Hostage Norman Kember Freed in Iraq!

Discussion in 'Off-Topic Chat' started by Rapier, Mar 23, 2006.

  1. Rapier

    Rapier Supporting Member

    Well done to the troops that freed Mr. Kember and the Canadian Hostages, unharmed! Now perhaps the Authorities will ban him from entering the country again. What good one person thinks they can do, without proper charity support is beyond me. Fortunately none of the troops involved was injured. If they had been, they should have sued him for putting them at unnecessary risk!
  2. Lauradoll

    Lauradoll Active Member

    That's excellent news!
  3. TheMusicMan

    TheMusicMan tMP Founder Staff Member

  4. BigHorn

    BigHorn Active Member

    Hope they send him the bill for the operation.
    No doubt he will be spouting off about how the troops shouldn't be in Iraq in the forthcoming media frenzy.
    He should be given a swift kick up the backsize and reminded who took him hostage and who saved his life. It is him who should not have been there.

    He should be shipped back to Blighty and have his passport confiscated. There is no room for such trouble makers in Iraq. He has stupidly risked the lives of all those soldiers who had to rescue him.
  5. Nanny Ogg

    Nanny Ogg Member

    Excellent news indeed - and no he shouldn't be sent the bill, what a stupid thing to say. This man is a man of peace, not a money grabbing mercenary. The group he belonged to went with the best intentions, ok maybe mis-guided and badly informed but the very best intentions. The world needs more people like these who want jaw jaw not war war.
  6. bigmamabadger

    bigmamabadger Active Member

    What she said.:clap: :clap:
  7. Bigenglandfan

    Bigenglandfan Member

    I'm sorry Badger and Ogg... but I've just been talking to an SAS friend who told me how many hundreds (if not thousands) of man hours they have spent on the Kember case. They surely have more important work to perform. And don't believe any of the propaganda rubbish about a "multinational force".... it was a classic SAS mission. How could it have been anything else... it succeeded!!!!!
  8. Rapier

    Rapier Supporting Member

    While he may well have the best of motives, why should people be put at risk because of his naivety? The country is a war zone not a dodgy London council estate! The Christian Peacekeeping Team, that he belongs to, obviously need more guns and tanks and possibly a little Air Support! ;)
  9. BigHorn

    BigHorn Active Member

    I stand by my 'Stupid' comments. A misguided 70 year old as been naively strutting around Bhagdad in a smug and self righteous manner thinking he can put the world to rights.
    Then innocent young soldiers (probably some of them still in their teens) have to risk life and limb to rescue him.
    Silly old fool :mad:
  10. SteveT

    SteveT Member

    The British Army is well used to cleaning up after people. My first taste of it was in Northern Ireland. Another pat on the back for the members of 22 Squadron!
  11. horn-girlie

    horn-girlie Member

    Have to, say i agree with BigHorn. was very pleased to hear that he's escaped unharmed, but does one untrained (i think) man think he can change a countrys troubles? i know he had very good intentions, but i think it would have benefited the country more if he had, say donated money to groups trained for the job. This way, however many soldiers would have not had to put their lives at risk for his sake, when they could have been elsewhere. Just my opinion!
  12. bigmamabadger

    bigmamabadger Active Member

    Who joined up thinking it was all going to be a bit of a lark, then suddenly found out that a soldiers life is terrible hard and war is untidy, messy, vicious and actually no fun at all, but you've signed up for 4 years and you just have to get on with it. Silly young fools. We no longer have conscription or even compulsory military training.

    DISCLAIMER: I have only the greatest respect for the British Army, having known a few members of it in my time. I'm very glad they're there, doing a job that I'm not prepared to do, but when you're in you're in and you do what has to be done. As has been stated above, the British Army are the best in the world at tidying up other people's mess, I would venture to say they are the best in the world full stop.
  13. James Yelland

    James Yelland Active Member

    Two thoughts:

    1. I could take Mr Kember more seriously as a man of peace if he had been in Iraq BEFORE the 'invasion', protesting against Saddam's violence against his own people.

