The "Compensating" thread got me thinking... I accept the need for the compensating system for Bb Basses who sometimes (rarely) need to move about in the 4th valve register. However, given the fact that the compensating system only really comes into effect at TClef low F (below the staff), when was the last time MOST bands had a need for this on Eb Bass and (particularly) Euph. D & C# at the bottom of the staff are just fine with the slides set right. When was the last time you played an F or below in band?? It's true that occasional modern pieces might use notes down there and if one is a soloist, these low notes are part of your normal range (but quite playable in-tune if the instrument had triggers). However I would suggest the vast majority of bands would be served just fine with 4 valve non-comp euphs and Eb basses. Any thoughts?