their own interests, but until everyone - and to coin a phrase - sings from the same hymn sheet, banding and our movement will always be the same.

    If you always do what you did, you will always get what you got.

    Here in the UK we need a single, central, organising body set up and firmly in control. We need control processes agreed by all representatives (not just the top 5%), we need standards and procedures correctly in place, together with pragmatic monitoring and feedback - thus providing the essential QA to hold it all together and provide a method of continuous improvement....

    ... don't we....? :)
    Last edited: Oct 28, 2004
  13. Revel8ion

    Revel8ion New Member

    from the European Brass Band Association

    ”Besson Musical Instruments have informed the European Brass Band Association (EBBA) that they have decided to terminate and not renew its contract with EBBA for the organisation of the European Brass Band Championships in the future.”

    “Terminate” OR “not renew”, surely there is a big difference here. Have EBBA waited until now to negotiate a new main sponsorship contract for next year? With what certainty can they award the competition to the host countries 5 and 6 years in advance? If this is the case, then I am afraid they have only themselves to blame.
  14. carlwoodman

    carlwoodman Member

    What a shock this was!
    There are so many questions that many people would like answers to straight away but I guess we'll all have to wait.

    Here's a pratical one to consider;
    If EBBA are going to run their 2005 event in Holland, have Besson/Kapitol already secured a date and a venue for their event I wonder? I would have thought that the prime dates in the calendar for 2005 are already filled along with all the likely venues being booked up. Still maybe there are some suitable venues in Latvia, Estonia and so on!
  15. Jan H

    Jan H Moderator Staff Member

    If I read the press release well, it isn't the EBBA that needs a sponsor, but a sponsor (Besson) that needs an organiser. The competitions of 2005 and 2006, organised by the EBBA, are still going to go ahead they say. And for the period after 2006, no hosts had been apointed yet. So the answer to you last question is "they can't because they don't"
    I guess this is just another case of "Besson is a private company and private companies can do what they want, without having to consult the possible participants", although it is not clear to me now what the actual arrangements were between the EBBA and Besson.
    I think the EBBA has done a great job in the past years, and I hope that the bands will continue to support their event in the comming years. I don't know what the British bands will do, but I think that mast continental bands will just follow the British ones, because for them it's the only event were they can truelly compete with the best UK bands.
  16. DublinBass

    DublinBass Supporting Member

    I wish there were more ways for the middle guys to compete internationally.

    It was exciting at Folkestone having some Belgian Bands competing. It is often said the best brass bands are in England, but the more time I spend over here and the more I here bands from other countries I am finding that not ALL the best bands are in England.

    I think it is nice to have international competitions as benchmark for all bands. BTW I do plan to go to Kerkrade for the "world championships"
  17. bigybsfan

    bigybsfan New Member

    I know that there have been discussions between EBBA and Besson for nearly 2 years in order to renew the Sponsorship Contract. Besson continuely declined to renew the contract, although EBBA was ready to compromise.

    The Problem is not that Besson don't want to sponsor anymore, the problem is that they don't want to sell the title EBBC... EBBA could easily find another sponsor, and they also have sponsorship contracts with other organisations.

    I can tell you that not many Bands from the continent will be able to compete at an European organised by Besson and Kapitol, because the federations are member of the EBBA and will always sponsor the bands for EBBA EBBC. And the bands from the continent need this money from the federations to attend...

    I am sure that besson made a big mistake. And i am sure that bands like YBS or Black Dyke (Doyen Sponsorship of the EBBC...) will or will have to go with EBBA.
  18. legendary_27

    legendary_27 New Member

    I do not believe this to be the case. Besson own the rights to the contest and have decided that they no longer want the EBBA to run the contest for them. As to why, I think that part of the answer is in EBBA's statement. The contest used to run on one day - now it is an eight day 'festival'. How much money now has to be spent to fund something like this ? Aside from anything else, sponsors are now paying for the EBBA members to stay in a country for eight days rather than perhaps one or two - a fairly hefty increase I would reckon. I would love to see a financial breakdown for this year's event compared to say, ten years ago ! In the cold light of day, it comes down to money, as all of these things do.

    As to which contest the bands attend, I suspect that wherever the likes of YBS, Cory and Black Dyke go, so do the rest. The contest cannot be regarded as a legitimate European Championship unless the best bands are there !

    Apologies if this all seems a little cynical.

  19. bigybsfan

    bigybsfan New Member

    You should know that besson has not been the main sponsor for several years now, World of Brass, Doyen, The Bandsman, the Brass Band World, Europes association, they pay a much higher amount for the contest than Besson did in the last years. But as they own the title, it was always called "Besson EBBC".
    And, EBBA still have these sponsors...
  20. Jan H

    Jan H Moderator Staff Member

    OK, but I was talking about the continental top bands, like Willebroek, Eikanger Bjorsvik, Stavanger etc. who want to compete against the likes of Black Dyke, YBS, BAYV, Faireys and Fodens.
    For the "middle guys" there are the contests like the French Open, Swiss Open, Eurobrass and like you told the SCABA contests, which are quite closeby for bands from the Benelux.
    I think we will have to wait for Besson's Statement to get a clearer view of what's going to happen next year. For the moment I don't understand how they want to organise another EBBC next year, with so little time to prepare.

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