CWS Manchester

Discussion in 'The Rehearsal Room' started by hobgoblin, Aug 5, 2013.

  1. hobgoblin

    hobgoblin Member

    I spent a good bit of time listening old youtube recordings of the sadly long defunct CWS Manchester band. I was pretty knocked out by the standard of most of the stuff, and thought this great band of yesteryear may be worthy of a thread on here.Hopefully not only a place for others to share their admiration, but hopefully we may have one or two tmp-ers who actually played with this marvelous band and may care to share a few memories stories and anecdotes from the past.
  2. hopeless

    hopeless New Member

    They were indeed a fabulous Band, sadly many of the players are performing alongside Gabriel these days. There are some who are still around, Derek Garside, Lyndon Baglin, Gordon Higginbottom ,Alan Grundy, and a few others, but they don't seem to be the types to go on about it. Pity really . The only time I can get them to talk is on a one to one basis, when they are safe from being thought Braggers. I have some great memories f hearing them on the CWS exhibitions, and also on Plymouth Hoe when they were there for a week at a time....a terrific way to spend holidays, hearing them twice a day for a week and not a single piece repeated. I wasn't on my own, as there were other supporters who did that, a certain Marjorie Fielding ( Uppermill )used to take all her holidays listening to her beloved Co-op. Personally, I am so pleased to hear they haven't been forgotten, maybe one of them will come on TMP and relive memories ...hopefully.
  3. toby hobson

    toby hobson Member

    Wow, that must of been some pad they took! Thats the best part of 250 pieces!!! Maybe they had it all from memory if they were as good as people say.
  4. iancwilx

    iancwilx Well-Known Member

    They were a fantastic band. I and my young banding pals went to many concerts in the 1960s and I had a couple of the Fontana LPS that I played over and over again. One of my mates, Tony Ryan played first Bari for them during Morts last years with the band.
    Uppermill Lil and of course Saddleworth Sal ~ Memorable ladies. They occasionally hitched lifts to different venues on our (Imps) band bus on Whit Fridays. Banding stalwarts !

    ~ Mr Wilx
  5. hopeless

    hopeless New Member

    Actually the band had a CWS Red Van converted into a mobile library , and a full time Librarian by the name of Arthur Pugh . Mortimer would give him an afternoon programme list , and Arthur would put the parts into the players folders ready. The same procedure for the evening programme .
  6. hopeless

    hopeless New Member

    [ One of my mates, Tony Ryan played first Bari for them during Morts last years with the band.
    Uppermill Lil and of course Saddleworth Sal ~ Memorable ladies. They occasionally hitched lifts to different venues on our (Imps) band bus on Whit Fridays. Banding stalwarts !

    I seem to remember Tony Ryan, Very fair ( blonde) hair, about the same period as Ian Richards was on Top Trombone. Not sure if Tony replaced Cyril Howarth on Solo Bari , who went to Faireys. Could be wrong there though.
  7. iancwilx

    iancwilx Well-Known Member

    Yes, he was there with Ian Richards. We were all in the NYBB together and Tony and I both started playing as lads with Leeds Model Band in the very early 1960s. I went to Imps and he went to CWS. Leeds Model Band were a very good band in those days, but, as often happens, they lost a lot of the good players to top bands, mainly Imps.

    ~ Mr Wilx
  8. mattthebass

    mattthebass Member

    Was it two or three years ago that Fodens finally matched CWS' wins at the North West Area? some 25 years after they folded. I think that givens some indication of CWS' class.
  9. MoominDave

    MoominDave Well-Known Member

    CWS Manchester won 13 NW area contests, first win 1955, last win 1976. In that mid-50s to mid-70s period they won at that contest 59% of the time. They also won the 1952 contest on Resurgam by 5 clear points, but were disqualified.
    Fodens have won 18 NW area contest, first win 1949, latest win 2011. It's notable that after 1956 they didn't win a title until 1983, i.e. that CWS Manchester's ascendancy came at a relatively lean time for Fodens. They matched CWS Manchester's 13 wins in 2006, in the first year of a six-year winning streak. However, Faireys had already previously surpassed this record, winning their 13th title in 1997 and their 14th in 2001.

