Deep Harmony Hymn Tune Wanted

Discussion in 'Classifieds' started by screamlead, Aug 22, 2007.

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  1. screamlead

    screamlead Member

    Hi All,

    Can anyone help me??

    I am trying to get hold of either a conductors score or a copy of a set of band parts for the hymn tune Deep Harmony by Handel Parker.

    If anyone can help please send a PM and I will get straight back to you.


  2. Active Member

    It's number 16 in The Salvation Army Tune Book.
  3. Gavin

    Gavin Supporting Member

    We have an arrangement by the master arranger Alexander Owen as one of 24 hymns in a book that he arranged or composed for Besses in their/his heyday then go to "Music Catalogue", then "Alexander Owen Collection"

    Gavin Pritchard
    JAGRINS Music Publications
  4. 2euph

    2euph New Member

    I can post you a set of our arrangement if thats any good.
    email with where to send it to.

  5. Gavin

    Gavin Supporting Member

    This hymn tune can be bought from several sources, 2 of which have already been mentioned on this thread. Do you not think it would be fair on the arranger & publishers if it were attained this way??

    If a set were lent out to, or copied by, or given to another band, the arranger/composer (or the arranger's/composer's estate) would loose out. Eventually composers and arrangers will give up as, they will not get any financial reward for their work. This is one of the reasons why there are copyright laws (covered in full on this forum) and publishers!

    Please remember this when trying to help bands out, you are actually contributing to disillusioning composers & arrangers.

    This is not meant as a go at you 2euph over lending one hymn tune, but as I'm sure you and everyone else will admit, this behavior is widespread throughout the movement.

    Gavin Pritchard
  6. 2euph

    2euph New Member

    As far as I am aware there is no copyright on Deep Harmony and the arrangement I am offering to send is my own. I understand your point completely, and the reasons behind it, but 'aint it a pity we can't help one another out, without worrying about financial rewards.

  7. nickjones

    nickjones Active Member

    Cannae go wrong with the denis wright arrangement!

    Denis Wright had done an arrangement , published by Moelnaar and available from your local music stockist or try just music.
    I think there is another by John Golland too , but on memory I think the denis wright one ticked all the boxes on arrangement quality , apart from the mad 70's style printing , but thats just personal preference , good to have something clear to read off ie studio or jagrins
  8. Gavin

    Gavin Supporting Member

    You are correct. As of 1998 this hymn tune has no copyright with regards to the composer himself. If this is your arrangement, then you are free to do whatever you want with it.

    In this situation, I agree - it would be a pity not to help out, but if we were talking about pieces in copyright, then I disagree. The concern should be for the composer/arranger in question in relation to the copyright laws protecting them and their work, not the band!

    Like I said in my last message "This is not meant as a go at you 2euph over lending one hymn tune". This just got me going on a subject that has been bothering me for a very long time.

    Gavin Pritchard
  9. screamlead

    screamlead Member


    Didn't realise that this thread would provoke such a reaction.

    Just to clarify the request.........

    I asked for help in obtaining either a set of prts or the score, in no way did I ask for a set of photocopies etc etc and any inference to such a request is purely the opinion of Mr. Pritchard.

    Besides, show me any library of any musical group in the land and i defy it to be free of any photocopies, whilst I am not condoning such breach of copyright etc i cannot agree with the remark that it disillusions composer / arrangers. Surely if this is the case then composers / arrangers would have given up long ago.


  10. Gavin

    Gavin Supporting Member

    Sorry if you misunderstood my comments. I never said you requested a set of photocopies. As such, the comment "any inference to such a request is purely the opinion of Mr. Pritchard" is untrue.

    Your comment on "any library of any musical group" is exactly what I'm talking about. This is exactly my point, and it needs to be stopped.

    Several composers/arrangers have told me it does disillusion them. It is soul destroying to see your work being passed around and photocopied by bands (this is the opinion of several composers/arrangers I know of). They have spent a lot of time and effort in writing/arranging this music and it is not fair (never mind illegal) to pass their work around for free.

    I can only speak on behalf of the composers/arrangers on our books. Perhaps other composers/arrangers on here would like to give their opinions on this?

    Gavin Pritchard
  11. screamlead

    screamlead Member

    I can understand that you feel so strongly about this subject.

    Maybe Gavin you should apply the same comments to threads that actually mention photcopiers and warming them up etc instead of blatantly touting your website !!


  12. Gavin

    Gavin Supporting Member

    People need to understand how wrong (and illegal) it is, not how I feel about it!

    I'm not "blatantly touting my website", I'm trying to make people aware of our products and where they can buy them from, in the hope that they don't then go and photocopy stuff from other places.

    As you have seen the comments in the other thread, we can all assume that the person you are pointing the finger at has seen this one. It would take me a long time to address everyone individually that has said, has thought about, has photocopied music.

