Jazz Trombone - Ideas?

Discussion in 'The Rehearsal Room' started by gcbtrom, Aug 27, 2009.

  1. gcbtrom

    gcbtrom Member

    Recently joined a Jaz Orchestra on 3rd Bone and must say I'm loving it, although my Conn88HO isn't exactly designed for jazz. Whilst I can get a decent sound out of it, I;m after something with a bit more edge...

    .525 Bore and with the F Attachment as well. Don't want to spend thousands because I only play it every so often.

    So anyone got any ideas on what to get?
  2. Shires makes a good jazz horn, and Kanstul has one that is pretty bright.
  3. Bones

    Bones Member

    I do a lot of big banding and jazz orchestral work and unless you are doing lead regularly I would suggest something around a .508 size.

    I use either a Schmelzer model 2 or a King 3b, both .508 bore, both cracking instruments. Both I have done 1st, 2nd or 3rd on. With the exception of the 4th part I dont know anyone who uses an f att. And it is worth remebering that George Roberts only ever used a single plug for most if not all his career.

    My advice would be to look for a 2nd hand 3b, there are a loads of them. They also do a 3b with an F att if you still want to.

    If 525 is what you want there is limited choice in the market place. the Bach 36 is still the daddy. The 3b+ is a .525. Yamaha 400 series do a .525. The Rath R3, but as you say there is a price tag involved.

    However, Rath in association with John Packer's have bought out a Rath designing and Quality controlled student model which is a .525. Made in china, but isnt loads of stuff these days. I intend to get hold of one for a blow I think it will be a good hooter for shows and pit bands. It is getting rave reviews at the moment, so worth it.

    Failing that I have a Benge 170 for sale. PM me if interested.
  4. 08cbinns

    08cbinns Member

    Try a King, great bones and make very good jazzens :)
  5. gcbtrom

    gcbtrom Member

    I've got a King 4B and agree its good for jazz but prefer something a little smaller, I get my workout on Monday Nights so need to have an easier instrument to play! :p

    I don't want to spend anymore than £1000 if I cna help it, like I say, for what I use it for it's hardly worth spending thousands.

    Will have a look at the Kanstuls though as I've always liked to own one... and heard very good things about them but will still look at the others.
  6. I tried a Kanstul, and liked it. It had a great slide, and was well in tune on the partials. I find it to be a little brighter than I like, but in defence of the horn, I was not using my mouthpiece. The jazz chair player of the U.S. Air Force B was the player of this.
  7. Vegasbound

    Vegasbound Active Member

    Richards advice is worth listening too, king 3B or if you want a .525 bach 36 good versatile horns!
  8. Daniel Sheard

    Daniel Sheard Member

    The new Rath/China 0.525 instrument is costing a few hundred rather than thousands. Definitely worth a test drive. Especially if you're playing the 3rd book.
  9. Bones

    Bones Member

    I agree, I think it might set the benchmark as a versatile horn.... the Bach 36 has had this market for far too long....
  10. 08cbinns

    08cbinns Member

    never rated bachs at all :/ bit dull and not got a great sound on them
  11. silver surfer

    silver surfer Member

    If there are any trombone players or perc lost for what to do you are always welcome at grange moor wed 8/10,sunday 7/9 then a couple of pints after.
  12. Kiz7

    Kiz7 Member

    My daughter and I tried one of these recently at the JP store in taunton and to be honest were a tad disappointed in it as it was not really a free blowing instrument at all. It may have just been the one they had for demo but it was only okay really.
  13. Bass Trumpet

    Bass Trumpet Active Member

    I suppose your major issue is the cost vs. how much you will use it. The winning formula, I suppose would be to try and spend as little as possible to get as much trombone as possible!

    Looking a new kit might not be the answer for you. A quick look at our old friend ebay may be worth it. Although I don't do any now, I played with the GSMD big band when they won the Radio 2 big band competition - I bought an ancient King 2B for £300 and used it all the time for big band playing. While I would perhaps recommend the 3B over the 2B, Kings are generally great hooters for this sort of work and (unlike Conns of the same period) their quality control in the 1970s/80s was much better.

    My recommendation - King 3B. The .525" bore 3B+ may be a little too much like the large bore you already play, so the standard 3B would be my choice. I would say that, though. I've got one!
  14. Daniel Sheard

    Daniel Sheard Member

    Interesting - so perhaps the product isn't up to the hype. I only said it was worth a test drive! You would have thought that they would make sure the demo model was a good one. Incidentally, what bore size is your daughter used to?
  15. Kiz7

    Kiz7 Member

    Hey Daniel!

    I agree that its worth a test drive - I wasn't criticising your suggestion, just sharing our brief experience of it. I would suggest that if its possible to get hold of one then its worth trying, it just didn't really live up to the hype for us but that's not to say it isn't a good instrument for the price its being sold at. The demo model may have been a good one, but the finish wasn't brilliant tbh.

    My daughter is used to a large bore (she plays a Conn 88h or Yamaha Bousfield 681Bb/F) but she was specifically looking for something for Jazz so tried a Jiggs Wigham Yammy, the Rath/JP and a normal JP. She wanted to try the King2B that they had for sale as a second hand instrument but we waited for 20 minutes but no-one came to serve us so we ran out of time. We still haven't bought anything yet so are a bit undecided.
  16. Daniel Sheard

    Daniel Sheard Member

    Not at all - it is very interesting to get feedback on them. I was wondering if the perceived stuffiness could have been the bore size.
  17. gcbtrom

    gcbtrom Member

    Having had a look at various websites and reading opinions on here I must admit I'd be half tempted with a Kanstul 760 Series trombone. Looks very well built and sounds like a very good instrument.
  18. I would still advise you to try several different ones before deciding.
  19. Daniel Sheard

    Daniel Sheard Member

    Probably a bit too small for 3rd book, but if I had a jazz/dance band seat I'd consider getting something funky like a 44H.
  20. sherb

    sherb New Member

    Reply to Kiz7 & Jazz trombone

    'Dear Kiz7, I would like to say two things in response to your posting. Firstly, I am sorry that the level of service in the shop was not at our customary level. Due to the confluence of holidays and illness we have been short staffed on a number of occasions during the summer and were down to only one member of sales staff more than once. Regarding the trombone itself, it is likely that the one that was tried would have been the final prototype as we have only just received free stock of these instruments. All the instruments from previous deliveries were pre-sold and the build quality of all the full production models has been very good. As for performance I have to say that, proud as we are of this instrument, we make no claims that it is a panacea for all players. No instrument finds favour with everyone and I am obviously disappointed that it wasn't to your personal taste. What we do claim is that if the likes of Erling Kroner, Mark Nightingale and Carol Jarvis think it is very good then it must surely merit some exploration. I would also like to be clear that we are talking about a trombone with a price of £299 ex vat in the UK, so it is impressive that it is being compared in any way with professional models by professional players.'
    Steve Herbert John Packers Taunton

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