    Progressive record-holders for NW top section area titles:
    1945 Wingates; 1
    1946 Wingates, Barrow Shipyard; 1
    1947 Wingates, Barrow Shipyard, Fairey; 1
    1948 Wingates; 2
    1950 Wingates, Fodens; 2
    1951 Wingates, Fodens, Fairey; 2
    1952 Fairey; 3
    1953 Fairey, Fodens; 3
    1954 Fairey; 4
    1956 Fairey, Fodens; 4
    1959 Fairey; 5
    1961 Fairey, CWS; 5
    1962 CWS; 6
    1963 CWS, Fairey; 6
    1966-9, 73, 75, 76 CWS; 7-13
    1997 CWS, Fairey; 13
    2001 Fairey; 14
    2007 Fairey, Fodens; 14
    2008-2011 Fodens; 15-18

    Current standings:
    1 Fodens 18
    2 Fairey 14
    3 CWS 13
    4 Leyland 12
    5 Wingates 6
    6= Cammell Laird 3
    6= Besses 3
    8= Barrow Shipyard 1
    8= Kennedy's Swinton 1

    Striking that just four bands account for 83% of all NW area top section victories. I wonder if other regions are the same?

    Something I hadn't noticed before - CWS Manchester's contesting trajectory was strikingly similar to that of Morris Motors, although it peaked at a somewhat higher level. They both apparently appeared on the contesting scene in the mid-1920s [though CWS was in existence from 1900 - maybe we are lacking data?], and rose rapidly through the Crystal Palace sections before achieving maturity after the war, with each dominating their respective regional contests during the same period. Both were fully sponsored works bands, and both declined when the age of full sponsorship passed - CWS won their last regional title in 1976, lost their sponsorship in 1985, and folded in 1993 after an attempt to keep the band in the lower sections had ultimately failed; MM lost their sponsorship in 1972, won their last regional title in 1974, and folded in 1998 after a similar brief lower section odyssey. Both bands last competed in the championship section in 1987 - must have been a sad year for those with an eye on band history.
  10. ghost

    ghost Member

    Manchester CWS

    I was such a fan of Manchester CWS. Such great names - and Lyndon still appearing at the National Finals 49 years after the great Force of Destiny performance. I have a recording of that famous performance and it is played in almost flawless fashion and at frightening speed. Style of playing in the banding world has undoubtedly changed over the decades - but the quality of this playing is as good as anything you will hear today - and that was performed on pea shooter instruments and within a banding movement which was still not mature and thus lacking in experience and history. I think we have learned so much from CWS and all the other great bands of that era. It saddens me when I hear people writing off bands in those days. The modern sound has built on all the experience of the last few decades. In fact we owe so much to all those players who built up our movement which seems finally to be going global. Yes, CWS was and still is one of the great bands and it is great to celebrate them on this website.
  11. MoominDave

    MoominDave Well-Known Member

    Realised I'd inadvertently counted Leyland's two second section NW area titles...
  12. toby hobson

    toby hobson Member

    It is amazing how bands fade away etc. My old band really, shouldn’t be as successful as they are. 45 mins from any major city. Not had decent sponsorship for years. Never the most fashionable band, in many people’s books, the baddies of the scene for many years. If it wasn’t for a few noticible people who kept it going, stepped in when we were desperate it would of been good night Vienna years ago. But look what patience and commitment has brought. Then you get CWS in the middle of bandings biggest city now defunct. Fairys who have been working so hard to get back to their glorious best, having to rebuild again and again, they have been away from the very best for far too long, plus they have the colleges on their doorstep and a huge name still to attract players. Besses, one of the most famous names in banding, just a stone’s throw away from Salford, Manchester, Bury, Bolton. 5 mins from the tram stop, 2 mins from the motoway, has been allowed to totally rot, let’s hope Wych can get them going again, such a shame a band with a name many non banders would know of to this day..... I wonder how many people will keep travelling miles to play for named bands in the future with things going the way they are with petrol and work commitments. I recon the best brass band in the world could quite easily be formed near my house with everyone living within a 5 or 6 mile radius. Weird really.
  13. 4thmandown

    4thmandown Member

    I heard a story many years ago from Harold Smith, who was a Euph player at Wingates in the 50's that one of the possible reasons for CWS success at the areas was that they hung onto the old high pitch instruments for longer than anyone else. I don't know if this is true, or just a bit of rival band jealousy, but the logic was that it produced a brighter sound.
  14. euphoria

    euphoria Member

    Oh - are you living just north of Bergen, Norway? :D
  15. Mello

    Mello Active Member

  16. Mello

    Mello Active Member

  17. tsawyer

    tsawyer Member

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