    2. If Mr Kember felt uncomfortable about being rescued by the forces of aggression, he could have asked to have been left where he was when the SAS dropped in. But he didn't....
  14. Nanny Ogg

    Nanny Ogg Member

    Kember and his 2 Canadian colleagues are Commonwealth citizens and deserve to be rescued and protected by the troops. Why can't people be happy that these peaceful, well meaning men are safe, and the British forces and Canadian forces did it without spilling a drop of blood. Everyone is all to be commended. It's a shame that the same couldn't be done for their American colleague and for others such as charity worker Margaret Hassan. I did not believe and back the reasons why Ken Bigley was out there but I really do wish they'd been able to rescue him too. Be thankful of a job well done by the troops and 3 human beings safe. Take time to reflect on all the people who won't be coming home, over 100 British troops, over 2000 American troops, 2 British Subject Hostages, I don't know how many other hostages and the countless innocent Iraqis who are now in the middle of a civil war. Now tell me about the cost.
    Last edited: Mar 24, 2006
  15. DaveR

    DaveR Active Member

    Whatever their reasons for signing up, that is no reason for their lives to be put unnecessarily at risk. Yes, they are required to put their lives on the line when they join the Armed Forces - that is the gamble they take. Like all gambles, some you win, some you lose. That is their choice whether or not to take that risk - nobody forced them into it.

    However, the actions of one man (no matter how well intentioned he was) should not be any reason for putting the lives of soldiers at risk. That - to go back to the gambling analogy - is like playing with loaded dice, your chances of winning the gamble are reduced.

    As I understand it, this man went to the most dangerous place in the world - so dangerous that even native Iraqis are leaving in droves - and just wandered round talking to people without getting any advice (or maybe choosing to ignore it) from people who understand the situation out there, and with no protection for his own safety or even with the backing of an official organisation. That was his gamble, his choice. But when he lost, other people had to take a gamble with loaded dice to get him out of the mess he voluntarily got himself into.

    I'm glad Mr Kember is safe and that no further blood was shed. However, the man is a menace not only to himself but to the people who get sent in to clear up his mess after him. Our army may be the best in the world and fully used to clearing up after people, but there is enough mess already in Iraq without amateurs adding to it further.
  16. rutty

    rutty Active Member

    I doubt that Mr Kember et al were supporting Saddam but I take your point. He put himself in danger and then had to be rescued, at Tax Payers' expense and at the risk of injury to our troops. I'm glad that he's been rescued but dismayed that he put himself in that position in the first place.
  17. Andy Cooper

    Andy Cooper Member

    And unfortunately theres more of them out there. I was listening to some woman parroting on the Today programme this morning how safe it was for foreigners to wander about Baghdad at night before the "war" and you cant do that now. Bit like wandering round Berlin in the late 1930s I suppose. (so long as you were not Jewish!) I dont think there were many complaints when that particular regime was brought down by force.

    From now on the Foreign Office should warn all Brit nationals that they go out there at there own risk and that the British Government relinquishes its obligation to pull them out of the sh*t when it hits the fan.
  18. Anno Draconis

    Anno Draconis Well-Known Member

    From listening to other members of the "Christian Peace Group" on the radio yesterday I have to say that there seems to be a lot of self-righteous, self-important arrogance behind Kember's (and others) decision to go to Iraq. It appears to me that he felt that his faith gave him a "divine" right to poke his nose in where it was unwelcome simply in order to salve his christian conscience. It was also noticeable that Kember's pacifist colleagues refused to thank or commend the rescuers in any way on Radio 5 last night because they don't approve of the occupation or the job the army are doing. Would they prefer Kember was still a captive?

    A much more sensible (and arguably more "christian") approach would be to offer help and support to muslim groups who are welcome in Iraq and able to make a difference. But I suppose there's no glory in that, is there?
  19. Sharpy

    Sharpy Member

    Excellent news that Mr Kember is safe and once again the UK Armed Forces have done exceptional job.

    Being in the Forces, albeit as a Royal Marine Musician, you do sign on the dotted line and to a certain degree accept what gets thrown at you. My guess is that the guys who rescued Mr Kember are trained to do that very job in times of War and Peace and as such were probably chomping at the bit to get in there and get the job done. Thats what they train for, day in, day out and for some units its their raison d'etre(excuse the spelling!).

    So before everyone starts getting too angry with Mr Kembers apparent naivety and the huge amount of man hours and money that was probably used in his rescue, just remember that the Guys who rescued him were doing the job that 99% of the time they live for. And in a way that only people in the Forces can sometimes understand, may have even enjoyed it and got a "buzz" out of it.
    Last edited: Mar 24, 2006
  20. PeterBale

    PeterBale Moderator Staff Member

    Good points there about soldiering and what it means to the individual. Whatever our views about the rights and wrongs of going into Iraq, people do sign up for a life of action and excitement. When we visited our batallion based in Berlin in the 1970's they were having terrible problems because the troops were bored and fed up. Despite the tension surrounding that situation they spent most of their time just hanging around, and drug and drink problems were rife.

Share This Page