Ebay Fraud

Discussion in 'The Rehearsal Room' started by Chris B, Feb 11, 2005.

  1. Chris B

    Chris B New Member

    With the spate of stolen instruments at the moment, it's also worth flagging up the number of Ebay frauds that are happening too. Although I only watch Ebay for the trombone auctions, I'd be suprised if it there weren't other frauds involving "sales" of other instruments.

    This one was posted today:


    The description is identical to the one that was used on the genuine auction which ended a few days ago. The seller who's posted the new listing today sent a prospective bidder photos of the trombone, which he'd lifted from the genuine auction. I've done some research since this auction went up today, and it seems as though this is definitely fraud.

    If there are any TMP's who look at Ebay with a view to buying instruments, please be careful, particularly as there seems to have been a sharp increase in Ebay instrument frauds over the last couple of weeks. People are getting stung and are losing money.

    Best regards,

    Chris Beaumont

    Sales Manager
    Michael Rath Trombones
  2. TheMusicMan

    TheMusicMan tMP Founder Staff Member

    Many thanks for posting this information Chris... and welcome to tMP sir... :)
  3. ScrapingtheBottom

    ScrapingtheBottom Active Member

    Yeah I spotted a few dodgy instruments on there when I bought my gig bag. They are easy to spot if you take your time and look.
  4. Bryan_sop

    Bryan_sop Active Member

    On one of the other forums I visit, on several occasions, fake auctions were found and then bid on. I think one of them went up to £5,500,000 before ebay removed it! Just happened to be mentioned by the guy that actually made the trumpet (harrelson modified trumpets) and he sold it a few days before on ebay.
  5. fartycat

    fartycat Member

    There has also been a spate on the drum listings as well. If you're looking to buy a top end kit, watch out and check those feedback ratings.
  6. kiwiposaune

    kiwiposaune New Member

    If it seems too good to be true (i.e. Bach Strad bass trumpets and Shires trombones with low starting bids and no reserves) then it probably is. Don't deal with any who has no feedback and don't deal with sellers whose feedback isn't at least in the high 90s. Don't deal with sellers who only accept Western Union as payment - that indicates a high probability of fraud. I've only broken my own rules once and - guess what - I got ripped off. However, don't tar every ebay seller with the same brush because most of them are straight up legit and you can get some stunning deals. I bought a 1964 Mt. Vernon Bach 6 for about $US600 and it's the best small horn I've ever played. Recently I got an 8" Edwards bell flare, set up for a large bore horn, for about $150 and it's turned out to be a real little rocket launcher. My friend Mark Ridenour (acting principal trumpet - Chicago Symphony) has bought at least two of his horns on ebay. Just be careful.
  7. Bones

    Bones Member


    Whilst not wishing to impugn the reputation of the prospective sellers on UK Ebay at the moment, there is a couple of trombone listed, a 2b Silver Sonic and an Edwards T350. Both of which I have seen very recently on Ebay US. Exactly the same descriptions as well, different sellers.

    What a strange coincidence................

    Thankfully the prices offered for these particular instruments indicate that they have been rumbled.

    Caveat Emptor and all that......
  8. I've noticed this too I'm afraid.

    Since losing my precious Holton Bass Trom 3 years ago (my own fault admitedly, I left it outside my front door after coming home after a job very very drunk - not insured at the time either ack! :frown: ) I've often scoured eBay and similar sites for a replacement. I've sometimes come across some very dubious adverts going up on there, some with no pics and very little info (no serial numbers etc) and others going up with identical descriptions to other ads as mentioned above. I know a few people who have been stung. Definitely a case of "Buyer Beware"
  9. brassneck

    brassneck Active Member

    ... try contacting the seller to see if he/she is selling a recently bought instrument on eBay! You never know, it might be a case of finding a bargain, then trying to make a fast profit on it! Always try to source as much information about the instrument as possible to minimise risk of fraud.
  10. Steve

    Steve Active Member

    As awful as it sounds, I have found recently that most of the frauds are from abroad. Italy, Sweeden etc

    I dont think these frauds should stop people buying from ebay as there are still some bargains to be had. I got a lovely round stamp sovereign cornet for £400 the other day, the seller had zero feedback etc but was quick to answer my questions and was very polite. A good idea is to ask for a photo of the instrument next to an item of your choice, this proves they actually have the item!!!!!
  11. alanl58

    alanl58 Member

    Hey, a better way to both sell and buy is via the TmPers own "classified ads" web pages. Only dedicated brass banders here, and no rip-offs. But the price offered is the price to haggle over.

    A friend recently bought a valved trombone on e-Bay for just £4, but the transportation charge from India was £70, so not a great deal IMHO.

    Bude, Cornwall

    PS I don't get any benefit for promoting our own forum pages!
  12. Lil Miss

    Lil Miss Active Member

    I agree with everthing that has been said. As everyone knows (or should) by now, I got ripped off on a piccolo trumpet, and I've contacted a group of people who have bought the same instrument and were ripped off too. I would really like to find a way to get this seller banned off ebay....he keeps blaming the postal service for the instrument being REALLY DODGY!!!! :mad: Any suggestions???? :frown:
  13. GJPC

    GJPC New Member

    It's not just buyers beware. There is a common scam where the seller of an item receives payment by cheque which initially appears to clear. The cheque is for significantly more than the selling price and the seller is asked to "refund" the difference. The excess can be attributed to several things, but quite often it could be described as some form of agent's commission.

    Anyway, cut a long story short, the cheques are either stolen or counterfeit and (despite initially clearing) eventually bounce - but only after the refund you've paid has cleared.

    My advice is that if you receive a cheque for too much (usually a few thousand over the top), don't send the goods, don't make the refund, do take the cheque to the police.
  14. nickwalker

    nickwalker New Member

    BTW this isnt always true, im on another forum for a different hobby, and that has been attacked by fraudsters aswell. Just ask loads of questions and check the serial numbers etc!!
  15. brassneck

    brassneck Active Member

    I've been tracking what seems to be a 'too good to be true' bargain on eBay for a Yamaha YBB-621 BBb tuba which was originally listed starting as £300. No details as how to pay the seller and no feedback for him either. This tuba was recently relisted for £750 and again, with no details. Also, the auction was listed as a private sale, with the ID of potential buyers kept private. I decided to e-mail the seller for more information and was offered a private deal with the horn being shipped from Spain. No serial was given and the seller wanted me to do an International transfer to his account. Fair doos, I would have all his banking details (if I wanted to treat this as fraud) .... but why would he want to sell an almost immaculate instrument for less than a fifth of it's retail price? Even second-hand through tuba sales sites, the asking price is usually about three times what he wanted. He withdrew the tuba again today. Sigh! Too good to be true.

    ... here's a pic and description of the silver plated model ...


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