Bye's for top 4 to the nationals?

Discussion in 'The Rehearsal Room' started by Grunt, Dec 1, 2003.

  1. Grunt

    Grunt New Member

    Did anyone see a letter in the Bandsman recently (22 Nov) where a former Dyke player suggested that the top 4 bands should not have to compete at the areas?

    Don't know what anyone else thinks but I think that you would only increase the divide between the top 4 and the rest of the banding movement.

    I also think that the organisers of the Yorkshire areas would have something to say if the "star attractions" were taken out of the competition.

    Ultimately qualification for the nationals is a privilege that has to be earnt via the areas, why should the top 4 be any different?
  2. PeterBale

    PeterBale Moderator Staff Member

    The point in question is that these bands have already qualified, by reason of their positions gained at this year's finals. As things stand, they have all the expense of a contest, with probably little motivation to work up a test piece other than local pride. It is not really surprising that occasionally a band in that situation is placed down the field at the Area, causing no little resentment from other bands.

    It was suggested this year that a couple of the pre-qualified bands were willing to hold a joint concert, with the proceeds going to assist some of the lesser lights in the banding movement, that seemed a much more sensible idea to me.
  3. Straightmute

    Straightmute Active Member

    But (...and I'm playing the part of devil's advocate here... :twisted: ) a band's national grading is based soley on their result in the regional contest.

    Scottish and Welsh bands need to compete for the title of Scottish/Welsh Champions and therefore for a place in the European; if they need to compete in the regionals surely it has to be the same for all bands hoping to qualify for the National Finals?

    The Regional Championships need all the money they can get. Every year we hear about poor venues, facilities etc. etc. Takings on the door (at Bradford certainly) reflect the status of the bands taking part - people go to hear Dyke, Grimethorpe, YBS and Brighouse.

    For the 'lower' championship section bands, the regional contest is usually their only chance to compete against those at the very top. Take away those top bands and the quality of the experience for everyone else is considerably lessened.

    End of devilish advocacy!

  4. Accidental

    Accidental Supporting Member

    If bands miss the regionals, what happens to the grading tables?
  5. Mike Saville

    Mike Saville Member

    IMO every band should earn the right to appear at the finals every year - that includes the previous years winners. (If you liken it to the FA Cup every team has to earn the right to be in the final, last years winners don't get there automatically).

    Obviously the top bands would disagree as there is always the 'adjudicator' element which could potentially see them not qualifying for the finals - welcome to the real world lads!! :)
  6. andyp

    andyp Active Member

    I agree, that's the fairest way. Then the best bands at the time go to the finals. Also I'd like to see an end to regional/national gradings, just one set would be enough, at the moment you have bands in (for example) 2nd and 4th sections at the same time and that can't be right. If you go up, you go up and that's it. If you want to play the finals, then you have to do well in the section you're in.
  7. Accidental

    Accidental Supporting Member

    Do you mean regional or local associations? In our area (L&SC/SCABA) the gradings have to be different imo, otherwise at local contests there'd be something like 2 top section bands compared with 15+ 4th section (ish!) I understand your point, but SCABA is healthy and the contests are very good, so I'd say it works pretty well this way.
    (Sorry its bit off topic mods!)
  8. BrassNeil

    BrassNeil New Member

    I beleive that the origonal idea was to try and keep the standard high for the Nationals by implementing the top four rule or its variant. But it certainly could be argued that the whole idea of the competition is for bands to all be entered on an equal footing. The prize though may lose some of its sparkle if less of the "big" bands were competing. Perhaps we can come up with a better system where the stronger areas can have more representation, but then who decides which are the stronger areas and which are the weaker ones??
  9. Must admit i do think it's right that the top 4 at the nationals get invited back, but in my oppinion it is wrong fot them to automatically recieve a joint 1st place in their respective areas. They should have to compete the same as everyone else if not for the chance of an invitation to the nationals then for the fgrading tables. Thes is a chance however remote of a big name band doing badly....just take last year as an example, now dyke gat an automatic joint 1st place so no prospect of them fighting to stay up???
  10. lynchie

    lynchie Active Member

    To create a badly thought out football analogy...

    Why not something similar to the Champions League where the winners get an automatic place but they do not take up a qualification place from their respective league. Therefore they can still be relegated.

    So the top 4 get automaticly to the final, but don't take the chance of qualifying away from another band, and still have to compete for a placing in their area contest to stay up.

    Just a thought!
  11. nicely put, that was what i was trying to say in a roundabout sort of way!
  12. bassinthebathroom

    bassinthebathroom Active Member

    If a band fails to compete at the regionals (I think), they get the lowest place available, plus 1. e.g. 12 bands - 13 points given
  13. Straightmute

    Straightmute Active Member

    Not true. One of the reasons for them taking part in the Areas is to compete for National grading. There's no automatic first place. Dyke's 13th place will keep them on their toes next March I suspect, and best of luck to them.

  14. My appologies missread the ruling....I missed the bit that said "This Is Now Deleted"....silly me!
  15. mutsuj

    mutsuj Member

    Absolutely Straightmute...Dyke now stand on 15 points two first places and that 13th. Will drop one of those points and pick up March's result to aggregate over 3 yrs. Not sure on what the Yorkshire Cham Section 3 yr points system looks like, they are normally in the back of programme......any ideas what results are required in March ???...
  16. Accidental

    Accidental Supporting Member

    Yeah, I know that! I was talking hypothetically about the finals winners - if the rules change so the top 4 don't have to compete at their regionals, then how do they get placed in the grading tables?

    I think that makes sense now?!

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