    Gavin Pritchard
  13. screamlead

    screamlead Member

    Well Gavin, at least we can rest assured that any band that you are connected with has NO photocopies of any music whatsoever in it's library !!!!
  14. Gavin

    Gavin Supporting Member

    Well, it looks like all you want to do is get into an argument. Therefore I will end this now.

    1) I do not photocopy music for any band that I have been/are/will be involved with

    2) I do not approve of ANYONE photocopying music for it to be passed on to others (it is illegal)

    3) If I am aware of/made aware of photocopied music in any band that I am involved with's library, I have/will request that they destroy the set

    These are points that no one can despute, disagree with, or have any reason to act in a way that contradicts them

    If you have anything constructive to say on this matter, I will respond accordingly, otherwise this is my last word on this to you

    Gavin Pritchard
  15. screamlead

    screamlead Member

    You misunderstand. I do not want to argue with you. YOU are the one that replied in war and peace manner to the original thread.

    Whilst you should be applauded for the points you state above I find it hard to believe that you request that any photocopies belonging to bands that you are involved in are destroyed. If indeed this is the case, you must be very popular with your 'ex' bands !!

    I sense that I have hit a nerve here, maybe if you feel so strongly re this subject you should write an article for the banding public and make use of the other widely available brass band websites and publications.

    Other than that, maybe we could mimick the theme portrayed in the sci-fi film fahrenheit 451 and visit bandrooms up and down the land on a fire engine and burn all the photocopied music......oh what fun you would have......not. But at least you will sleep safe at night. Apparently, the film was named Fahrenheit 451 as this is the precise temperature at which paper burns!! Having said that you may want to reduce your carbon footprint by shredding the photocopies.

    Finally on a more serious note we do not live in an ideal world and photocopied music is a reality, especially in bands / organisations that are strapped for cash. I am in no way condoning the photocopying of music but we have to live with it. That is my final note on this 'obviously' touchy subject.

    P.S. Now off to copy my entire mp3 collection ( 100GB worth ) for my friend - suppose you have an axe to grind on that one too Gavin !!!
  16. 2euph

    2euph New Member

    Oh dear, Oh dear. My trying to be helpful to a fellow bandsman seems to have hit a sore spot. Yes copying music is wrong and is a problem, but we all know it happens. As I have told Gavin, I too have had problems with some arrangements I did, and it wasn't just having them copied.
    I think we shall call a truce.
    By the way............ Deep Harmony is in the post !!!

  17. It would really **** me off if, without permission, someone had photocopied something I'd written - it's stealing, plain and simple.

    It does dissolusion composers, but I guess to a larger extent it dissolusions the publishers that release the composers work. Photocopied parts mean 1 sale less for the company, making it more difficult to make money, pay employees etc. This will cause publishers to cease trading.

    Without publishers, there is a massive problem as to how to distribute new music, and without new music, the movement will die....etc. etc.

    Anyone who thinks differently are unintelligent.

    Just because bands have done it all these years, and just because bands libraries are full of photocopies, it doesn't make it right. What it does is mean that publishers have to charge more for the music they do sell, to make up for the costs they lose when someone steals (Sorry "photocopies") their music.

    So Screamlead, bands strapped for cash don't have a leg to stand on (They are at the root of the problem), and neither do bands with ££££s in the bank. And whilst I'm on the subject of Screamlead's comments - "I am in no way condoning the photocopying of music but we have to live with it."

    We don't have to live with it. What a silly statement.
  18. screamlead

    screamlead Member

    Before calling anyone unintelligent OR silly it may be worth reading the actual thread instead of all the wannabe 'composers' jumping on the band wagon with kick one and we all limp syndrome.

    When I stated that we have to live with photocopied music I was inferring that there is very little that we can do about the situation. Therefore I take offence at Meechans claim that this is a silly statement. Whilst we are destroying photocopied music we might as well disband all of the small, cash strapped bands that rightly OR wrongly possess photocopied music. That would solve the problem in one fell swoop but would do little for the brass band movement as a whole especially as dwindling concert and contest audiences are such a hot topic at the moment.

    Peter, why don't you take a leaf out of Tim Berners-Lee's book ( inventor of the World Wide Web ) and give your music to the banding movement free of charge. Surely this a bold and worthy gesture.

    Maybe now the 21st century is upon us we should loook towards furthering technology to prevent copyright theft but being unintelligent I couldn't possibly comment on that.

    FYI I have a 1st Class honours degree in music from the RNCM and now work writing complex computer programs.........Hardly unintelligent !!!!!!
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2007
  19. tpcornet12

    tpcornet12 Member

    This is crazy, the original thread said "I am trying to get hold of either a conductors score or a copy of a set of band parts for the hymn tune Deep Harmony by Handel Parker."
    There was no mention of photocopying anything or breaching any copyright - maybe he wanted to buy the copy, because surely every set of music you buy is a copy - just a legal one! I do think there was some reaction here that was probably unwarranted!
  20. screamlead

    screamlead Member

    At last, common sense prevails !!!

    Or maybe he JUST READ THE ORIGINAL THREAD !!!!!!!!!!
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